View Full Version : TV Cartoon Battles: Mixed Teams TOC: Round 1, Match 5
The First Quarter Of Round 1 of the TV Cartoon Mixed Team TOC is CLOSED. Some great and close matches there, as well as some slaughters and blow outs. Lets just see what these next 4 matches look like.
With pretty much the same rules as with all of my TOCs, except this time:
The terrain has been enlarged to 40 miles wide, as always, protected by a force field of the strongest power to prevent characters from escaping or flying their foes to the sun.
Team will now have a 10 minute "Planning Stage" where each team can talk and prep amongst themsevles against the opposing team. Characters may NOT leave their immediate area during this time and no powers, spells,etc. can be used. This is a planning, sharing information stage only.
Now without further adieu, allow me to present your next battle in a BRAND NEW (aka: OLD, OLD, OLD) type of Tournament Of Champions:
TEAM TIAMAT - The Phantom (Defenders Of The Earth), Peter Pan (Peter Pan And The Pirates), Rick Hunter & Veritech Fighter (Robotech), Tiamat (Dungeons & Dragons)
VS.
TEAM VOLTRON (LION FORM) - Iria (Iria), Hercules (Disney) (Hercules), Charizard (Pokemon), Voltron (Lion Form) (Voltron)
As always, same rules apply, no time to prepare, POOFed from where ever they were, with only what they routinely carry on them AND/OR routinely used in their shows, to fight in a Large area til one stands and one falls. YOU decide Who.
Randomly Chosen Area:
Jungle Ruins - Lush, verdant trees rise over the jungle floor below. Thick vines crisscross the canopy. A large, ruined city complex sits in the center. It's fantastic masonry eroded by rain and time. In the middle it is bisected by a large, placid river flowing in at one end of the arena, and leaving through the other. (Inspired by: Tarzan, Jungle Book, etc)
Thanks all, and enjoy.
And REMEMBER, if youre not sure who someone is here, ASK. Theres PLENTY of people here who can tell you most anything youd like to know. Thanks again.
ALSO, please do your best to respect everyones votes, reasonings and opinions here. If you believe your character should win, but doesnt in the end, dont hold grudges against the character that beat yours, or call the votes that allowed this to happen "fanboy" arguments or plain and simply wrong. We all have our own way of thinking and voting here, with each one of our thoughts and ideas as valid as your own. Lets do what we can, even in the heat of an argument, to respect that. Thanks.
TV CARTOON TOURNAMENT OF CHAMPIONS Part 5
ROUND 1
Team He-Man vs. Team Imhotep: Team He-Man (12 - 10)
Team Superion vs. Team Gundam Deathscythe: Team Superion (13 - 1)
Team Venger vs. Team Sailor Saturn: Team Venger (10 - 0)
Team Dracula vs. Team Wiseman: Team Wiseman (8 - 6)
Team Tiamat vs. Team Voltron (Lion Form): ??????
14 Down, 2 To Go
I actually think that I'm going to vote for team Voltron.
unlike most of the wizards Tiamat can't really get at the pilots, she's too big to fit in the cockpit. I think that Voltron can beat Tiamat in a throw down pretty readily, I mean he beats on monsters that are much larger than her, and most of them go down to his big sword pretty readily, Tiamat can be pulled down by normal guys with swords. Rick Hunter would whoop on Charizard but once Voltron runs up on him he's hosed. I think Iria would murder Peter Pan, she is an astronomically better shot than anyone he has ever fought and her weapons are tons more effective than Hook and his pirates. In addition Iria has murdered stuff far more dangerous than Pete or anything he has ever fought (in fact probably more dangerous than Pete and everything he's ever fought at once). That leaves Phantom to fight Hercules, Phantom would run Herc ragged but, at the end of the day Phantom is a normal guy with no weapons beating on one of if not the physically toughest middle weight, so Herc is not really in any danger.
Voting Team Tiamat here -
They are going to switch off who they are fighting and Timat will be able to make quick work of the LW, MW, and HW. That leaves a 4-1 battle against Voltron, and with enough magic (Voltron's weakness here), Voltron will go down. I can see Peter Pan riding Tiamat or providing distractions with his shadow. Hunter will be able to help take down iria and Herc with no problem either. Team Tiamat to round 2!
is magic Voltron's weakness? It's been a while but I seem to recall that most of Voltron's foes were magically based monsters. I dunno how Tiamat is gonna be takeing time to kill Voltron's team while Voltron is standing right there to whale on her but at the end of the day who cares? Phantom has fists and Peter Pan has a knife, they are utterly irrelevant to Voltron, not even worthy distractions (and again Peter Pan's equally powerless shadow has a mind of it's own it is not dependable). Rick's weapons are pretty much irrelevant to Voltron as well. The 4 on 1 is pretty much still just a 1 on 1.
