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View Full Version : The Trophy Room The Trophy Room: Ray Palmer!


ol_Dut
05/17/2007, 13:06
http://www.hcrealms.com/units/or046.jpg
This is so much better than being a little white dot!

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again; Ray Palmer is the luckiest man in the DC universe. End of discussion. Don’t believe me? Just scurry over to your stack of DVDs, grab Justice League Unlimited Season One, disc two and play the episode entitled “Dark Heart”. If you don’t own that fine piece of work, clickity-clack over to one of those sites that sell DVDs, order it up and come right back. You’ll thank me. Seriously. Anyway, now, after a very long wait, four new versions of the Atom have finally appeared in ‘clix, including LE Ray Palmer. Is he as lucky in his HeroClix incarnation as he was in animation? There’s only one way to know; click on “Read More”.

ol_Dut
05/17/2007, 13:13
Here are the dials for Ray Palmer and his closest REV counterpart.

#203 LE Ray Palmer
Team: JLA
Range: 0 /
Points: 58
m-normala-normald-normalg-normal891826918258172581724716247162KOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKO

#048 V The Atom
Team: JLA
Range: 0 /
Points: 64
m-normala-normald-normalg-normal991826101916820168182581725716157151KOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKO

http://www.hcrealms.com/gallery/data/505/atomfinal.jpg
Now this is what I call flying First Class!

LE Ray Palmer’s Gains vs. Veteran Atom
Ray’s list of improvements is as short as he is. He acquires three clicks of Stealth and one of Super Senses to help keep his little self safe. To make him a bit more potent, he’s got nothing but two (2) damage and one more click of nine (9) attack. Sure it’s a short list, but it’s all really good stuff.

LE Ray Palmer’s Losses vs. Veteran Atom
By and large, Ray’s losses aren’t reductions as much as they are wholesale eliminations. Ray drops every shred of Leap/Climb, Combat Reflexes, and Close Combat Expert. He never gets the safety net of the 19 and 20 defense that the Vet has, and he never reaches the 10 attack. The traditional “reductions” he experiences are dropping one click of life, one click of Outwit, and the fact that he suffers from generally slower movement.

Neutral Dial Tinkering
None whatsoever. Everything either makes Ray seem a little bit bigger or a little bit smaller.

Cards That Work
Given his dial full of Perplex and Outwit, Ray Palmer would make an excellent Brilliant Tactician for the JLA. While his movement rate may prohibit him from getting into position on his own, Wonder Woman can solve that problem as seen above. Sneak would also make him a bit more maneuverable if he’s on his own, and Slippery will allow him to get out of just about any tight spot when he’s at the top of his dial.

As far as Battlefield Conditions go, Ray has no business calling the shots. He’s a support piece and as such will need to go along with what’s best for the team.

If ol_Dut had to Choose
LE Ray Palmer vs. Veteran Atom? There is a great deal to like on Veteran Atom’s dial. The 18, 19 and 20 defenses, the 10 attack, the CCE, the extra click of life, and so forth. But in the end, there’s one thing that has me a little worried about him. It’s that first click; specifically that naked 18 defense of his. Sure the 18 looks big, but it’s not as unhittable as it used to be. And this is where the advantage tips in Ray’s favor.

Check out Ray’s first click; 18 defense with Super Senses. It wasn’t until a short while ago when I was playing Vet Shadowcat (SIN) that I was reminded what a beautiful thing it was to have and 18D with SS. When that particular combination wasn’t acting as a deterrent to attacks, it enabled her to go toe to toe with some bruisers and emerge unscathed. So it will be for Ray Palmer. If his 18D with SS doesn’t ward off attacks all by itself, your opponent still has to hit it, and then there’s a 33% chance that it will all be for naught anyway. That’s a great set up for Ray. When that Vet gets hit, and he will, it’s going to stick and he’ll have to eat every click and like it. Even though Ray never reaches that 10 attack, his overall attack numbers are similar enough to the Vet’s that there isn’t any real loss. Adding to his potential is the straight two (2) damage that he’s got across his dial to increase his damage dealing potential. And last but not least, his mid-dial Stealth is just a push away. Although he loses his Super Senses, numerically he remains unchanged and if ranged combat attacks are of greater concern, then Stealth is a great trade for Super Senses. It may not seem like much, but leading off with Super Senses and following with Stealth will do wonders to keep Ray Palmer on the table where the JLA needs him to be. All of this comes in a package that’s just four points more than the old Cosmic Justice Atom, and six points less than the new Veteran, and in totality it makes LE Ray Palmer my choice. So what do you know? Ray is as lucky in 'clix as he is in cartoons!

