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ol_Dut
12/14/2006, 13:41
http://www.hcrealms.com/units/sn216.jpg

As the saying goes, “If you can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em.” And in a sense that’s what Kraven the Hunter did when he left Spider-Man for dead, put on Spidey’s costume and then set out to prove that he was a better Spider-Man than Spider-Man, thereby beating him once and for all. Get all that? In keeping with this twisted logic, we have Kraven the Spider. Although this piece reflects Kraven at the absolute end of his career (and life), instead of being an amped up version of the Veteran, it’s actually a sub-Rookie. Still with me? Good. Click on “Read More” to do just that.

ol_Dut
12/14/2006, 13:50
Kraven the Spider (LE #216 – Kraven)
Points: 39
Type: R-
Clicks: 7
Range: 0
Targets: 1

LE Kraven the Spider
Team: None
Range: 0
Cost: 39
m-normala-normald-normalg-normal910172891627917178161681616715266142KOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKO


Rookie Kraven
Team: Sinister Syndicate
Range: /6
Cost: 48
m-normala-normald-normalg-normal891628815178142771526714266151KOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKO

(Thanks to olcottr for the dials!)

LE Kraven the Spider’s Gains vs. Rookie Kraven
For starters, KTS packs one more click of life than his Rookie counterpart, and seven clicks of life for 39 points is a pretty big deal. He also adds three clicks of Leap/Climb, two more of 17 defense and one more of 16 defense. Defensively, KTS has one more click of Toughness and even adds a new power – Energy Shield/Deflection. He’s a bit more handy in a fight as well, opening with a 10 attack and swapping out one seven attack for an extra nine attack. Closing out his additions, we see three mid-dial clicks of Close Combat Expert, and two top of dial clicks of Battle Fury which presumably reflect the fact that at this point in his life Kraven the Spider is an A-#1 nutboy. He’s embracing his anger and making it work for him.

LE Kraven the Spider’s Losses vs. Rookie Kraven
The first and most noticeable loss is KTS’s range dropping down to a big fat zero (0), making the Rookie’s six (6) look positively luscious. Continuing the downward spiral, he sheds two clicks of Stealth, two of Incapacitate, his Ranged Combat Expert (logic dictates), and his Outwit. He also loses the Sinister Syndicate TA, which is actually something to fel bad about these days.

Neutral Dial Tinkering
Kraven the Spider leads off with Combat Reflexes which fades to Willpower and then to Toughness. Kraven the Yellow flip-flops that Willpower sandwich, starting with Toughness, moving to WP, and then to CR. Both come with a side of Leap/Climb and Stealth.

Cards that Work
(No) thanks to those opening clicks of Battle Fury Kraven can’t be carried and as such he may not be able to get to the best spot that allows him to both hit someone and continue to breathe air. Vault lets him move a bit after a close combat action and that may make all the difference in keeping him out of an enemy’s line of fire. Heightened Reflexes may also serve him well. Thanks to CR, he’ll be so tough to punch that opponents may want to just blast away at him from range. But with Heightened Reflexes he can dodge certain attacks with a successful roll, helping to make an annoying piece even more annoying. Envision a New Kids on the Block song covered by Alvin and the Chipmunks and then re-imagined as a four hour interpretive dance with full audience participation that you’re forced to suffer through on account of the whole thing’s your girlfriend’s crappy idea. That’s the level of annoying we’re looking at here.

Regarding Battlefield Conditions, Kraven’s a bit player and he knows it. Look to what helps the team and Kraven will just have to go along for the ride. Just don’t pick Earthquake. As tough as he is to hit at the top of his dial, there’s no sense in giving up free clicks.

If ol_Dut had to Choose
LE Kraven the Spider vs. Rookie Kraven? Kraven the Yellow is a nifty little tertiary attacker. He’ll bounce out into hindering, push to take a shot and then, voila! He’s in Stealth! With some planning he can borrow someone else’s attack value and then use Willpower and RCE to have some fun with his six range. He’s somewhat traditional, but he’s a bit of alright.