Prof. Aragorn
04/11/2005, 15:45
Feh, Heracles has been known to tackle things like Tiamat on occasion. Usually he needs the help of his allies, but he's got others. Besides, Iria's on the team, and since for some reason a ranged team lost to a rangeless team she's the next best thing to Spike.
Hercules and especially Iria are going to be big threats to the other team's LW and MW. Heck, Iria's laser rifle can probably damage the Veritech, which doesn't have good armor.
Charizard's not much good against Rick, but he is quite capable of threatening the others.
As for Voltron Vs. Tiamat... well, pretty much nothing can stop the blazing sword and Voltron has the armor to take some breath weaponage (at least one head, the gas head, is in fact totally irrelivent as well). It'll get some damage first, but the sword causes massive damage (I mean seriously, it's sliced through ships many times bigger than Voltron as well as magical beasts, robots, etc. all the size of Voltron and Voltron is, I believe, the same size or a bit bigger than Tiamat) and since Voltron can close quickly, it'll take her out.
My vote: Team Voltron. Voltron beats Tiamat solo, and then Rick and the others with the rest of the team. The LW/MW here are really useless for Tiamat, and Iria actually has the firepower to affect a fighter.
deadalus13
04/11/2005, 15:54
I vote for team Tiamat.
I think that Rick takes out Charizard pretty fast, and then eliminates the LW and MW from Voltron's team. He can then try to help take out Voltron. He will not last very long but will at least be a momentary distraction and might even do a little damage before he falls. This fight comes down to Voltron vs Tiamat. You have five people working as a team to pilot a massive mech against five heads that share one mind. Tiamat is smarter and much older than Voltron's crew. Voltron has better range but Tiamat can teleport to get close enough to eliminate that advantage. Tiamat might not be able to teleport inside Voltron, but that doesn't prevent her from targeting the pilots. She can fire three or four of her breath weapons while casting spells with her other heads to take out the pilots.
The Phantom and Peter have no chance against Iria and Herc. Charzard losses to Rick, and Voltron and Tiamat battle to a tie. Iria and Herc take out Rick, (I think he will take down one of them, though I'm not sure who), Voltron stll fighting the dragon.
So we are left with
Tiamat
vs.
Voltron and Iria or Herc.
Either way, the extra help will tip it in Voltron's favor. My vote...
TEAM VOLTRON (LION FORM)
SpakSpang
04/11/2005, 16:00
TEAM VOLTRON:
I am voting Team Voltron. Charzard and Voltron switch opponents for awhile until VOltron easily takes out Rick Hunter.
Next them two work together against Tiamat.
I also don't see Iris or Hercules having a problem with their respective weightclass opponents.
deadalus13
04/11/2005, 16:24
"Iria and Herc take out Rick"
Can Iria fly? I don't see either of these being able to get the drop on a very fast very mobile flying opponent with much greater range than either of them.
"Charzard and Voltron switch opponents for awhile until VOltron easily takes out Rick Hunter."
If they are switching opponents, then Charizard gets dropped by Tiamat. Or actually, Tiamat ignores Charizard, who can't hurt her anyway, and attacks Voltron while he is focused on Rick.
The battle between the SHW will not be an easy victory no matter who wins. Voltron's teammates, on the other hand, can be taken down by Rick Hunter by himself. He outranges all of them and has the speed to keep his distance until they are finished off. If anyone is going to get help in this battle, it will be Tiamat.
Can Iria fly? I don't see either of these being able to get the drop on a very fast very mobile flying opponent with much greater range than either of them.
Why would she need to? She has sensors and long range weaponry. She engaged air targets from the ground in the show with success.
Actually, being on the ground and thus not on radar (jungle ruins and all), she should have a lot greater effective range, since it'll be hard to find her except by looking at where the fire is originating from.
This is an excellent terrain for hiding from aircraft, which helps Voltron's crew.
Rick also can't see them. They are in a jungle. Hercules may not be all that stealthy, but Iria absolutely is, and her weapon of choice (though hardly her only one) is a high powered futuristic rifle. Rick may out range them in a field, not in this cover rich terrain, especially with the very finite supply of explosives that he has at his disposal.
Team Tiamat wins this one. Magic alone will do a good job at eleminating the lower power level guys on Voltrons team. Tiamat is just too good to be dropped by the likes of this team.
