Marvel vs. DC Battles: Solomon Grundy vs. Sebastian Shaw

[DTM]

Now THAT was a battle. Still incredibly close, though currently "Thor Crusher" Kurse has the lead over "Breaker of Kals Jaw" General Zod.

Next well tone it down just a bit, to a battle of 2 of the best HW level (possibly near SHW level) bruisers of evil from both universes.

Battling with all they have, with all of their strength, skill and power, which of these will be victorious, and which will fall in utter defeart?

Lets hear it for Marvel vs. DC fight #53:


SOLOMON GRUNDY


VS.


SEBASTIAN SHAW


As always, same rules apply, no time to prepare, POOFed from where ever they were, with only what they routinely carry on them, to fight in a Huge 10 mile wide open area (though these characters start roughly 1 mile away from one another) til one team stands and one falls. YOU decide Who.


Previous Results from Marvel vs. DC battles

1. Wonder Woman vs. Hercules: Wonder Woman
2. Doomsday (Hunter/Prey) vs. Thanos: Thanos
3. Ras Al Ghul vs. The Red Skull: Ras Al Ghul
4. Amazo vs. Ultron: Ultron
5. Lobo vs. Gladiator: Lobo
6. Nightwing vs. The Punisher: Punisher
7. Mongul vs. Terrax: Mongul
8. Bane vs. Kraven: Bane
9a. Darkseid vs. Dark Phoenix: Dark Phoenix
9b. Darkseid vs. Morg: Darkseid
10. Lady Shiva vs. Bullseye: Lady Shiva
11a. Kingdom Come Superman vs. The Maestro: KC Superman
11b. Current Day Superman vs. The Maestro: TIE
12. Deathstroke vs. Sabretooth: Deathstroke
13. Captain Marvel vs. Iron Man: Captain Marvel
14. Batgirl vs. Captain America: Captain America
15. Kalibak vs. Abomination: Abomination
16. Orion vs. Beta Ray Thor: Beta Ray Thor
17. Prometheus vs. Deadpool: Deadpool
18. Doomsday vs. The Maestro: The Maestro
19. Captain Marvel vs. Beta Ray Thor: Beta Ray Thor
20. Lobo vs. Ultron: Ultron
21. Kingdom Come Superman vs. Warrior Madness Thor: Warrior Madness Thor
22. Amazo vs. Morg: Morg
23. Lady Shiva vs. Deadpool: Lady Shiva
24. Deathstroke vs. Captain America: Captain America
25. JLA vs. Heralds of Galactus: Heralds of Galactus

**********

26. Sinestro vs. Magneto: Sinestro
27. Batman vs. Cable: Cable
28. The Joker vs The Kingpin: The Kingpin
29. Nightwing vs. Gambit: Nightwing
30. Neron vs. Mephisto: Mephisto
31. Black Adam vs. Ulik: Black Adam
32. Green Arrow vs. Daredevil: Daredevil
33. Green Lantern (Hal Jordan) vs. Thor: Thor
34. Pre Crisis Superman vs. Galactus: Galactus
35. Fernus vs. Onslaught: Onslaught
36. Deathstroke vs. Spider-Man: Spider-Man
37. Mordru vs. Dormmamu: Mordru
38. Power Girl vs. Thing: Power Girl
39. JSA vs. Infinity Watch: Infinity Watch
40. Hawkman vs. Wolverine: Wolverine
41. Wonder Woman vs. Hyperion: Hyperion
42. Starfire vs. Human Torch: Starfire
43. Richard Dragon vs. Shang Chi: Richard Dragon
44a. Lex Luthor (Battle Armor) vs. Dr. Doom (Unthinkable): Dr. Doom
44b. Lex Luthor (Battle Armor) vs. Dr. Doom (Standard Armor): Dr. Doom
45: Etrigan the Demon vs. Ghost Rider: Etrigan the Demon
46. Dr. Mid-Nite vs. Moon Knight: Moon Knight
47. Cyborg vs. Luke Cage: Cyborg
48. Bizarro vs. Count Nefaria: Count Nefaria
49. Mr. Terrific vs. Nick Fury: Mr. Terrific
50. Legion Of Doom vs. Acts Of Vengeance Masterminds: Acts Of Vengeance Masterminds

**********

51. Firestorm vs. Sersi: Sersi
52. General Zod vs. Kurse: Kurse
53. Solomon Grundy vs. Sebastian Shaw: ??????

[The Red Baron]

sabastian shaw is one of the hellfire club guys right, what are his powers

[simhenk]

He gets stronger when you hit him.

I give this one to Shaw as he is smarter then Grundy

[kky101023]

What if Grundy is capable of knocking him out in one punch though?

[Ignatz_Mouse]

Either it's a stalemate, or Shaw.

Grundy can't do anythihng *to* Shaw, and I'm not certain Grundy can be hurt back, either. But Shaw's smart, he'd figure something out.

If not I suppose Grundy might just outlast him. But I give it to Shaw to more than half the time.