Kraven the Spider is downright suicidal. It’s not just the ballet shoes or the outfit that looks like Tina Turner’s armpit that are the tip-offs. It’s the fact that with no range and no damage reducers, this little Private Dancer is just going to go get in the grill of some zero-ranged bruiser and watch that 17 defense with Combat Reflexes become the bane of his opponent’s existence while the rest of Kraven’s team ignites said bruiser from a comfortable distance. Granted, with that two damage KTS is not going to crack an Invulnerable or better defense, but they also serve who only stand and tie up. If that low damage is really a concern though, just hook him up with Armor Piercing and you’re in. Of course one good hit and he’s squarely onto his CCE clicks where he’ll be able to punch his way through any defense, and Willpower will get him the most mileage out of that power as is possible. Once he gets down to his final clicks of Leap/Climb, he’ll want to find more sensible targets to irritate and attack, but hopefully by that point his main objective has been achieved and a big bad man (or momma) is out of the game.

Never knew KTS so cool as ice? Well he is and you’d better believe it. He’s one of the games best tie up pieces, able to pin down many a foe and not nearly worth the aggravation, energy or points required to take him down. With so much going on here from both a dial and comics perspective, he’s hard to resist. That’s enough to make me reach for Kraven the Spider every time. Best to just let Kraven the Yellow mellow.

Quick and Dirty Price Tag
He’s your Private Dancer, a dancer for money, and less than $10 will do. So how come when I’m trading for him I'm asked to give up Thanos, V Surfer, V Thor and $10 to get him? Go figure.

Next week? To heck with The Donald, we’re setting our sights on The Best LE’s of 2006! Be sure to join us! Thanks for reading!

olcottr
12/14/2006, 14:43
Rookie Kraven
Team: Sinister Syndicate
Range: /6
Cost: 48
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LE Kraven the Spider
Team: None
Range: 0
Cost: 39
m-normala-normald-normalg-normal910172891627917178161681616715266142KOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKO

fathernson
12/14/2006, 14:44
Great comments. Just picked this guy up last week and I can't wait to try him out!

epalicki
12/14/2006, 14:51
I like this piece quite a lot. He's cheap, and covered in feats, well, he's still cheap.

Nice review, Dut!

(Can somebody tell me which Spidey costume he wore? It's been awhile since I read "Kraven's Last Hunt," and while I remember loving the Mike Zeck art, I can't remember whether Kraven dressed in the red or the black...yes, I'm going to mod my Kraven...)

The Charlatan
12/14/2006, 14:57
I like this piece quite a lot. He's cheap, and covered in feats, well, he's still cheap.

Nice review, Dut!

(Can somebody tell me which Spidey costume he wore? It's been awhile since I read "Kraven's Last Hunt," and while I remember loving the Mike Zeck art, I can't remember whether Kraven dressed in the red or the black...yes, I'm going to mod my Kraven...)


Black costume.

cramcompany
12/14/2006, 14:58
He is a pretty good Pouncer don't you think??

He'd have an 11 atack and hit for three up close for only 54 points in tottal and he can move 9. After he takes his click he's a 18 from close range

Pretty darn good

Cramcompany

krusticlese
12/14/2006, 14:58
No mention of pounce... at all? This guy was designed for that feat, bringing him to 54 points. and a heck of a primiary attacker/tie up piece (like the Universe 40 point Spidey)

You cannot play Kraven the Spider without pounce. :grin: I think this guy completely rocks the house. I can't wait to mod him.

dragonborne
12/14/2006, 15:00
I like this piece quite a lot. He's cheap, and covered in feats, well, he's still cheap.

Nice review, Dut!

(Can somebody tell me which Spidey costume he wore? It's been awhile since I read "Kraven's Last Hunt," and while I remember loving the Mike Zeck art, I can't remember whether Kraven dressed in the red or the black...yes, I'm going to mod my Kraven...)


With the muscular body he had over Peter. If you have an extra mail away Venom, Just put Kraven's head on him and you have your KTS!

olcottr
12/14/2006, 15:01
Wow, team him up with R Mockingbird and your opponent will be tearing their hair out. :devious:

Ghost_Rider
12/14/2006, 15:02
Spider-Kraven, Spider-Kraven. Does whatever a spider and a hunter can. Spins a web, throws a net. Likes to wrestle, without breaking a sweat. Look up! There goes the Spider-Kraven.