Rokk_Krinn
04/11/2005, 16:55
Originally posted by Q99
As for Voltron Vs. Tiamat... well, pretty much nothing can stop the blazing sword
Except that Tiamat can go etheral at will. The sword's nasty damage but if it's passing through her as if she isn't there, it's moot. Easiest way to think of it is that Tiamat esssentially has Shadowcat's phasing powers and I don't see Kitty getting hacked all the time (except in the ubiquitous What-If? comic scenes where Logan kills her accidentally and then goes berserk like, oh, every third issue :) ).
iria over phantom.
i don't think herc will ever touch pan, and pan can't hurt herc.
the veritech will make short work of charizard.
and tiamat can take voltron... or at the very least hold him off until rick comes to help out.
then it's a simple matter of tiamat taking care of the lw and mw.
i'll vote for team tiamat.
protectorate
04/11/2005, 18:30
Okay, with the exception of Phantom, Team Tiamat all fly. So Rick, Tiamat, and Pan all take to the air first thing.
The Phantom's whole job is to keep Iria (the bigger threat) busy, if not to take her out completely. Likely Hercules will be guarding Iria, but since this is the younger, still in training Hercules, it's likely that Phantom will be able to get rid of him for a few minutes while he fights with Iria. Phantom doesn't have to win this fight, he just has to keep Iria busy while Rick and Tiamat are fighting Voltron and Charizard.
Pan may even be there to assist.
Rick and Tiamat ignore Charizard as he is basically incapable of damaging either one (Short of trying a suicidal head on collision with the Veritech), but Pan would be more than happy to spar with the little dragon. That's assuming Rick doesn't spend a half second's concentration to lob off a single missile that wastes Charizard instantly. If Rick takes out Charizard, Pan keeps Hercules busy so Phantom and Iria can go at it.
Voltron is powerful, but compared to the speed of a veritech, very slow. Also, most of it's weapons are relatively short range. The only attacks I remember are the sword, and shooting off the hand/feet heads of the lions. Honestly I don't see either of those attacks ever hitting Rick, though Tiamat will have more trouble trying to dodge.
Rick's attacks SHOULD affect Voltron. Remember that the weaponry of the Veritech fighters was shown to blast through the armor of capital ships. Voltron's armor should not be that much more powerful. Also, Rick can perform precision targeting at extremely high speed.
With Tiamat engaging
If Tiamat engages Voltron from the front, Rick should have plenty of opportunity to pick a target (say, the head or cockpit) and start pounding on Voltron with missiles, high velocity cannon, and lasers. If He targets cockpits he can take out the swordarm first (perhaps before Voltron has had time to summon or use the sword) then move on to other targets. He can also take advantage of any holes in Voltrons armor that Tiamat creates.
Any victory for Voltron's team hinges on Voltron taking Tiamat out of the fight. Since any hope of Voltron's team winning rests on Voltron taking out Tiamat, once Voltron is down from the combined abilities of the Tiamat/Rick Hunter team, Tiamat turns and lays waste to the arena. Sure, Phantom will die too, but Tiamat is evil and just wouldn't care.
Team Tiamat for the win.
All flight, one of the most powerful magic users in the tournament, and a very fast mecha....Tiamat to take this one. While Phantom and Peter won't add anything to the victroy, I bet Tiamat could take Voltron and Rick can beat the rest.
Team Tiamat!
I have to vote for Voltron here, as I'll be quite honest, nothing in the D&D world is REMOTELY on par with the damage hi tech weaponry like Voltron has. If your telling me a +5 Long Sword will hurt Timat, but a giant energy blade won't mess her up HARD than your absolutely wrong. Plus Ethereal is often damaged by energy based attacks as it is, so I don't feel that is much of a matter.
For instance, a Fireball will still damage a ethereal creature. Try and debate that a fireball is more powerful than Voltrons blade. Plus, weapons with bonuses to attack also damage Ethereal creatures. I have no reason to believe that Tiamat going ethereal would prevent Voltron from damaging her.
On a related note, does she go ETHEREAL, or does she cast GASEOUS FORM? As there is a HUGE difference. Ethereal means she is, in actuality, on the Ethereal Plane of existance, thus not in the arena, a feat I am pretty sure is illegal. The concept in D*D behind going ethereal is that the caster exists on the Ethereal plane but travels to the Prime Material Plane and can attack on there. The process of doing this violates the rules of the competition as well.
As for being Gaseous,Formed, your not allowed to attack, cast spells, and you gain a reduction to magic damage of 10. Nothing about it prevents you from dealing damage to them. I just looked up the spell in the current Players Handbook, as well as the same for what it says on Ethereal nature.
In addition, all spells and breathe weapons available to Tiamat are still nothing compared to the weapons Voltron is exposed to continually in combat. In D&D, Tiamat can be killed with a bunch of swords at a high enough level. These swords would not even damage Voltron. The level of power is on an almost totally different scale.
Golems in D&D are incredibly powerful and hard to damage. These are stone golems even. Steel golems are even tougher. Now imagine Voltron. Its not even close. In pure damage and in pure endurance, Voltron massacre's Tiamat, and probably her whole team.
