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AZS
02/10/2006, 11:35
Welcome to the Collateral Damage Marquee Primer Review!
Part 5: Cards – BFC’s, Feat, & Bystander Tokens

http://www.wizkidsgames.com/images/HDCD_logo_small.jpg

This new DC set comes out next week – Feb. 15, so to get ready for the Marquee, and any sealed games you play before then, here’s the regular Marquee Primer.

These reviews are intended for sealed, 300 point games with only this set.

Here’s the review schedule:

Part 1 - Commons (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1914963#post1914963) (Monday)
Part 2 – Uncommons (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?t=158737) (Tuesday)
Part 3 – Rares (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?t=158832) (Wed)
Part 4 – Uniques (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?t=158914) (Thurs)
Part 5 – Cards
Part 6 – Special Objects (Friday – separate thread)

click on ‘Replies’ below to read the review.

.

AZS
02/10/2006, 11:35
Welcome to yet another Marquee Primer Review!

Part 5 – Cards

Battlefield Conditions, Feat Cards, & Bystander Tokens

Ok, so we’ve got some funky new cards in this set, which actually cuts into the number of Battlefield Conditions.
The Special Objects cards are posted in their own seperate thread. (Called ‘part 6’)


Battlefield Condition Cards

Debris
Each player contributes three additional objects to the object pile before objects are placed on the battlefield. Players must place all objects in the object pool on the battlefield.

Simple yet effective. If you pull figs with Super Strength, or even just a number of figures with Stealth, the extra terrain could definitely be helpful. It will also be good for tripping up opposing figures with Charge (grounded figs only).
Also keep in mind this could mean you can put out more 3D objects!
(Yay, 2 lamp posts constantly falling over!)
If you end up not wanting the extra objects lying around, remember you can destroy them by dealing 3 damage (a good idea is to destroy an object your stealther is standing on to prevent it from getting ~yoinked~).


Proximity Mines
At the end of a turn, if any character is in the same square as an uncarried object or in a square adjacent to an uncarried object, roll one six-sided die. On a result of 5 or 6, deal 1 damage (that ignores all effects that reduce damage) to all characters in the same square as or adjacent to the object, and then remove the object from the game.

Man, this is so cool! I hope I pull this one at a Marquee! Even if it costs me the game, just to have #### blow up all over the map would be such fun.
And if anyone plays this, and plays against someone with Debris… too cool.

Anyway, this is a fun little BFC, and could really nerf Stealth teams that rely on object placement. This could also eliminate special objects, since they won’t be immune to this BFC.
Also, keep in mind that you can TK objects. Not that there’s a lot of TK in the set, but if you can set it up to toss an object next to an enemy, then you’ll roll for Proximity Mines at then end of your turn and your opponent won’t even have a chance to move out of the way!
Finally, you can destroy an object by dealing 3 damage to it - so if you’re worried that a dumpster might blow up in your face, shoot it for 3 and turn it into harmless rubble.


Feat Cards

Inspiring Command
Cost: 15
Prereq – Leadership or Mastermind (and a team ability!)

Choose a Character.
Characters with the same team symbol as the character and a lower point value than the character are not dealt pushing damage when a second token is placed upon them if they are adjacent to the character at the beginning or end of an action.

This will be an awesome card in constructed tournament play. In this set though, there’s only a couple of figures that fit the prereq, and even then you have to pull other figs of lower cost with the same TA to use this. (Notice it says Team ‘Symbol’ and not Team ‘Ability,’ so it can’t be wildcarded.)
However, if you do manage to pull it off, this is undoubtedly a great card.

Flashbang
Cost: 5
Prereq – Smoke Cloud

Choose a character.
When the character is given a move action, move it up to half its speed value. It may use Smoke Cloud as a free action either before or after the move action.

Yay! Smoke Cloud gets a boost! And the card is only 5 points, so its cheap and easy to use. The designer of this card deserves major props. ;)
However, surprisingly there aren’t a lot of figures in this set with SC. V Metamorpho has it for 1 click, R Hive Trooper has a couple clicks, and even Trickster has a dash of it. But the 2 figs to pull this with are Shadow Lass and Dr. Mid-Nite! Full Dials of SC and Stealth! Sweet.

Ambush
Cost: 5
Prereq – Stealth (NOT a team ability that approximates Stealth.)