Awesome review, he's an excellent tie up piece. It's just too bad that he wasn't on the other end of the spectrum and a V+ to go out with a bang.

mr-coffin
12/14/2006, 15:04
Black suit for Kraven. Awesome story.

absolutvt69
12/14/2006, 15:30
I used him w/ Pounce and he was very impressive. Even the round where he crit missed on his Pounce (taking 2 clicks) he was still able to base Korvac and live to tell about it (in fact, after dealing the finishing blow to Korvac he went and based Thanos who needed a couple shots to take him out). He's a great piece for his points.

Maniac_nmt
12/14/2006, 15:42
Personally, he's one of the best LEs to come out since Justice is Served.

His low low point cost and big game stats (def and attack) make him amazing. How they ever stuffed all that goodness into 39 points is beyond me.

Can't wait to try him out.

ol_Dut
12/14/2006, 15:57
No mention of pounce... at all? This guy was designed for that feat, bringing him to 54 points. and a heck of a primiary attacker/tie up piece (like the Universe 40 point Spidey)

You cannot play Kraven the Spider without pounce. :grin: I think this guy completely rocks the house. I can't wait to mod him.

You know, I thought about Pounce quite a bit, but I just couldn't bring myself to do it. Call me what you will, but I just can't advocate taking an action that puts him off that 19 defense in close combat. Going after an Invulnerable or Impervious opponent, at best you're trading clicks and I'd rather keep the 19 in that situation. Now if he had Super Strength, I'd Pounce the heck out of him. As he stands, I'm gun shy.

2Face
12/14/2006, 16:09
You know, I thought about Pounce quite a bit, but I just couldn't bring myself to do it. Call me what you will, but I just can't advocate taking an action that puts him off that 19 defense in close combat. Going after an Invulnerable or Impervious opponent, at best you're trading clicks and I'd rather keep the 19 in that situation. Now if he had Super Strength, I'd Pounce the heck out of him. As he stands, I'm gun shy.

I've had similar thoughts. Pounce is great if he attacks someone without a damage reducer. However, it seems largely useless against a figure with damage reducers. If you are using KTS as a tie-up piece for higher costed figures as you described in your article, then Pounce doesn't really make sense. However, if you want to use KTS as more of a secondary attacker, Pounce is great. I'm with you, Dut; I think other feats are more useful on this one.

AbeSapien
12/14/2006, 16:21
I agree that armor piercing is much more useful than pounce since you can sit around and wait to hit with his 10AV and 19Def. I don't like pounce as much as most people, since it's almost always limiting you to 3 damage.

Per the figure
Unless I was playing a theme team than I guess the Kraven rookie what with his range, more stealth and TA would get the call, but in general the sub-40 point beast of Kraven the Spider is too too good to pass up. he's beautiful against tent-pole teams (his 7 clicks keeps him alive after a huge attack) and against swarm teams his epic deffense and L/C make him a fron line attacker.

Good review Dut!

Zemo13
12/14/2006, 16:44
Zero range huh? Guess that crossbow ran out of arrows.
Maybe Tiger Lily took them....

epalicki
12/14/2006, 16:54
Zero range huh? Guess that crossbow ran out of arrows.
Maybe Tiger Lily took them....

Seriously, it's not as if they didn't already have a black-costume spider-man sculpt available in the very same set.

At the very least, dump the 'bow.

Imbalance
12/14/2006, 17:18
Nice. I had to read it twice though, because I kept getting hung up on this little gem:

Envision a New Kids on the Block song covered by Alvin and the Chipmunks and then re-imagined as a four hour interpretive dance with full audience participation that you’re forced to suffer through on account of the whole thing’s your girlfriend’s crappy idea. That’s the level of annoying we’re looking at here.

Thanks. I'll be having nightmares tonight. This deserves to be in a signature somewhere.

tidge
12/14/2006, 18:36
As always, thanks for the review!

Here is another switch-up: Kraven the Spider loses the Arch-Enemy Base!