Quick and Dirty Price Tag
Little guy, little price. Really, really, really little. In fact, if you paid more than $8 for Mr. Palmer you definitely paid too much.

That’s all for this week. Next week we’ll have one final figure from Supernova, and after that it will be Carter Hall. Ya’ll come back now, ya hear? Thanks for reading!

edgreen86
05/17/2007, 13:18
Once again, a great and *useful* review! Rep for you!

bigbro911
05/17/2007, 13:22
Awesome review...these are so helpful!

RavenProject
05/17/2007, 13:23
Just a side note... you know who wrote the episode that made so many of us jealous of Ray Palmer?

Warren Ellis. :)

-J

hobgoblin22
05/17/2007, 13:37
Great review! Personally I still like the Cosmic Justice LE best of all. 20 D, Stealth and Perplex for 50 pts. I still use him. However I agree that the new Ray Palmer is probably a better overall piece then the vet. However I think the rookie is often overlooked but can be very useful for only 24 pts.

Granite Moose
05/17/2007, 13:37
Nice review as usual, ol Dut. I really like how you go into nice detail on these characters including Feats and BFC's that would be useful.

But, what happened to the picture? :( [edit:nevermind, it's back. . . .no, wait, it's gone again. . .and back, hopefully for good.]

St. Cuthbert
05/17/2007, 13:56
Dark Heart is one of the best episodes of JLU ever.

Nice review.

ihavemercy
05/17/2007, 13:57
Useful as ever, even if i disagree/like the vet more.
It is alwasy good to be shown what I am missing by just using my favs instead of taking a look around.

Ghost_Rider
05/17/2007, 14:06
Great review! (Although I must admit, not as great as Ray Palmer's hiding spot in that photo clip).

Marco!

Polbrbrbrbibibrbrbrerbr!:laugh:

tidge
05/17/2007, 14:42
Thanks for this review. The only thing lacking IMO was the original LE Atom's 50 point dial.

I like that the new LE, at 58 points falls neatly between the old LE and the new Vet. There are some things I like much more about the new LE, despite the lower defense/higher cost.

I would always (points allowing) choose the vet Atom: that dial really suits my play style (every piece should be able to contribute in combat).

St-Dumas
05/17/2007, 14:45
Ray: [The experiment's] now the size of my car. Personally, I blame you Jean.
Jean: Me? How can this be my fault.
Ray: Because otherwise it'd be my fault. That can't be right. I'm a scientist.

Best JLU moment ever.

(Also he's voiced by Jon C. McGintly. Go Dr. Cox!)

gatharion
05/17/2007, 15:06
One of the few LEs from Origin that I really want.

My only dissapointments with the new R/E/V+LE are that he doesn't have Expoilt Weakness (a perfect power for him) and that he's wearing the Ryan Choi outfit instead of the classic. Such a shame.

BudPalmer
05/17/2007, 15:10
Uncle Ray always tells the best stories!

Great review.

Zemo13
05/17/2007, 15:12
This is my favorite Atom. Of course, it's also the only Atom I've got...
That defense is pretty sweet though, and I've managed to annoy several opponents with it already.

GroovyBoy
05/17/2007, 15:56
<looks at picture>

Holy carp!! Ray's doing the only thing I've ever wanted to do in my entire life!!!

theanalogkid
05/17/2007, 16:11
I Have the CJ Atom and use no other. I am glad that there is an alternative if I need to use another. Good review as always.

ShellShock
05/17/2007, 16:23
Another great review, you hit it pretty spot on as far as the atom goes

Preacher13
05/17/2007, 16:46
Thanks for the review. I think I'll pick Mr. Palmer up--but will refrain from putting him between my (nonexistant) chesticles...

Assignment:

Someone needs to snap a "Real Life" recreation of the scene and post it here. Don't think my wife has the "supplies" to help me reproduce the image, so it's on one of you guys.

Seems to be tough to find a reasonably priced copy of JLU Season I. I recently bought season II and loved it.

I'm sure I can find it eventually, but if anyone knows of a good place to get a copy, PM me. Thanks.

biz567
05/17/2007, 17:03
Great review! I think both clicks are awesome. I wouldn't mind have Ray Palmer, but the V is pretty nice. Just depends what you really need him for.