[The Red Baron]

well if thats the case how strong is shaw when the fight begans, if isnt that strong then grundy

[Magnito]

Grundy will start stronger, but one punch isn't enough to take Shaw out. Shaw is also incredably intellegent, as oppose to Grundy who is deffinatly not. My vote...
SEBASTIAN SHAW

[Goose]

Grundy wins this, he can knock superman through a loop, i dont think shaw can do the same. It would only take a shot or two for grundy to knock out shaw, long before shaw gets up enough in strength to be able to take out Grundy.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Shaw can be overloaded - as we've seen multiple times - by enough kinetic force (and he can't turn off his absorption power either). Grundy's strength is more than capable of causing the "explosive build-up". On the other hand, Shaw's strength isn't going to be enough to harm the essentially invulnerable, unliving and unfeeling Grundy.

Vote: Solomon Grundy

[JKLantern]

Shaw absorbs kinetic energy and gets stronger.

Grundy punches, releasing kinetic energy.

I'd say Shaw. No matter how much I like the big swamp zombie.

[kky101023]

Ok, my vote is for Shaw. I was thinking that Grundy may be able to take Shaw out in one shot, but since that's not the case, then not only will Shaw be able to get on par with Grundy physically, but will still have a severe intelligence advantage. I'm thinking Shaw would realize that Grundy is pretty much invulnerable/immortal, so would concentrate on ways to trick/incap Grundy.:grin:

[DTM]

For those that dont know Shaw, yes was the Black King in the Hellfire Club and he does absorb kinetic energy (even Storms lighning, Cyclops' blasts and such) and it makes him stronger and tougher.

One punch, even from Superman, I doubt would KO him. He keeps getting stronger and tougher until he overloads, which can happen though not easily. He managed to battle Magneto in an area with LOADS of scrap metal around and while he lost, he did amazingly well.

Now the question is, can Grundy take the onslaught of Shaws ever increasing power long enough for him to overload and KO his enemy. It does happen, but its at a high level. On the other hand, not sure Shaws brains are going to help too much here as theres nothing here to plan around or with. Its essentially a big open area, and the 2 combatants.

Grundy can certainly win by overloading Shaw, but will he be able to do so before Shaws ever increasing strength KOs Grundy in return?


Solomon Grundy - 2 votes
Sebastian Shaw - 5 votes

[Maniac_nmt]

Originally posted by Ignatz_Mouse
Either it's a stalemate, or Shaw.

Grundy can't do anythihng *to* Shaw, and I'm not certain Grundy can be hurt back, either. But Shaw's smart, he'd figure something out.

If not I suppose Grundy might just outlast him. But I give it to Shaw to more than half the time.

Well, given that Batman dusted up Grundy pretty good with just brass knuckles. Shaw should take him in what isn't a fair fight.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Don't know if it matters or not but the old Marvel RPG - which I know isn't "full canon" but is still popular guidelines - had Shaw overload after absorbing just over 100 pts. of damage if he didn't release it in-between (i.e.: he could take one Unearthly strike and then would overload on the next).

The version of Grundy that lost to Batman was a weaker version. The problem with Grundy is that he's essentially a "split personality" - a different personality with different strength levels takes over with each "reincarnation". So, yes, there was the weak Grundy in the Loeb stories but there is also the uber-Grundy that demolished the JSA back in the days of "All-Star Comics".

[sundown12]

When Shaw absorbs the Kinetic Energy of Grundy's punches, doesn't that then mean that there's no real force behind the punches? If Grundy swings and hits Shaw but Shaw takes away the Kinetic Energy, Grundy might as well be hitting him with a feather.

I vote for Shaw. We need this guy in the next set!

[Ignatz_Mouse]

Originally posted by Maniac_nmt
Well, given that Batman dusted up Grundy pretty good with just brass knuckles. Shaw should take him in what isn't a fair fight.

Grundy varies wildly in power levels in the comics. Green Arrow took him out once too-- other times, hes stood there and traded blows with Superman. I'm considering this top-level Grundy.

(The Starman series did explain the inconsistencies, as Grundy is always being re-animated).

[St-Dumas]

Sebby is definately smarter and more durable. Grundy is stronger and has a cooler name (Have you ever seen a jewish zombie? I don't think so!) I'll give it to Shaw.

[deadalus13]

I vote for Shaw. While, it is possible to overload him, that would be incredibly difficult in this situation, since he will be discharging some of his absorbed energy every time he hits Grundy. Also, Shaw has the advantage in combat prowess as well as intelligence.

[DTM]

I think Im voting Grundy here.

As durable and strong as top level Grundy is, Shaw wouldnt be able to hurt him too much until he himself was close to overload, meaning when he has absorbed enough energy to give him the strength needed to really rock Grundys world.

True Shaw wont be taking any damage until the point of overload (strange character, he doesnt seem to take damage, just gets stronger and stronger until POOF, hes KOed) but Grundy wont be too hurt either because again, Shaw will need to be at close to his highest levels to significantly damage Grundy.