The REV of Kraven is the veteran/Avengers Spider-Man...it's not entirely clear why playing that Spider-Man and any Kraven would be a big deal, but there it is.

I'm also somewhat leery of Pounce, unless the extra points are there. It seems like such a natural for him, but just having him able to get into most any B2B contact (and survive some big hits) is probably the best use of the points...if you have some ranged attack options on your team. Remember that using Pounce costs you not just a click of damage, but also the ability to leap/climb during the move.

A better use of the points might be Nanobots, since he has got either Leap/Climb or Willpower or Stealth to get around the battlefield. In fact, if you are putting a dedicated TK piece on the team anyway, KTS can serve extra duty as an early-game object-gobbling machine if equipped with Nanobots.

For theme purposes, his low cost makes him a very likely candidate for any non-SinSyn group of Spider-Man enemies; I'm thinking vet CT Doc Ock from CT and LE Norman Osborne. You should be able to build such a non-affiliated team and then happily play feats like Disbanded and Isolation without feeling like you are crippling yourself.

Monkey Joe
12/14/2006, 18:53
Mna, I love clix under 50pts that do the work of a +50pts clix. Can't wait to play him with Kazar who acts as a good moving shield from ranged attacks.

ol_Dut
12/14/2006, 19:16
As always, thanks for the review!

Here is another switch-up: Kraven the Spider loses the Arch-Enemy Base!

The REV of Kraven is the veteran/Avengers Spider-Man...it's not entirely clear why playing that Spider-Man and any Kraven would be a big deal, but there it is.


Thanks, tidge! I still haven't gotten a KTS and without the figure in front of me I wasn't 100% if he lost the AE base or not. Can't always trust the figure gallery - remember Lester? And, agreed, it isn't a huge deal, but it is worth the mention.

Greenandgold
12/14/2006, 19:46
Great review.

Keep KTS role simple and keep him cheap. I would even avoid heightened reflexes as your opponent is not going to want to waste an attack roll targeting KTS and your goal is to get him in B2B.

Pounce? Definitely not in my book.

bradley2099
12/14/2006, 20:45
It should be a rule that if someone uses Pounce with Kraven, they should say "I am the Spider" during the movment.

Hitsusatsu
12/14/2006, 21:38
I would think him not having an AE base is a given, He thought Spiderman was dead

SilverySurfer
12/14/2006, 23:25
Good, humorous review. I definitely agree with you on the Pounce thing. That feat is like 40% of his cost. Hard to justify with such a spiftastic first click. Thanks for your work.

Thanosworld
12/15/2006, 00:38
Great article! 19 Def up close and personal for 39 pts= headache

cheetor
12/15/2006, 07:09
Cool review (as always) of a great dial of a fantastic version of a fun character from an awesome comic!

Folks, this is what Heroclix is all about as far as I am concerned :cool:

I'm going to mod my Kraven...)

I went for a quick and easy head swap with a spare Sinister Spidey fig. Quick and easy. I would post a pic but I cant manage it from work :ermm:


Seriously, it's not as if they didn't already have a black-costume spider-man sculpt available in the very same set.

I suppose it is because of the way that they are manufactured with every figure in a certain range having an extra version.

Spideys LE slot was already used up with Symbiote. Personally I am glad that they made a Symbiote AND a KTS in the same set. My favourite LEs are the ones that are quite a departure from the REVs rather than just a "better" version.

(Im not sure how to mod my Symbiote fig BTW. Painting the spider emblem black doesnt seem enough somehow. Any ideas?)

Anyway, thanks for the cool review again ol dut!

zero_cochrane
12/15/2006, 08:34
I won Kraven the Spider this week and I'm really keen to use him soon. There's a 200 point game this week... he may very well be a star!

Ghost-x
12/15/2006, 09:34
I won him this past weekend, and although I really like him (both character and 'clix) he really is more fragile than I believe you are presenting him as.

Sure he is a 19 def up close to the piece he is tying up, but he isnt that hard to hit from any ranged attacker, and once hit... well, he falls apart fast.

I like him, but competitive? No. Useful? Yes.