Oh, and yes, Dark Heart was an amazing episdoe.

earinfection
05/17/2007, 17:17
[QUOTE=Preacher13]
Assignment:

Someone needs to snap a "Real Life" recreation of the scene and post it here. Don't think my wife has the "supplies" to help me reproduce the image, so it's on one of you guys.

QUOTE]
:cheeky: My wife is more than capable but I'm way too tall for the picture:cheeky:

samuraigrifter
05/17/2007, 20:28
Great review sir! Sadly I only have the Rookie and Experienced versions. I've yet to find the Vet and the LE hasn't been put up as a prize yet in our venues. :disappoin

batjester
05/17/2007, 20:49
I just won Ray the other night, hooray me. I like both the LE and the V but I think if I had the 6 points to spare I'd use the vet. That 20 defence is just a pain.

2 Gun Kid
05/17/2007, 20:51
Just toss ambush on him.

Buddyhoss
05/17/2007, 21:11
Good review! But I think you're mistaken when you said

...one more click of nine (9) attack.

He may have one more click with a 9 attack on it, but there's a 10 in the slot on the Vet. That's not so much a gain.

zero_cochrane
05/17/2007, 21:31
I would definitely favour LE Ray Palmer as a JLA Brilliant Tactician over V The Ray. The point savings isn't huge, but as a Brilliant Tactician you've invested an extra 20 points that means you need to keep him on his top two clicks anyway - so who cares how good the mid-dial is?

And that opening click of Super Senses followed by easily-gained Stealth is very nice.

I'm surprised that he doesn't go for more on eBay, though. Has there been a glut of Ray Palmers?

1clickbraindmg
05/17/2007, 21:40
Great review! Personally I still like the Cosmic Justice LE best of all. 20 D, Stealth and Perplex for 50 pts. I still use him. However I agree that the new Ray Palmer is probably a better overall piece then the vet. However I think the rookie is often overlooked but can be very useful for only 24 pts.

... even more useful in the Marquee, where he had play-it-as-it-lies Hypersonic Speed on that first click. Ha!

Monkey Joe
05/17/2007, 22:34
The vet did wonders for me at the Marquee. At the end of my second match it was him vs. a Vet M. Manhunter, E Green Lantern, and R Mon-el (yeah I got stomped). They were all top-mid dial, Atom was on his 20 Def. He couldn't be touched for the longest time (thanks to high def. and some critical misses). It felt like 10 rounds. Eventualy Mystics and a well placed hit from MM put him down, but he got his three opponents down to, at most, 3 clicks of life left each. Fun times and a match I didn't mind losing.

Ville
05/18/2007, 05:36
I am grateful that I haven't had to face the Vet yet, as he looks like quite horrendous. Mid-dial 20 defense is a frightening prospect, as is his ability to deal 4 damage in close combat. LE doesn't have peaks like this, but sports a steady dial and some value on his every click. I'd definitely take Nanobots for him, as he can Phase away for some "lunch".

Both LE and vet are possibly best Brilliant Tactician in the game, if they don't get affected with Overconfidence...

Mjolnir
05/18/2007, 11:23
I'm in the same boat with the people who ponder the Vets 20D and CCE as positives.
Either one is worthwhile but then again I like the R and E versions too.....

Big Ray Palmer fan here..... or is that an oxymoron? ;)

Bruce Castle
05/18/2007, 18:54
Someone needs to snap a "Real Life" recreation of the scene and post it here. Don't think my wife has the "supplies" to help me reproduce the image, so it's on one of you guys.

I agree! Women dressed up like Wonder Woman are mighty sexy. I like the Ray Palmer the best, he's cheaper than the vet and has super senses too. I never roll it, but it still can be a great power. The 20 defense on the vet is good, but you have to push him there and in my opinion you want to keep the brilliant T, he's awesome.

Vevilaughs
05/21/2007, 15:28
Sorry to be so late on this, but I think I would want the LE over the Vet for the Stealth. Not so much for the range protection... I prefer the protection of Stealth from people Outwitting his Perplex.

With Brilliant Tactician on him, you need to Protect that 20 pt investment from Outwit and Stealth is great option. If he had better movement, I think I would consider Passenger to get him off his 1st click even faster.

