Supermen vs. Marvel Family

[gladiator1518]

Cyborg Superman
Eradicator
Superboy

vs.

Captain Marvel
Mary Marvel
Captain Marvel Jr.

NO PREP. Fight to the death or KO or 10 second incapacitation.

[TheFreak]

I would say then the Supes team. Supes himself would be take out pretty quick (Marv has taken him out) But the Cyborg himself would be able to build something to incap the kids, then the Eradicator would take the Big Red Cheese.

[gladiator1518]

Originally posted by TheFreak
I would say then the Supes team.Supes himself would be take out pretty quick (Marv has taken him out) But the Cyborg himself would be able to build something to incap the kids, then the Eradicator would take the Big Red Cheese. I don't want this to turn into ANOTHER Superman vs. Captain Marvel debate, but when the hell did Captain Marvel EVER take Superman out other than when he "sucker Punched" him? He's never beaten him post-crisis in a FAIR fight as far as I know. Captain Marvel is Superman's equal at best, not superior. Yes, he has an advantage fighting Superman hand to hand because of magic but that in no way assures him of an automatic victory. You just had to say that didn't you? Forcing me to correct you and now GoldenAge is gonna dispute what I say here and this thread will turn into another Supes vs. CM debate that goes on for 8 pages or more. Thanks alot for ruining this thread. *wink*.














Just kidding. For some reason the winkie smilie isn't working.

[gladiator1518]

Captain Marvel MIGHT be able to win , but only after a very long battle. CM would NOT "take him out quick". That's just ludicrous. I hope you don't really believe that.

[tchipley]

The only way that CM is gonna win is because DC is going to try to hard push the property this is Captain Marvel. They made a mistake many many years ago when they could have pushed him hard to the public and made him Supes equal and nobody would dispute it. It's just a bit late now and very suspicious.

Superman isn't supposed to be able to be beaten* (Doomsday aside.)

Captain Marvel, Magic and Kryptonite are there to show everyone there is a possiblity that he can be beat. Makes superman human and easier for us to relate to.





* As long as he isn't mind controlled, under the influence of Red Kyrptonite or gone rogue in some other fashion.

[Doc_Twilight]

Um, the Superman team has people all comparable power level to Superman and and Captain Marvel.

Mary Marvel and Captain Marvel are on the Black Adam Power level, which is a little weaker.

Not to mention with all three of them there, at once, it means thier power is seperated 3 ways.

The marvel family is like, screwed. Big Time.

[gladiator1518]

Originally posted by Doc_Twilight
Um, the Superman team has people all comparable power level to Superman and and Captain Marvel.

Mary Marvel and Captain Marvel are on the Black Adam Power level, which is a little weaker.

Not to mention with all three of them there, at once, it means thier power is seperated 3 ways.

The marvel family is like, screwed. Big Time. LOL. OK. Let's change it to the Marvel family vs. just Superboy. Is that pretty fair?

[Doc_Twilight]

Um, the one line in my post should read Captain Marvel Jr. Not Captain Marvel. I'm sure you all know which line it is. :P

[Doc_Twilight]

"LOL. OK. Let's change it to the Marvel family vs. just Superboy. Is that pretty fair?"


LOL! Which SuperBoy? Current or Pre-Crisis?

Pre-Crisis can travel through time under his own power, by the way. :laugh:

[gladiator1518]

Current, of course.

[Doc_Twilight]

Alright, well the Marvel Family can take on the current Superboy, pretty easily. :P

[Parallax_LE9]

OK, I'm going to have to say the Super family.

REASON:
Marvels have their powers from Shazam. Problem: when more than one of them is using the powers, they share them. Cap= 100%
Cap and Mary, Cap= 50 Mary =50
Cap, Mary, Jr= 33% each.
Straight out of DC Encyclopedia.

[Q99]

If all three Marvels are at full power, they win. Billy can definitely hold off Cyborg and then some, one of the others can hold of Eradicator, and the third will trounce Superboy in no time and then it's 3 Vs. 2.


The Superman Team has 2 people at Superman level, and one at noticably less (he'll eventually reach it, but he's still well below). The Marvel team has one at Superman level, and two at slightly less. And, unlike the Superman team, all three are excellent at teamwork, whereas Eradicator and Cyborg are not too much team players, and while Con-el can be, he won't with those two. So superior teamwork and strong power will win the day (heck, even with Power sharing, they'll still take out SB soon, and every time one goes down, the remaining Marvels/Marvel gets stronger).