G-x

coyotejack
12/15/2006, 11:50
No mention of pounce... at all? This guy was designed for that feat, bringing him to 54 points. and a heck of a primiary attacker/tie up piece (like the Universe 40 point Spidey)

You cannot play Kraven the Spider without pounce. :grin: I think this guy completely rocks the house. I can't wait to mod him.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to KTS with Pounce as well! He can zip in and crack some big brick for 3 (probably chip him for 1 after reducers) and annoy him further with his (now) 18 DV in Close Combat.

Great write up as always Ol' Dut! Can't wait to try this figure out. :)

55anders
12/15/2006, 13:43
I have read "kravens last hunt" about Kraven almost killing spider-man but not alone are Kraven defeating him, he also take the spider suit on and pretend to be a better spider-man.

I like the dial, Kraven the spider but he is hard to get, and does not have a team ability. I like Veteran Kraven better, because he havs 10 attack (Nice on a sinister syndicate team) and has good defense and damage. But he is also more expensive in points, but he is worth em. Outwit and perplex are also nice on a sinister syndicate team, but if you dont care about the team ability and want him to very cheep points go for Kraven the spider.

tidge
12/15/2006, 16:26
I like the dial, Kraven the spider but he is hard to get, and does not have a team ability. I like Veteran Kraven better, because he havs 10 attack (Nice on a sinister syndicate team) and has good defense and damage.

The Sinister Syndicate TA is IMO better on figures with ranged attacks then on ones without the ranged option...a pair of SinSyn figures sniping away is more effective then trying to negotiate one-or-more of them into base contact (while maintaining adjacency to share AV)...So in this case, dropping both the range and the team ability makes sense to me (from a force build budget).

X-Inferno
12/16/2006, 00:27
Nanobots is the only thing Kraven really needs... with this feat on him, he's gonna be one of the most difficult spider to squash, topping out at a measly 49 points!

Sigdr
12/16/2006, 01:23
I have read "kravens last hunt" about Kraven almost killing spider-man but not alone are Kraven defeating him, he also take the spider suit on and pretend to be a better spider-man.

No, he IS a better Spider-Man - depending on what you consider a good Spider-Man to be. If you consider a good Spider-Man to be effective in combat, Kraven was better - he completely destroyed Vermin, while Peter had to call in help from Captain America to beat Vermin. If you consider a good Spider-Man to be heroic, Kraven was not better.

Anyway, there is a good reason for this Kraven not being a SinSyn member, and it has nothing to do with game functionality.

This Kraven is not a SinSyn member because he does not want to defeat Spider-Man. He wants to destroy Spider-Man / to prove his superiority over Spider-Man, but in Kraven's mind (at this point in his career), the most effective and satisfying way to do that is not to kill him, it is to assume the mantle of Spider-Man - and be a more effective Spider-Man than Spider-Man himself.

XStreme
12/17/2006, 01:59
You know, I thought about Pounce quite a bit, but I just couldn't bring myself to do it. Call me what you will, but I just can't advocate taking an action that puts him off that 19 defense in close combat. Going after an Invulnerable or Impervious opponent, at best you're trading clicks and I'd rather keep the 19 in that situation. Now if he had Super Strength, I'd Pounce the heck out of him. As he stands, I'm gun shy.

Hmm...I have to disagree. While I would be hesitant to use Pounce early and knock Kraven off that 17 defense with Close Combat, it would come in WAY too handy in MANY situations to leave it off. There isn't many characters out there you are going to pounce an Impervious character with before Outwitting his Impervious...it's a big risk to waste an attack and damage your character with a decent chance of not doing anything at all. However, everyone on the opposing team having heavy duty damage reducers is a rare sight. Against anyone with out one he is able to dole out 3 damage with an 11 attack from 9 spaces away on his first click, which add up to a REALLY nice attack ability for a 54 point character. He'd be really effective against most Stealth characters who would lose Stealth after being hit for 3. Plus it even makes him a dangerous attacker on those last two clicks, when normally he isn't going to do much more than sit there and hold someone for a single turn until they hit is low defense. Sure sometimes you are going to want to keep that 19 defense in close combat...but alot of times it isn't going to make much difference at all. If I was going to base someone who had a 12 attack, I'd most likely try to damage them instead of hoping they didn't hit a 19, especially if they have a PCer. Also, against many characters doing 3 damage will lower their AV by AT LEAST 1 and so you are back where you started defense wise.