Vote- Voltron
Rokk_Krinn
04/11/2005, 20:58
She actually goes etheral but just like Nightcrawler can "Bamf" in these tournaments, as long as she doesn't actually "leave" the arena (i.e. - she's there but just "out of phase") it's perfectly legal last I checked.
As for "energy attacks" affecting etheral creatures, not always and not usually. Certain ones like Wall of Force can block off an etheral creature, but they're not affected by fireballs (unless you're talking 3rd edition which isn't relevant).
Can't Tiamat (as I remember the arguments for beating Mew Two) just teleport in, and start attacking from behind? Or teleport out if things get hairy?
lion form voltron is just like adam west batman. That fool can pull anything out and use it. Plus voltron routinely deals with fighting gigantic magical monsters and voltrons power is magical in nature(if i remember right). Going etheral would still destroy the d and d dragon and nothing else on that team can come close to hurting voltron.
My vote voltron.
My vote goes to Team Tiamat, primarily due to Team Voltrons WAY LOW END HW in Charizard.
Rick Hunter could handle his opposing teams LW, MW and HW all by himself, with relative ease (sorry I dont see LW Iria weapons handling the HW beast that is Rick Hunter, and as mentioned before his onboard sensors will help in keeping an eye on his targets). Tiamat would possibly lose to Lion Voltron one on one, POSSIBLY (who I think of as another High End SHW), but Tiamat will soon have help from Hunter and his amazing piloting skills and armament to take out Voltron.
If they were to focus on a single pilot or two of Voltron, theyll practically cripple him severely. Voltrons main foes are not very bright at all, just big and strong, here he fights Tiamat (who isnt that much smaller than Voltron at 60 feet in length herself) and Hunter, 2 very experienced and intelligent fighters.
In the end, Team Voltrons Way Low End HW in Charizard is their downfall, to Team Tiamats High End HW (a HW who almost beat Optimus Prime, the eventual winner of the HWs)
My Vote - Team Tiamat
Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
Except that Tiamat can go etheral at will. The sword's nasty damage but if it's passing through her as if she isn't there, it's moot. Easiest way to think of it is that Tiamat esssentially has Shadowcat's phasing powers and I don't see Kitty getting hacked all the time (except in the ubiquitous What-If? comic scenes where Logan kills her accidentally and then goes berserk like, oh, every third issue :) ).
Your telling me that in the show Tiamat often just phased through oncomeing attacks then solidified, attacked and phased again?
Team Tiamat - 7 votes
Team Voltron (Lion Form) - 7 votes
A TIE!!
RK, youve posted twice supporting Team Tiamat, but have made no official vote as yet. When you do, Ill certainly count it for whatever team you are voting for.
Also, for those that think the Phantom is NOTHING here, this is THE JUNGLE, The Phantom is like Batman in Gotham City here. While Id say he still couldnt hurt Hercules, Im betting in the Jungle he could take out the Iria (possibly dying in the process) leaving Rick to simply KO an easy Charizard and slightly harder TEENAGED Hercules before he helps Tiamat battle Voltron.
Rokk_Krinn
04/12/2005, 14:44
Originally posted by Rando
Your telling me that in the show Tiamat often just phased through oncomeing attacks then solidified, attacked and phased again?
There were indeed occasions where attacks went through Tiamat as well as times we saw Tiamat "phase" through matter - I'm guessing those count as her being "ethereal" (as even though etheral beings are invisible, on the show other ethereal opponents like wraiths and spectres were visible).
Frankly, Tiamat vs. Voltron I think it would probably tip towards Voltron but her support team is pretty decent. Sure, Peter Pan is pointless here but the Phantom is a consumate stalker and trapper and the real big difference is Rick Hunter and that Veritech. He can easily pinpoint missiles right into the lion cockpits.
Vote: Team Tiamat
thedon99
04/12/2005, 15:02
Please, that whole argument for Tiamat is a stretch, and seems to be reaching for a way to vote for her. Voltron would smash her with ease, and then the rest of the team.
_______________________________________
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Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
There were indeed occasions where attacks went through Tiamat as well as times we saw Tiamat "phase" through matter - I'm guessing those count as her being "ethereal" (as even though etheral beings are invisible, on the show other ethereal opponents like wraiths and spectres were visible).
Frankly, Tiamat vs. Voltron I think it would probably tip towards Voltron but her support team is pretty decent. Sure, Peter Pan is pointless here but the Phantom is a consumate stalker and trapper and the real big difference is Rick Hunter and that Veritech. He can easily pinpoint missiles right into the lion cockpits.