If Shaw used superior fighting skills to outmanuver and outfight Grundy, I could surely see him taking it (as I dont see Grundy as a skilled fighter), but in a slugfest brawl, they will pound on one another, Shaw will get strong enough to Really Hurt Grundy, but not KO him fast enough for Grundy to cause him to overload and KO Shaw.

My Vote - Solomon Grundy (if its proven Shaw is in fact an expertly trained fighter, and fights his battles as such, then I could see myself switching this vote)

[DTM]

Sebastian Shaw - 9 votes
Solomon Grundy - 3 votes

[Rando]

I vote for Shaw

In Shaw's first appearance he manhandled Colossus, takeing multiple hits and not careing in the slightest. I don't think Grundy is a whole lot more powerful than Colussus especially if he loses to Batman and Green Arrow in fist fights from time to time, so Shaw should be able to keep his power levels under control while returning damage of his own. Heck I remeber Shaw takeing a hit off of Holocaust (definently a SHW) and still beign just fine and able to give back damage, so he should be able to keep this fight under control, especialy with his martial arts knowledge and superior intelligence.

[lobodragon]

I have to give this one to Shaw. He should be releasing the stored erergy with his blows almost as quickly as he absorbs them. Grundy is togh bt the beating by blows that just get stronger will take him down.

[Mr_Clicky]

I'll vote Shaw, this is a perfect fight for him due to his main power being to absorb kinetic energy and that's mainly what ol' Grundy will be giving him in great supply.

He's also smarter, which I think will be a big factor here!

[MadHatter]

Sebastian Shaw. G. Arrow choked out Grundy with a bowstring once, didn't he?

[phantom1592]

Shaw definetly. He can handle what colossus throws at him without batting an eyelid, so he can take Grundys punches.

IF he's in danger of overloading, he'll be smart enough to change tactics. I believe the brains are what win this fight.

[The Red Baron]

I think this is alot closer than people think, grundy at his top form is like a non flying bizzaro, he has enough power to take out shaw, my vote grundy who was born on monday and got sick on tuesday and whatever

[Magnito]

it was
Soloman Grundy
born on a monday
christened on tuesday
married on wednesday
took ill on thursday
got worce on friday
died on a saturday
burried on sunday
that was the end of Soloman Grundy...or was it?;)

[Q99]

Grundy's power varies wilding with his different incarnations. Most of the time, he's a HW of some sort, only occasionally being able to fight Superman as a SHW or being reduced to a MW (which some of his nicer forms tend to be). Recently Green Arrow took out Grundy, but that required a hell of a lot of effort (pretty much his entire quiver, plus slowly sawing through his neck, which btw is wood like the rest of him, with his bowstring and 110lbs+ pull strength).

Short of some uber-grundy (like the one that showed up in JLU, powered up by chaos magic), Shaw wins this one easily. Grundy only has kinetic energy, as well as next to no brains, while Shaw is smart and, while he can't kill Grundy, he can send him to his next incarnation with enough hurting, let alone a plan.

[GoldenAge]

The last time we saw Grundy he ripped the head off of the Statue of Liberty, painted a smiley face on it and threw it into the center of Manhattan.

However, J.J. Thunder’s Lightning Bolt killed that incarnation of Grundy when he was ordered to enter Grundy and burn him from the inside out.

Essentially Grundy can't be defeated, only delayed as a new manifestation is resurrected. However, in this style of fight I think a beaten and broken Shaw will be smart enough to rip off Grundy's arm, essentially winning the fight.

[TaprootGft]

yeah you really need to define which Grundy this is, because each time Grundy comes back his powers are different, there have been times when Grundy went toe to toe with Superman and other times where a group of cops could take him......... so are we speaking up Grundy in his strongest form, weakest? or somewhere in between?

[Perfectstorm]

I would consider him in what he is normally shown as. I would put him below thing. So he is strong, but he isnt throwing buildings at people.

Either Way, Shaw thrives agasint this type of person. That and Grudys durability applys alot to peircing things like bullets and Strait bashing, like firsts, but i can see Shaw getting him and tearing off body parts. A few good shots and a couple twists will take out Grundy for the time being

[DTM]

Originally posted by TaprootGft
yeah you really need to define which Grundy this is, because each time Grundy comes back his powers are different, there have been times when Grundy went toe to toe with Superman and other times where a group of cops could take him......... so are we speaking up Grundy in his strongest form, weakest? or somewhere in between?

Well, the Grundy I was thinking of is him being a sort of Hulk-lite. (Surely I wouldnt put someone who could lost to Cops, Green Arrow or Batman against someone who could throw Colossus around with ease) I was thinking highish end Grundy here.

[Gorrack]

I'll vote Shaw here, but not by a large margin. Grundy is VERY durable and actually could take this fight occasionally, but Shaw is smarter and is pretty well trained ( Not exceedingly high, but all of the Hellfire Club have a good deal of finese to them and are trained. ) and should be able to take him out. Closer fight than it is getting credit for, and I rarely try to act like matches are close.

[TaprootGft]

yeah to close to call, they both get really tired after beating the heck out of each other say screw it and go get a beer together....... TIE