If you want to get really fancy, I'd say throw on Pounce AND Nanobots. Just make sure you have some sort of transport for him on his Stealth clicks to get to those objects. I always look for characters that go well with Pounce and Nanobots...the problem though is most good Pouncers have Super Strength so they need the objects for damaging not healing. Kraven however makes a really efficient Pouncers who can save the objects for Nanobotting.

Other than that....Great review as always! I'm glad to see that you find him to be as efficient a package as I do. I recently played a 100 point game and I was wishing I had Kraven the Spider because I do believe I would of played him.

Good, humorous review. I definitely agree with you on the Pounce thing. That feat is like 40% of his cost. Hard to justify with such a spiftastic first click. Thanks for your work.

Um...when you look for someone to use Pounce with you WANT someone cheap...so saying it's 40% of his cost isn't a negative against him, it's more a positive...

The Sinister Syndicate TA is IMO better on figures with ranged attacks then on ones without the ranged option...a pair of SinSyn figures sniping away is more effective then trying to negotiate one-or-more of them into base contact (while maintaining adjacency to share AV)...So in this case, dropping both the range and the team ability makes sense to me (from a force build budget).

While SinSyn is easier to use on ranged characters, I wouldn't necessarily say it was better. Blade/Claws/Fangs and Super Strength are two of the best powers when it comes to SinSyn though because they both can do major damage and appear mid and late dial on numerous characters. So when using SinSyn on close combat characters you usually get alot more damage done with the higher attacks. So while it is harder to use in close combat, it seems you often times get more out of it. On Kraven, however, he doesn't ever do too much damage so I agree SinSyn doesn't add much to his playability. If anything, having it on Kraven would give you a cheap figure with a 10 attack to share. Kraven himself probably wouldn't use it to much.

clixer11
12/20/2006, 11:19
Like R Iron Fist, he's definitely good for Pounce. When he Pounces and loses his top click, what changes? He's only paying about 8 points/click even with Pounce...better to give him move/attack instead of forcing him to base an opponent. Heck, even if he Pounces once and only deals three damage before getting shredded, your opponent still had to deal six clicks to him just to get rid of 54 points.

With or without Pounce, he joins the ranks of the "That character is only 39 points?!!?"
R Iron Fist
V Skullbuster
V Asp
R Azrael
LE Roy Harper
R Abbey Chase
R Taskmaster
E Psylocke
LE Madame Hydra

mr_moneypenny
12/20/2006, 13:33
Great review (as always), dut!
The point deployment cost of Mr. The Spider was (in my opinion) SO low compared with his utility, I thought for sure it was a misprint when they originally posted his stats on the WizKids site. Both he and U-Ka-Zar actually made me scratch my head and wonder how one could have figures with those dials and only have to pay 40 points or fewer to use them in a match. It seems that the Zombie dials use this same point formula, as I think they're pretty crazy good for their points...

Quite possibly the best descriptor used in a review ever: " Envision a New Kids on the Block song covered by Alvin and the Chipmunks and then re-imagined as a four hour interpretive dance with full audience participation that you’re forced to suffer through on account of the whole thing’s your girlfriend’s crappy idea. That’s the level of annoying we’re looking at here."
Simply superb. :)

Great read. Thanks again!
-jason

clixer11
12/20/2006, 16:12
Great review (as always), dut!
The point deployment cost of Mr. The Spider was (in my opinion) SO low compared with his utility, I thought for sure it was a misprint when they originally posted his stats on the WizKids site.

Do you remember when LE Talisman was first posted...his point cost was 38.

That lasted for about an hour.

mr_moneypenny
12/20/2006, 20:56
Do you remember when LE Talisman was first posted...his point cost was 38.

That lasted for about an hour.

Yeah, totally! I simply HAD to have that figure... :) lol
And was there a simlar faux pas with the LE Ali Blair (Dazzler)? I remember something vaguely about that... Along with the FCBD Wolvie that originally had an 8 range or something, right?