Vote: Team Tiamat
So your telling me that Tiamat fights like Shadowcat and phases through attacks throws some of her own then phases through some more?
Weve still got ourselves a TIE here, 8 votes a piece, so dont let this one slip on by without further discussion and more votes now. :)
Really I must say I'm suprised with absolute lack of respect being afforded to Voltron. Everything I know and remeber about Voltron tells me that their encounter will not be a long one. Voltron's fights were typically very short and to the point in my memory, once Voltron was formed and pulled his sword out then whatever he was fighting was dead, period. Tiamat is by no means dramatically tougher than the stuff that Voltron was masscreing, in fact she is probably weaker. You have to remeber that in the D&D universe everything, even gods, can be hurt, and even killed, by normal people, a horde of grunts with bows is a phenomenal threat to anything that doesn't require magical weapons to hurt, a highly skilled person armed with some magical equipment that just makes him hit a little harder and more often is a deadly foe to almost anyone. Nothing like that is even remotly dangerous to Voltron, guys with bows may as well be attacking him with air, someone with a +3 sword would have a hard time breaking through a stone door, they wouldn't be able to scratch something like Voltron. Whoever said there just aren't things in D&D that hit like Voltron was just right, nothing in that universe could hope to brute force an entity of it's magnitude.
Voltron never really popped out his Blazing Sword until the very end of his battle, it was more his Finishing Weapon, so I dont think hell start every battle sword blazing.
Team Voltrons HW is simply TOO WEAK, and will be killed by Team Tiamat HW near easily, at which time Hunter can practically instantly help Tiamat double team Voltron. Can Voltron handle Tiamat one on one, very possibly, can he handle Tiamat and Rick Hunter together, its there that I say no.
Both Tiamat and Hunter know Voltron is made up of several pilots and by attacking certain areas instead of just Voltron as a whole there are sure to do more damage and be more effective against them. Tiamat is WAY WAY smarter than the magical grunt Robeasts Voltron normally fights, and Rick Hunter is about as skilled a pilot as they come. Together, high in the air where no one else can help, theyll take even this Voltron down more than not.
Also, what level spell is SLEEP in D&D? If its 5th level of under, chances are Tiamat has it, and that means Voltrons pilots are incredibly vulnerable to a magical attack (not to mention 5 vastly powerful magical blasts)
The Red Baron
04/13/2005, 14:39
I am going to vote volrton here. He has to much versitlity to attack with. he will contuniue to swich things up until he kills tiamat.
Team Voltron now leads by a Single Vote.
Also, what level spell is SLEEP in D&D? If its 5th level of under, chances are Tiamat has it, and that means Voltrons pilots are incredibly vulnerable to a magical attack (not to mention 5 vastly powerful magical blasts)
You generally can't fire spells through walls (or vehicles etc.) in D&D. Having no LOS to the pilots, they're safe, and she couldn't get them all (sleep only affects 2d4 HD of critters, so assuming the pilots are level 1, she stands a chance, but not a sure thing, at getting them, and odds are the pilot's levels are high enough that it's simply impossible to get more than one or two), and sleep offers no protection against being woken up again (like by yellings in a speaker).
And Voltron doesn't really have a vunerability to magic. It fights magic stuff all the time, the magic blasts might as well be normal blasts (and one of them is a gas attack I believe, which is rather useless).
Together, high in the air where no one else can help, theyll take even this Voltron down more than not.
Unless Voltron stays near the ground (maybe attacking the opposing team's LW/MW to protect the others) where Iria can snipe at Rick's Veritech.
Voltron has versatility but Tiamat does not? Where were all these arguments in teh SHW TOC with Mewtwo vs Tiamat?
Tiamat can handle Voltron no problem. Voltron needs to be close to hit her with that sword...Tiamat can cast at a distance. Tiamat is not stupid enough to get caught in the sword. Tiamat has the versatility of magic to take out Voltron. I give Voltron all the credit, but I have Tiamat's team much, much more credit. Tiamat and Rick should have little problem double teaming Voltron and taking him down.
Voltron needs to be close to hit her with that sword...Tiamat can cast at a distance.
Well, there's also the spear, which can be thrown, and I believe the lion-mouths can shoot fire.
Oh yea, and on the etherealness- D&D etherealness is all or nothing. While ethereal, Tiamat won't be hurt, but neither can she attack. It's a stalling method.
hail_eris
04/13/2005, 14:56
Originally posted by DTM
Also, what level spell is SLEEP in D&D? If its 5th level of under, chances are Tiamat has it, and that means Voltrons pilots are incredibly vulnerable to a magical attack (not to mention 5 vastly powerful magical blasts)
Sleep would be a Level 1 spell. Don't recall its range or anything, but it's probably the first spell that adventuring wizards learn.