Choose a character.
The character gets +2 to its attack value when it makes a close combat attack while occupying hindering terrain. After the attack resolves, the character’s Stealth is countered until the beginning of your next turn.

There’s a pro and con to this card. Well, a couple of cons. First, the attacking figure has to be in hindering terrain and adjacent to an enemy. Then they have their Stealth countered for the following turn.
The upside is that they’ll get +2 to AV. In a set with lots of high defenses and low AV’s, this could be huge! Plus there are ways to keep a figure protected even if their Stealth is turned off; block LOS, base an opposing shooter with a tie up piece, or give them a better target.
For 5 points, its worthwhile to play this card if you have the opportunity, it could come in handy when you need it most.

The Society
Cost: 0
Prereq – Injustice League Team Symbol

All friendly characters with the Injustice League team ability have the following team ability instead of the Injustice League team ability:

When a character attempts to Outwit a power possessed by a member of this team, roll one six-sided die. On a result of 1–3, Outwit cannot be used by that character on this team member that turn.

1 – Awesome card!
2 – There’s not a single IL member in this entire set!

I could stop there, but I’m going to point out the irony that all the figures in this set who would be in the IL team are instead Calculator because of the Society in Infinite Crisis.
So this is a great, if very poorly timed card.

Movethrough
Cost: 8
Prereq – Charge

Choose a character.
The character ignores other characters for movement purposes, but it must still break away as normal.

Mmmmm… interesting. There are a few grounded chargers in this set, so you may get a chance to use this card. For 8 points.. its up in the air. If you’re tight on points, I wouldn’t leave out some other character or card just to play this. But if you have points to burn, go for it.

Running Start
Cost: 5
Prereq – Plasticity or Stealth

Choose a character.
Do not halve the character’s movement when it begins a move action in hindering terrain.

Specifically in this tournament this card could be good for a few figures.
In the overall scheme of the game, it’s a total dud.
Keep in mind that Stealth does not include the Batman TA (judges, please check for this on player’s teams before the tournament starts.)

The reason this will fall flat in constructed games is twofold; the major limitations of the Prerequisites, and that it only helps when moving out of hindering terrain. (When you move into it, you still have to stop as normal).
Then factor in that you can use Swingline for 10 points with no prerequisite and ignore hindering terrain for all movement.

But in the Marquee, if you have a fig with the Prereq and 5 points to spare, it definitely won’t hurt to play this card. :ermm


Bystander Tokens

Detective Chimp – 5
Sue Dibney – 5
Ted Knight – 4 (8 /)
Uncle Dudley – 4
Linda Park-West – 4

These 5 are the low cost Bystanders in the set – basically fodder. They can act as filler if you have points left, and if you choose to use them, they’ll play the same as the other fodder-pogs from previous sets. Use them to block LOS, as tie up pieces, or as sacrificial lambs. Whatever works for you.
Of note: Detective Chimp has a solid 9 AV, so he can actually hit if you get the chance.
Ted Knight also has a surprising 8 range. His AV is only 7, so he’s not going to sway the outcome of a game. But if you can get off just one unexpected hit with him, he’ll earn his points. Better still, players might see his range as a threat and make an effort to target him, and any effort directed at this 4 point piece is attention drawn away from your main pieces.


Eddie Fyers – 9 (6 //)
Oberon – 10

The “higher cost” bystanders of the set. Both are pretty good for what they get you; Eddie has a nice double target ability supported by a 9 AV and 2 damage. Enough to either hedge your bets with two targets, or split the damage. However, his 6 range will probably put him in range of retaliation, and make for an easy 9 point gain by your opponent.
Oberon is similarly easy to take out, but if you can pull it off, he has CCE for the potential of 3 damage, and willpower so he can move and then attack without pushing himself to death. If you have a 9 or 10 point gap to fill, and pull either of these, they’re definitely worth considering.

Par2ch
02/10/2006, 11:42
Also, keep in mind that you can TK objects.???

I thought objects TKed had to be used to target opponents. Where in the rules or errata does it say you can just thow around objects?

other then that...great writeup

AZS
02/10/2006, 11:45
I'm not the best person for quoting specific rules and where to find them, but I do know that you can TK objects around the board. They don't have to be used as weapons when TKed.
(This a popular tactic with Nanobots, btw.)