[Doc_Twilight]

Dude, The eradicator and Cyborg Superman don't even have Superman's natural vunarability to magic, ( I assume as much, considering neither's powers are kryptonian in nature, like Superman's) not to mention they are totally remorseless. They hose the Marvel kids, and will probably take on Captain Marvel together.

Superboy gets totally taken down though. He's screwed.

[CarlosMucha]

only Kal El vs this 3 big cheese guys (and girl) Superman is K.O.

But this 3 Supermen vs The Shazam family, for sure the Superman wins.

Cyborg is a bad guy, and Erradicator is a badass guy what do werever must do for win, the Shazam family is just too kind.

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by gladiator1518
Captain Marvel is Superman's equal... Yes, he has an advantage fighting Superman hand to hand because of magic... GoldenAge is gonna dispute what I say here...

Why would I dispute such wisdom? ;)

I'll just repeat what I've said before...

Captain Marvel HAS won the majority of fights between he and Superman. Were some of them cheap shots or surprise maneuvers? Sure... But can you name me anyone else that can take Superman down and out in two punches? I don't care what the circumstances are, surprise or otherwise, even Doomsday couldn't do that.

[Q99]

only Kal El vs this 3 big cheese guys (and girl) Superman is K.O.

But this 3 Supermen vs The Shazam family, for sure the Superman wins.

Cyborg is a bad guy, and Erradicator is a badass guy what do werever must do for win, the Shazam family is just too kind.

Note, Superman isn't actually on the Supermen team, and all three of the Marvels are a lot stronger than Superboy.

This is going to end up Captain Marvel Vs. Cyborg while CM3 and Mary doubleteam and trounce Eradicator after one of them has pegged Superboy.


And, while the baddies don't have a specific vunerability to magic (well, maybe Eradicator. Wasn't his body made by imitating Clark's to an extent?), nor do they have any particular edge, and any of the Marvel's lightning is going to be extra good against Cyborg, and neither Cyborg or Eradicator are quite as physically strong as Superman (and Cyborg's significantly less durable. He can re-create his body and morph, but it's not too hard to blow off limbs and the like).

[Iscariot]

I doubt either would just 'peg' superboy. Everyone seems to be underrating poor conner. He and Cap marvel jr. fought in the teen titans futre issue thing and Superboy seemed stronger.

besides, Cyborg Supes is INSANELY powerful. He kept being destroyed and he kept coming back. An Alien Tribunal tossed him into a black hole and he still came back. His pysical form was completely destroyed by paralax on the source wall... and guess what he still came back. I wonder how Marvel's lightning would stop him.

I vote for the supers. Captain marvel and his magic little family are gonna get pwned by Cyborg supes. Oh yeah and which eradicator are you using?

[Q99]

I doubt either would just 'peg' superboy. Everyone seems to be underrating poor conner. He and Cap marvel jr. fought in the teen titans futre issue thing and Superboy seemed stronger.

Yea, but Conner was way stronger then, clearly physically improved and with TK at range the current one can't match, or indeed do except in minor ways (in fact, that was the reason he was winning- CM3 was TK blocked before close range and thus couldn't hit him to have the magic advantage. As soon as the past Conner broke the TK with heat vision, CM3 had the clear edge).

CM3 would've gotten at most a moderate boost to CM's level.

He kept being destroyed and he kept coming back.

Keep in mind, they don't have to destroy him to win. Note that pretty much every time he's been destroyed, he's been out for awhile unless there's something for him to jump to, and there's nothing to jump to here. If Captain Marvel destroys his body here, he's out, even if he's not dead.

[Iscariot]

I still just don't see Superboy being swept aside easily. Superboy should be atleast able to fight captain marvel junior
he'd probably lose but I don't think it would be an easy fight.

Eradicator would easily beat mary marvel, yeah he's kinda clonish of superman but he doesn't have the weakness to kryptonite so why would have weakness to magic? So he's on superman's level and mary doesn't have the magic advantage. If anyone gets swept aside it's her.

Why can't the cyborg use all of his powers? After he gets blown up The marvel family will just have to wait...

And even if you don't count his reforming himself Cyborg superman should be on par with captain marvel. the dude can fight superman and won't be vulnerable to magic. (especially with marvel at a third of his power).

[Q99]

I still just don't see Superboy being swept aside easily. Superboy should be atleast able to fight captain marvel junior
he'd probably lose but I don't think it would be an easy fight.