I'm going with the Ink and Paint Air Force here. Charizard really is that weak, and the only non-flyer on Tiamat's team could not be more at home in this terrain. The Phantom has been fighting in the jungle for umpteen generations. It's what he was born to do. So Iria is a negligible factor as far as any anti-air sniping goes. Herc is strong, but just about everything in the jungle is stronger than humans. If the Phantom can trap elephants without too much difficulty, I'm guessing that he can devise a way to incap rookie Hercules.
With the groundlings negated, it's three on two up in the sky. Granted, Peter may not look like much, but Voltron was not designed to fight airborne man-sized threats with Pan's maneuverability (think X-Wings vs. Death Star). Between Rick targeting Voltron's vulnerable systems and Pan smothering the optics with vines from the jungle below, the big robot will, quite literally, not know what hit him. Tiamat can nail him with the five-headed drive-by to finish him off. Charizard is inconsequential, as Rick or Tiamat can deal with him at their leisure.
Team Tiamat to advance.
Rick Hunter? I have trouble believing that Rick is going to do anything at all to Voltron, he is essentially flying a crappy X-wing that can turn into a mech, he isn't a real problem. In addition Iria is a problem to him, conventional jets can be knocked out of the sky with a thrown rock (this is the principal on which flak cannons are based), Rick's Veritech is tougher but not nearly so much that Iria's hand weapons can't hurt him. Regardless Rick isn't much of anything to Voltron his missle's may hurt Voltron, assumeing Rick hasn't used them already, but the machine gun and lasers probably won't, and certainly won't be enough of a deterent to prevent Voltron from hacking Tiamat in half with his sword.
For that matter forget about Rick, everyone on Voltron's team can hurt Tiamat except maybe Charizard (due to fire immunity). Mrs.T is gonna have a hard time keeping her offense and defense up when Hercules hurls a tree at her, or Iria shoots a spike with a jet on the end of it into her eye, which then proceeds to start boreing into her skull. Voltron's team may have a weak HW, but Tiamat's team has a weak MW and LW. Peter Pan is like 2 minutes of Iria's time, and a non-issue to Herc, and Phantom's unarmed self doesn't have nearly to stopping power to put away Iria (as she has combat armor) or Hercules even with suprise (which he may not even get). Voltorn's team is much more of a threat to Tiamat, who is vulnerable to attacks from just about anyone, than anything on Tiamat's team is to Voltron.
This match is now TIED up again.
Originally posted by Q99
Voltron needs to be close to hit her with that sword...Tiamat can cast at a distance.
Well, there's also the spear, which can be thrown, and I believe the lion-mouths can shoot fire.
Not really sure if ordinary fire is gonna be that much of a problem for Tiamat...and if she sits still long enough for Voltron to get a spear in her, that she deserve to lose.
My opinion...she ain't gonna sit still. She did not become queen of the dragons for nothing.
Yeah she became the queen of the dragons because she was born with 5 heads, immunity to all the dragons breath weapons, and a lot of magical resistance.
Voltron manages to wipe out stuff with friggin jet engines that can reach escape velocity just fine. Tiamat's not gonna be all that difficult to get hits in on.
Maybe we're looking at different Voltrons :cheeky:
Were this a straight SHW vs SHW match I might even give the nod to Voltron, and if not it's certainly close.
If they go HtH then I'd have to take the Blazing Sword over claws and teeth.
As for ranged attacks -
Spinning Laser Blades: Kind of like a ninja star, which the Green lion can make and fire from its mouth.
Electro-sabre: A javelin-type of weapon formed in back of Voltron.
Ice beam: fired from Voltron's horn-like things on his head, these freeze anything
Eye beam: fired from Voltron's eyes, this weapon damages whatever it hits
Lion torches: Flame comes spewing out of green and red lion's mouth.
Wing Attack: Voltron takes his wings off of his back and flings them toward his enemy. Quite effective
Electroforce cross: A cross comes off of voltron's chest and paralyzes a the enemies for a period of time
Lion head attack: green and red lion's heads fly off of voltron, hit the target then come back
Starfire: A powerful X shoots out of Voltron, and chops the enemy into 4 pieces, then forms a tornado and sweeps the parts away
Missiles: a variety of missles can shoot from blue and yellow lion's mouths.
That's 10, only 2 of which Tiamat might be immune to. Voltron does not need to engage in close combat to fight Tiamat.
hail_eris
04/13/2005, 15:43
Originally posted by Rando
In addition Iria is a problem to him, conventional jets can be knocked out of the sky with a thrown rock (this is the principal on which flak cannons are based), Rick's Veritech is tougher but not nearly so much that Iria's hand weapons can't hurt him.