BlueBlazer
02/10/2006, 12:07
It is option 2 under Telekinesis in the DC Icons PAC.

It may move a target adjacent object that is not being held or a target friendly character up to 10 squares.

Necromagus
02/10/2006, 12:09
nice reviews, all four. I am sad to say that as of late the Feats/BFC cards have had more of an impact on the game than the figs themselves, so a closer look at those included in the next set is appreciated.

NM

Bloodsword
02/10/2006, 12:25
Another thing with Mines. If a fig with Super Strength picks up an object on his turn, during your turn you can outwit his SS, he drops the item, BOOM. HA HA HA HA! I love this BFC.

CornsilkSW
02/10/2006, 12:36
...
...(Yay, 2 lamp posts constantly falling over!)...

mine don't fall over. All you have to do is take one of the handy white stickers from a booster, place it over the picture of a heavy object, and superglue the bottom of the lamp post to the object token. works like a charm.

i even went so far as to put a blue ring around the edge of the white sticker, which fits perfectly inside the red ring of a heavy object.

~Silk

C-Dog
02/10/2006, 12:41
Nice write up, Azs.

Quick rules question about Flashbang -- do you get to move half your speed, through the Smoke Cloud, then make a move action (move your full speed)? Am I read that right?

C

SimonMoon5
02/10/2006, 12:58
Oberon – 10
Oberon is similarly easy to take out, but if you can pull it off, he has CCE for the potential of 3 damage, and willpower so he can move and then attack without pushing himself to death. If you have a 9 or 10 point gap to fill, and pull either of these, they’re definitely worth considering.

Of course, if you're playing with Oberon, you're cheating and should be immediately disqualified, since he's a marquee participation prize and should not be found in boosters.

So, you have to balance whether that CCE is worth being kicked out of the tournament before deciding to play Oberon.

Hero_guy
02/10/2006, 13:13
Nice write up, Azs.

Quick rules question about Flashbang -- do you get to move half your speed, through the Smoke Cloud, then make a move action (move your full speed)? Am I read that right?

C

Flashbang allows you to move half your speed and use Smoke Cloud in either order. So you would give your fig an action to use Smoke Cloud, then you can either move half your speed and use SC or you can use SC and then move half your speed.

plkangus
02/10/2006, 13:14
Of course, if you're playing with Oberon, you're cheating and should be immediately disqualified, since he's a marquee participation prize and should not be found in boosters.

So, you have to balance whether that CCE is worth being kicked out of the tournament before deciding to play Oberon.

If you pull him out of a booster, that would be wierd. However, the marquee rules do not say you cannot use your participation prize pog on your team. I've seen plenty of Willy Lumpkins played, and Tony Stark LMD got used quite a bit at the last marquee.

grey_zealot
02/10/2006, 13:58
Feat Cards

Inspiring Command
Cost: 15
Prereq – Leadership or Mastermind (and a team ability!)

Choose a Character.
Characters with the same team symbol as the character and a lower point value than the character are not dealt pushing damage when a second token is placed upon them if they are adjacent to the character at the beginning or end of an action.

This will be an awesome card in constructed tournament play. In this set though, there’s only a couple of figures that fit the prereq, and even then you have to pull other figs of lower cost with the same TA to use this. (Notice it says Team ‘Symbol’ and not Team ‘Ability,’ so it can’t be wildcarded.)
However, if you do manage to pull it off, this is undoubtedly a great card.

Aw, frak!! The day they previewed this card, I printed it out and used it in a bunch of home game. I never noticed the 'symbol' versus 'ability' catch. :(


Ambush
Cost: 5
Prereq – Stealth (NOT a team ability that approximates Stealth.)

Choose a character.
The character gets +2 to its attack value when it makes a close combat attack while occupying hindering terrain. After the attack resolves, the character’s Stealth is countered until the beginning of your next turn.

There’s a pro and con to this card. Well, a couple of cons. First, the attacking figure has to be in hindering terrain and adjacent to an enemy. Then they have their Stealth countered for the following turn.
The upside is that they’ll get +2 to AV. In a set with lots of high defenses and low AV’s, this could be huge! Plus there are ways to keep a figure protected even if their Stealth is turned off; block LOS, base an opposing shooter with a tie up piece, or give them a better target.
For 5 points, its worthwhile to play this card if you have the opportunity, it could come in handy when you need it most.