That is why I think the CJ puck is the best piece. Stealth/Perplex/20 D... simply the best.

gatharion
05/21/2007, 15:45
Sorry to be so late on this, but I think I would want the LE over the Vet for the Stealth. Not so much for the range protection... I prefer the protection of Stealth from people Outwitting his Perplex.

With Brilliant Tactician on him, you need to Protect that 20 pt investment from Outwit and Stealth is great option. If he had better movement, I think I would consider Passenger to get him off his 1st click even faster.

That is why I think the CJ puck is the best piece. Stealth/Perplex/20 D... simply the best.

Both the Vet and the LE are good Brilliant Tactician pieces for the JLA. And good pieces on their own. However, if you really want him for the sole purpose of using BT, then the old hocky puck is definetly the way to go.

Doc Nebula
05/23/2007, 20:55
I had waited for a Ray Palmer with an actual figure on it even longer than I'd waited for a usable Pym fig. I'm very happy with the Atom REV we now have, except for one thing -- I don't understand why the Vet couldn't have been painted with Ray's costume, rather than Ryan's. For that matter, I don't understand, given that WK has shown remarkable flexibility lately in doing minor sculpt differences across a REV, why the Experienced Atom couldn't have been the barbarian version of Ray, with the sword. A few clicks of BCF might have been a fun innovation. Ah, I really really need to get a job designing dials for WK...

gatharion
05/23/2007, 21:05
I had waited for a Ray Palmer with an actual figure on it even longer than I'd waited for a usable Pym fig. I'm very happy with the Atom REV we now have, except for one thing -- I don't understand why the Vet couldn't have been painted with Ray's costume, rather than Ryan's. For that matter, I don't understand, given that WK has shown remarkable flexibility lately in doing minor sculpt differences across a REV, why the Experienced Atom couldn't have been the barbarian version of Ray, with the sword. A few clicks of BCF might have been a fun innovation. Ah, I really really need to get a job designing dials for WK...

Give the Vet Ray's costume?
The Experienced, Vet, and LE all should have been in the classic Palmer duds. It drives me up a wall that we got saddled with the Rookie's paint job.

I also would have prefered to see a "Sword of the Atom" Experienced over the Teen Titans version that we got.

FYI, Sword of the Atom will be out as a tpb this fall.

Doc Nebula
05/24/2007, 05:58
Give the Vet Ray's costume?
The Experienced, Vet, and LE all should have been in the classic Palmer duds. It drives me up a wall that we got saddled with the Rookie's paint job.

I also would have prefered to see a "Sword of the Atom" Experienced over the Teen Titans version that we got.

FYI, Sword of the Atom will be out as a tpb this fall.

For what it's worth, I in no way enjoyed or endorsed Ray's brief diversion into dementia under the logo SORT OF THE ATOM. I always thought it was an utterly horrible idea, and a real waste of the Atom. However, you think you've seen the worst possible thing they can do to your favorite character, and you find out you're wrong, wrong, wrong. It's like that whole horrible Detroit HQ AQUAMAN AND THE OUTSIDERS era of Justice League. You think that's as bad as it can possibly get... I mean, geez, how could it GET worse than Vibe, Gypsy, and/or Kid Steel?... but then, along come Giffen and Jones and DeMatteis a few years later, and you actually wish for Conway and Luke McDonnell back again.

(Well, no, nothing could ever make a thinking being wish for Conway and McDonnell back again on JLA, not even Giffen, Jones, and deMatteis, but certainly, it makes you realize that no matter how bad things are, they can always get worse.)

I was very pleased when Roger Stern rehabilitated Ray in POWER OF THE ATOM, although I wasn't wild about the 'modernization' of his costume and the 'upgrades' to his powers, and his All New, All Pissy attitude was teh suck. But at least he wasn't running around acting like a two inch high John Carter, Warlord of Hicksville any more. But they couldn't leave him like that; noooooo, they had to regress him to his teenage years and give him amnesia and have somebody else take over the size control belt in SUICIDE SQUAD and I don't know WHAT all else, and then, they had to have his ex wife kill Sue Dibney and turn into Eclipso... I mean, arrrggghhhh...

Don't get me wrong. I like Ryan Choi, he's just no Ray Palmer. And I do think that, after WK stiffed us for so long on a good Palmer figure (and the puck's dial was fabulous), they could have given us at least one figure in this REV that actually had Ray's costume design on it.

But it's a minor thing, compared to stuff like, you know, how deeply they'd screwed Hank Pym up until SUPERNOVA.