Conventional jets aren't built to withstand the rigors of interstellar travel and atmospheric re-entry. I'd have to guess that the Veritech is made of sterner stuff than a MiG...
Originally posted by Rando
Phantom's unarmed self doesn't have nearly to stopping power to put away Iria (as she has combat armor) or Hercules even with suprise (which he may not even get).
Unarmed *so* does not matter here. Fighting the Phantom in the jungle is like fighting Bruce Wayne in the Batcave. Except it's even worse than that, because the Phantom has been fighting this battle, in this exact terrain, for the past 400 years. It's part of his genetic makeup. Every trick, every trap, and every technique has been passed down from previous Phantoms to make "the ghost who walks" the most efficient predator in the jungle. Team Voltron's groundlings don't stand a chance.
deadalus13
04/13/2005, 15:43
I agree with Rando about one thing. Voltron's sword could do massive damage to Tiamat. I think in a one on one battle, Voltron would have a chance of taking Tiamat. I would still give Tiamat a slight edge though. She would get the first attack. Her abilties to teleport and turn ethereal pretty much guarantee the first strike. If she is smart, and she is listed as a genius level intelligence, she will teleport behind Voltron and attack with four breath weapons and a spell (not using her gas breath weapon for obvious reasons). She will try to maneuver to stay behind Voltron where he will have a more difficult time attacking her while she continues to assault him with her spells and breath weapons. If he is about to land a solid hit with his huge sword, she can go ethereal to avoid it or teleport out of the way. She could also cast some defensive spells before she engages him to help tip the battle in her favor. Mirror Image is a 3rd level spell which makes it harder for him to target her. I think Haste is also 3rd level, which would double the speed she could maneuver and attack. (By the way, why does everyone keep using 5th level as the limit to her spellcasting. The show takes precedence over outside material when determining abilities and she has been shown using spells of at least 7th level on the show and I believe 9th as well.)
But of course, this is not a one on one battle. When you factor in the teams, Tiamat has an even better chance of taking this. I could easily see Tiamat casting Earthquake (a high level spell that she has used on the show) while carrying Phantom. This eliminates Voltron's LW and either incapacitates or at least slows down his MW. Charizard doesn't survive the first volley from Rick. This leaves Voltron against Tiamat's entire team.
for starters this isn't the Phantoms exact terrain, it's a jungle, not the jungle that Phantom lives in. In addition both Herc and Iria have tangled with a beat things far more berserk than anything Phantom has ever seen, in jungles and everywhere else, one because he is strong as heck and the other because she has skills an abilities beyond compare. I very much doubt that the Phantom is going to be takeing them out, he is just out of his league.
Lets say, for the sake of argument, that your right and Phantom is going to be takeing Iria and Hercules out of the picture. It still probably won't save him. Phantom clearly has no hope of winning this fight in a direct manner, it is going to take a significant amount of rigamarole and setting junk up and mess. While he's doing that Iria and Hercules can be hassleing Tiamat all the while, any distraction that allows Voltron to unload his finisher functionally ends this fight, Phantom can take them both 20 times in a row after that, he's still lost the match. If Phantom can take them at all he certainly can't do it quickly (especially considering how quickly attacks are going to be able to be mounted on the large, obvious Tiamat), and if he can't take them quickly then he essentially can't do so at all, as that gives them time to gove Voltron an edge in a battle in which he may not even need one on the first place.
Originally posted by deadalus13
I agree with Rando about one thing. Voltron's sword could do massive damage to Tiamat. I think in a one on one battle, Voltron would have a chance of taking Tiamat. I would still give Tiamat a slight edge though. She would get the first attack. Her abilties to teleport and turn ethereal pretty much guarantee the first strike. If she is smart, and she is listed as a genius level intelligence, she will teleport behind Voltron and attack with four breath weapons and a spell (not using her gas breath weapon for obvious reasons). She will try to maneuver to stay behind Voltron where he will have a more difficult time attacking her while she continues to assault him with her spells and breath weapons. If he is about to land a solid hit with his huge sword, she can go ethereal to avoid it or teleport out of the way. She could also cast some defensive spells before she engages him to help tip the battle in her favor. Mirror Image is a 3rd level spell which makes it harder for him to target her. I think Haste is also 3rd level, which would double the speed she could maneuver and attack. (By the way, why does everyone keep using 5th level as the limit to her spellcasting. The show takes precedence over outside material when determining abilities and she has been shown using spells of at least 7th level on the show and I believe 9th as well.)
But of course, this is not a one on one battle. When you factor in the teams, Tiamat has an even better chance of taking this. I could easily see Tiamat casting Earthquake (a high level spell that she has used on the show) while carrying Phantom. This eliminates Voltron's LW and either incapacitates or at least slows down his MW. Charizard doesn't survive the first volley from Rick. This leaves Voltron against Tiamat's entire team.