It definitely comes in handy certain Stealth/Outwitters.




Good reviews, as always, sir.

lchestnut81
02/10/2006, 14:01
there are alot of cool cards in this set, but I don't think that the cards will make a really big difference in this set. Good review.

JollyAndy
02/10/2006, 14:09
Finally a set with Feat cards that are just nice touches and not game-altering! Finally, feat cards I can live with! Finally!

Still upset about Oberon and Eddie though. In the good ol' days, if you had powers, you had your own fig. Then again, you could have your own fig without any powers (I love busting out Lackey and Henchmen armies).

ohoni
02/10/2006, 14:22
One fun synergy that's worth noting, IF you get all the pieces for it, is that if you get one of:

1. Ambush

2. V Katana
E Azrael
V Azrael

3. R Shadow Lass
E Umbra
V Shadow Lass
E OMAC

You can then use put and us Ambush on the #3 characters, ond once they've lost the stealth granted by their own Stealth ability due to Ambush's effect, they can simply borrow their team mate's Batman TA to retain the effect of Stealth. That should prove a fun surprise to the opponent when used.

It's use is limited in the draft, since you need to get all three pieces to do it, but it will tear up in constructed, with low cost Robins and Spoilers being used to pass the TA on (not to mention Alfreds until June). ;)

ludd_gang
02/10/2006, 14:47
Speaking of Debris and Proximity Mines, whenever I play against Nanobots I already put my 3 objects right next to my starting area so I can destroy them right outta the gate. I think you'll see this habit becoming more widespread. :D

Society question: If the fig is targeted by the Outwit and the Outwit is negated, the Outwitter can't use it on another fig, right? I mean, he can't play the Outwit free action again, or is it like Skrulls?

Running Start: I don't think that it's totally ineffective due to Swingline. 5 pts is sometimes a big bite on character selection. Maybe I'll regret it, but I will be trying it on my Legacy Bats since he usually dashes to onto an object token and stops anyway.

tidge
02/10/2006, 15:00
Don't get your tighty-whities in a bunch about Brilliant Tactician, rulings involving similar symbol/TA wording in other HeroClix areas has always fallen on the side of WildCards being able to get away with pretending to be full-fledged members of the team, including "having" the symbol on the base.

SimonMoon5
02/10/2006, 15:33
Society question: If the fig is targeted by the Outwit and the Outwit is negated, the Outwitter can't use it on another fig, right? I mean, he can't play the Outwit free action again, or is it like Skrulls?


I believe the current theory is that it is more like Skrulls. You foil their attempt to outwit *that* character, but they can outwit someone else.

AZS
02/10/2006, 15:59
Of course, if you're playing with Oberon, you're cheating and should be immediately disqualified, since he's a marquee participation prize and should not be found in boosters.Is he really?
I totally missed that bit of info!

Funky Jett
02/10/2006, 16:02
If you pull him out of a booster, that would be wierd. However, the marquee rules do not say you cannot use your participation prize pog on your team. I've seen plenty of Willy Lumpkins played, and Tony Stark LMD got used quite a bit at the last marquee.
Sadly, those teams should have been disqualified. You are supposed to play with what you pull from your boosters, and Tony, Willie, and Jimmy don't come from your boosters. If someone uses Oberon in your marquee, that is an illegal figure for this tournament, and they can be DQed. And you cannot use house rules in a marquee again, so your judge cannot rule their use for the marquee.

AZS
02/10/2006, 16:03
mine don't fall over. All you have to do is take one of the handy white stickers from a booster, place it over the picture of a heavy object, and superglue the bottom of the lamp post to the object token.I used a rubble marker (the back side of my unused 'special' markers) and double sided tape. Works great.
I even put the Lamp towards the corner of the token so there's room on the square for a figure to occupy (if its being used as hindering terrain, not being picked up.)

Then again, you could have your own fig without any powers (I love busting out Lackey and Henchmen armies).Or Rookie Fire in this set... :)

Funky Jett
02/10/2006, 16:08
Welcome to yet another Marquee Primer Review!

Battlefield Condition Cards

Debris
Each player contributes three additional objects to the object pile before objects are placed on the battlefield. Players must place all objects in the object pool on the battlefield.