I think you're underestimating how tough CM3 and Mary are. They still have the full Marvel suite, just at somewhat reduced levels, and CM3's not close to as much a 'rookie' Superhero as Conner is. He's getting better, but he's still fairly new to the game, whereas CM3... hmm, if you've seen Outsiders, there's a good example of him in a fight. He was taking on a serious powerhouse who was brawling with most of a superteam (with dirty fighting on both sides. Marvels don't hold back when they know they have to fight).

Also, Conner doesn't have Superspeed yet. Freddie does.


Eradicator would easily beat mary marvel, yeah he's kinda clonish of superman but he doesn't have the weakness to kryptonite so why would have weakness to magic? So he's on superman's level and mary doesn't have the magic advantage. If anyone gets swept aside it's her.


Remember, Superman's only 'weak to magic' in the sense that he's not uber-resistant to it like he is everything else. Most stuff is weak to magic in that sense, he's not weak because he's specifically Kryptonian, just weak because he has no resistance. Plus, magic invunerability is shown to have some advantages over conventional invunerability as well (as shown when Captain Marvel survived being temporarily turned inside out last JLA).

And Mary is quite capable of putting up a huge fight against someone Superman level. She'd probably lose in the end against Eradicator, but, she's not that much below him, she can fight Black Adam for awhile (and then mainly due to his fighting experiance, their overall power is close) and toasted Captain Atom when she let loose, both of whom are Superman class.


The two 'lesser' Marvels aren't as strong as CM, but they're still absolutely nothing to sneeze at, even for Superman level opponents. They're noticably closer to Eradicator than Conner is to them, and again there's the teamwork thing. Team Supermen will have none, Team Marvel not only is great at it but has the wisdom of solomon on their side.

If they pair up, it'll soon be 3 on 2, if they don't, the Marvels fight as a unit while the Supermen fight as individuals. Either way, I see the Marvels winning more often than not.

[gladiator1518]

Originally posted by GoldenAge
I'll just repeat what I've said before...

Captain Marvel HAS won the majority of fights between he and Superman. Were some of them cheap shots or surprise maneuvers? Sure... But can you name me anyone else that can take Superman down and out in two punches? I don't care what the circumstances are, surprise or otherwise, even Doomsday couldn't do that. *Sigh*. Here we go again. I'll just repeat what I said before. "Cheap shots" and "surprise manuevers" don't count as a fair fight. Give me JUST ONE example where Captain Marvel clearly beat Superman post-crisis IN A FAIR FIGHT. The two FAIR battles I've seen between them Superman won both. They are Kingdom Come and one of Superman's annuals that happened during the Eclipso: The Darkness Within series. Sure Kingdom Come Superman was more powerful than regular Superman, but at least it was a fair fight. In the Eclipso series Superman was mind controlled but it was still a fair fight and the eclipsed Superman clearly beat Marvel.

It's also MY OPINION that CM isn't the only character that can KO Superman with a couple of "cheap shots". I'm sure Doomsday, Darkseid, Lobo, and others could do it as well.

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by gladiator1518
It's also MY OPINION that CM isn't the only character that can KO Superman with a couple of "cheap shots". I'm sure Doomsday, Darkseid, Lobo, and others could do it as well.

But they haven't... Only Captain Marvel has. ;)

[deadalus13]

"The two FAIR battles I've seen between them Superman won both. They are Kingdom Come and one of Superman's annuals that happened during the Eclipso: The Darkness Within series."

They also fought in the first story arc of Batman/Superman. The battle was actual decided off panel between two issues, but it was clear that Supes won.

[GoldenAge]

What's fair about Kingdom Come Superman???:confused:

An unchanged and brainwashed Captain Marvel beat the snot outta the Mega-powerful, supercharged Superman until Supes got smart and tricked the mentally retarded Captain into changing back into Billy. In the end Superman coundn't stop Marvel from throwing him to the ground and replacing him as he flew to detonate the bomb (unless you subscribe to the theory that Superman punked out and LET Billy take the hit - not likely).

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by deadalus13
They also fought in the first story arc of Batman/Superman. The battle was actual decided off panel between two issues, but it was clear that Supes won.

Obviously Hawkman and Marvel were working with Batman and Superman. Why? Because Marvel's costume is part of his magical aspect. Superman would have never been able to take it away without Marvel's cooperation. Superman HAD to say he beat them up in order to keep the JSA's rap sheet clean.

That's one big flaw in Kingdom Come too. Cap's cape should have vanished with Cap... but it was a nice sentiment, so I'm fine with it.