The reason people list her as 5th level max is because that is what her stats list her as. If you toss that out because the show contradicts then toss out all reference to D&D spells that she isn't shown useing in the show, which means that any magical abilties that she doesn't actually use in the show she wouldn't have (so no mirror image, and mess like that). I'll also note that if your going by the rules then you can't go etheral to dodge oncomeing attacks, it takes your whole turn, which means once you come out of it you are free to be hammered upon, the same is true of teleportation. If you want to use the show instead then I have my doubts that Tiamat was phaseing and teleporting around like some ginger **** instead of fighting like a giant monster should.
Tiamat's Earthquake (assumeing it wasn't something realted to her doing it in her home plane) might take Iria, but then it might not, it's just a matter of luck really, it isn't really a pinpoint attack.
Lessee, Peter Pan's just a placeholder here, but the other three members of Team Tiamat are utterly lethal. Between Rick Hunter's missile strikes and The Phantom, the ground pounders of Team Voltron are toast. Charizard is history from laser fire and Tiamat.
Seriously, show me a team that can level the area faster than Tiamat and Rick and I'll show you hateful lies!
Tiamat versus Voltron is a truly apocalyptic battle, but with the assistance of Rick Hunter, that bot will fall. I don't know if Tiamat will survive it, but Voltron's going down.
I pains me to vote against Iria and Lion Force Voltron, but I have to. I can't see them beating a team that can obliterate as big an area as this, thus eliminating the other three members of the opposition team.
TEAM TIAMAT
So lets see... Phantom in this terrain could take out Iria, but i dont see him beating Hercules. Iria and Herc trade partners. Herc wont be hurt by the Phantom, and Iria defeats Peter Pan easily with a ranged attack. Charizard is not weak by the way, if he sets the jungle on fire it will nullify the threat of the Phantom, forcing him to come out and be KO'ed by Herc and Iria. Voltron can stall Tiamat for some time, until Herc grabs Tiamat by the tail, hurls her into the stratosphere, and as Tamat falls down, Voltron goes FORM BLAZING SWORD, slicing Tiamat in the chest and ending her. Then its down to taking down Rick, who will not survive the assault.
Vote: Team Voltron
This is a TIE 10 votes a piece. Really would like to start Match 9 today, so next vote takes it.
.......just keep in mind Rick Hunter can destroy Chairzard in seconds, and its essentially Rick AND Tiamat (the winner of the SHW level) against Voltron alone. Team Tiamat is the obvious choice :)
Grundy22
04/15/2005, 16:38
After reading many of the arguments for both team I have to say I see Voltrons team pulling this one out. Given all of the armaments grinner listed for Voltron I definitely think he can take Tiamat. My only concern was Rick Hunter, but I think Team Voltron's LW and MW make short work of there opponents and then its Voltron, Herc and Iria vs Rick Hunter. Now Rick Hunter is good but not that good.
Vote: Team Voltron
Rick Hunter can lay waste to Voltrons LW, MW and HW almost easily (and Tiamats Phantom LW can certainly keep Iria VERY busy in this Jungle) Rick Hunter has practically NOTHING to fear from the rest of Voltrons teammates once Chairzard is dead, which should take about 30 seconds. From that point on itll be Tiamat AND Hunter vs Voltron, in the air.
Excellent, lets see what we got for match 9.
As mentioned at the end of Match 8, this match and all other Second Quarter matches are OPEN for voting until tomorrow. Thanks.
We have two powerful beings, Hunter and Tiamat against a robot with a big sword (its a great sword) and limited range capabilities. Tiamat AND Hunter have greater range than Voltron and should be able to take him out together MORE than 50% of the time. Hunter will take care of Charizard with no problem and then focus on Voltron, tag teaming with Tiamat.
Limited range capability? What in the world are you talking about? Voltron has nearly a dozen forms of ranged attack, one of which is a missle battery, he almost defiently out ranges Tiamat who functions at about the length of her breath weapons (i.e. much too close for comfort) and is probably at the same range as Rick Hunter, Voltron might even out range him. Tiamat might not even be alive by the time Rick finishes Charizard (assumeing Rick hasn't been grounded by getting hit with a thrown tree while he was concentrating on Charizard, or get's one of his missles shot right as it leaves his mech blowing up in his face), it's not gonna take Voltron more than about a hit or two to finish her off. Not that Rick Hunter's little baby mech matters all that much to Voltron as it wipes out things far more damageing than a Veritech regularly.
And if Voltron hits Tiamat with the paralysing attack, she's not going to be able to cast spells to avoid further attacks (if he hits Rick, the Veritech's going to crash... or have the tape in the player get stuck on a Minmei loop, same thing).
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