Proximity Mines
At the end of a turn, if any character is in the same square as an uncarried object or in a square adjacent to an uncarried object, roll one six-sided die. On a result of 5 or 6, deal 1 damage (that ignores all effects that reduce damage) to all characters in the same square as or adjacent to the object, and then remove the object from the game.


Feat Cards

Inspiring Command
Cost: 15
Prereq – Leadership or Mastermind (and a team ability!)

Choose a Character.
Characters with the same team symbol as the character and a lower point value than the character are not dealt pushing damage when a second token is placed upon them if they are adjacent to the character at the beginning or end of an action.

Flashbang
Cost: 5
Prereq – Smoke Cloud

Choose a character.
When the character is given a move action, move it up to half its speed value. It may use Smoke Cloud as a free action either before or after the move action.

Ambush
Cost: 5
Prereq – Stealth (NOT a team ability that approximates Stealth.)

Choose a character.
The character gets +2 to its attack value when it makes a close combat attack while occupying hindering terrain. After the attack resolves, the character’s Stealth is countered until the beginning of your next turn.

The Society
Cost: 0
Prereq – Injustice League Team Symbol

All friendly characters with the Injustice League team ability have the following team ability instead of the Injustice League team ability:

When a character attempts to Outwit a power possessed by a member of this team, roll one six-sided die. On a result of 1–3, Outwit cannot be used by that character on this team member that turn.

Movethrough
Cost: 8
Prereq – Charge

Choose a character.
The character ignores other characters for movement purposes, but it must still break away as normal.

Running Start
Cost: 5
Prereq – Plasticity or Stealth

Choose a character.
Do not halve the character’s movement when it begins a move action in hindering terrain.
This set has the BEST cards in the game, period, including the new Special Objects. I cannot WAIT to get an Inspiring Command card and use it in an unrestricted match. I can honestly say, I am far more interested in the cards from this set than I am about any of the figures.

richpizor
02/10/2006, 17:25
Re: Running Start

This card will be a great boon to stealthed outwitters. For half the cost of swingline, they retain their same ability to get into stealth they ever had, but have an increased ability to run away in a hurry if need be.

I don't think it's game-changing, but I don't think it's nearly the dud you think it is. I'd rather have Swingline if I've got 10 points remaining, but if I've only got 8 I'll take this and Gwen Stacy rather than downgrade someone just to get Swingline.

Buddyhoss
02/11/2006, 01:50
A tactic worth mentioning: If you have a dumpster (or 2 or 3) use them with Proximity Mines. Throw the dumpster at an enemy for damage, and it won't be destroyed, blowing them up and maybe a teammate. :)

Also, TKing the objects at your opponent may be tricky. Think about how that would work and you'll see why. You have to be next to the object to TK it, and since you can't move up to an object and then TK it in one move you'll have to end your turn next to it... Boom. The only way I see that happening is if you TK another TKer next to an object and then TK the object. Not really worth it. Although it's not guarenteed the object will blow up when you move your TKer next to it, so you could always risk it the other way...

Glen Quagmire
02/13/2006, 13:20
Also, TKing the objects at your opponent may be tricky. Think about how that would work and you'll see why. You have to be next to the object to TK it, and since you can't move up to an object and then TK it in one move you'll have to end your turn next to it... Boom. The only way I see that happening is if you TK another TKer next to an object and then TK the object. Not really worth it. Although it's not guarenteed the object will blow up when you move your TKer next to it, so you could always risk it the other way...

I suppose a way around this would be Barrier. Place the TKer at a diagonal to the object and have your Barrier figure lay down the blocks to separate them. That's workable even in sealed play, since you've got a willpowered TKer in Red Tornado and a good amount of barrier pieces.

Good idea about the dumpster, too.

Glen Quagmire
02/13/2006, 13:24
Re: Running Start

This card will be a great boon to stealthed outwitters. For half the cost of swingline, they retain their same ability to get into stealth they ever had, but have an increased ability to run away in a hurry if need be.

I don't think it's game-changing, but I don't think it's nearly the dud you think it is. I'd rather have Swingline if I've got 10 points remaining, but if I've only got 8 I'll take this and Gwen Stacy rather than downgrade someone just to get Swingline.

Running Start is just 5 points. But yes, I agree that the card is valuable. I think the utmost use of Swingline is for mobile figures. Since figures with Stealth and Plasticity can't have any move and attack powers, Swingline is sort of a limo for them, when all they really need is a cab in the form of Running Start.