View Full Version : NFL Go Colts!
lensnart
09/24/2007, 16:47
I smell repeat, at the beginning of the season everyone was saying that the Colts were low top five in the league but it looks like they are still number one.
The offense is great, Addai is living up to the hype, and a full season with Bob Sanders leading the D makes all the difference.
Almost everyone we lost, fatty Simon, Doss, Harper and David make the team stronger by their absence. the Colts lost some bad attitudes that weren'y very talented and replaced every one with a promising hard working young player. the only one that could bite us is Rhodes, but Addai is handling the load pretty well so far.
This is a better team than last year, with a weaker schedule, and they are on road for a repeat.
I'm rather disappointed in their defense, yet again. We saw a huge difference with Bob Sanders last year, but this year, it seems that the defense is asleep at the wheel again. They're winning extremely close games that have no business getting this close. Not when they're putting up 20-30 points a game.
It's not QUITE as bad as last year, but they have a lot of room for improvement, still.
Definitely a better offense than last year's, though. They may not be scoring as many points, but they're more effective.
spiderman9797
09/24/2007, 16:58
I would rank them the best team in the NFL, but they simply aren't because the Patriots are. The Patriots have, arguably, as good of an offense as the Colts while having an exponentially better Defense.
lensnart
09/28/2007, 15:02
I'm rather disappointed in their defense, yet again. We saw a huge difference with Bob Sanders last year, but this year, it seems that the defense is asleep at the wheel again. They're winning extremely close games that have no business getting this close. Not when they're putting up 20-30 points a game.
It's not QUITE as bad as last year, but they have a lot of room for improvement, still.
Definitely a better offense than last year's, though. They may not be scoring as many points, but they're more effective.
They are fifth in the league in team defence, I don't know what you expect from them, they aren't going to be the Bears. I can only assume that you have fallen into the same trap as many of the sports pundits and are bagging on their D out of habit.
They are fifth in the league in team defence, I don't know what you expect from them, they aren't going to be the Bears. I can only assume that you have fallen into the same trap as many of the sports pundits and are bagging on their D out of habit.
They're 5th in the league in team defense, STAT-WISE. And when you consider the fact that they've played against:
1. New Orleans- has absolutely no offense at all this year. None. Period.
2. Tennessee- is still running a young offense, which still almost beat them. They only lost by 2 points.
3. Houston- Scored 24 points, and this is Shaub's first year starting.
I mean, I could say that Pittsburgh's defense is 2nd in the league, speaking as a Steelers' fan, and the stats would support that. But when you look at their opponents:
1. Cleveland- need I say more?
2. Buffalo- need I say more?
3. San Francisco- okay, they're not a bad team......but they're not good, either.
I'm not going to say that Pittsburgh doesn't need improvement, when I look at the fact that these three opponents have scored 26 collective points. That's high, considering Pittsburgh is supposed to have one of the best defenses in the NFL, and those three teams suck. 15-20 points? I can see that. 26?
I find it equally disheartening to see an "awesome Colts Defense" give up 54 points in just 3 games. Considering their opponents, I'm going to be even more unforgiving about it. They're going to step it up when they play better opponents, just like everyone else does, but it doesn't make me feel any more confident about their defense.
NeoShazam
09/28/2007, 19:07
There are few things better than having the mind of a champion.
Indianapolis has the confidence of a champion and they are going to be tough to beat. I think we are all waiting for the epic clash of champions where we see New England versus Indianapolis again.
This year I think it goes to New England and I think they smother the Bears.
lensnart
10/01/2007, 16:04
They're 5th in the league in team defense, STAT-WISE.
Stat-wise is really the only way you can judge these things. You can make excuses for anything but unless they fall in the rankings the fact remains that they are a good defense that is helping the colts win games.
Stat-wise is really the only way you can judge these things. You can make excuses for anything but unless they fall in the rankings the fact remains that they are a good defense that is helping the colts win games.
....no, it's not the only way you can judge these things. You can observe who their opponents have been, and what their trends are in order to determine how good they are. Analysts do it every minute of every day to determine power rankings, fantasy picks, you name it. They don't just look at base stats and jump off a bridge. That argument for using stats as a one and only approach to sports performance is tired, wrong, and short-sighted. If we just looked at things stat-wise, Drew Brees and Lee Evans are the worst players in the NFL.......yet we all know that isn't true at all, because we can determine their worth by other means.
Nor is it factual that they are a good defense. I think they're a decent defense myself, but that doesn't make it factual. It's factual that they're ranked as the 13th best defense in the league, but that doesn't mean that they ARE the 13th best defense in the league. And yes, you can determine where they should be ranked in other ways.
lensnart
10/03/2007, 04:06
The stats have changed since I first posted, but I still don't think you can just discard stats if they don't support your argument. Like I said before you can argue for anything if you want to.
If I ranked them your way I would says that they took on NFC finalists in the first game and shut them down so bad that they still haven't recovered, and then went undefeated against a Houston team that was coming off a hot week and are a good team when their star reciever plays (and he did), and last week they shut down a decent Denver team (that was only missing defensive starters) on all but the first drive.
They are undefeated against three teams that are at or above .500 and last years NFC finalist, that sounds like a fairly strong schedule to me.
And besides you can say whatever you want about their D, all I have to say is 4 and 0.
The stats have changed since I first posted, but I still don't think you can just discard stats if they don't support your argument. Like I said before you can argue for anything if you want to.
That's my point. It's subjective reasoning, but it's actually far more accurate than taking base stats and jumping off a bridge with them. Stats ARE important for determining who better players and teams are, but you shouldn't just take them as the end-all be-all. That's sloppy.
Besides, it's more fun to argue about who's better. :)
If I ranked them your way I would says that they took on NFC finalists in the first game and shut them down so bad that they still haven't recovered, and then went undefeated against a Houston team that was coming off a hot week and are a good team when their star reciever plays (and he did), and last week they shut down a decent Denver team (that was only missing defensive starters) on all but the first drive.
They are undefeated against three teams that are at or above .500 and last years NFC finalist, that sounds like a fairly strong schedule to me.
And besides you can say whatever you want about their D, all I have to say is 4 and 0.
I would agree with the strong schedule, but I don't think they've hit it yet. And I'm still not certain that their defense can be attributed with the Saints collapse. Denver has a dismal offense when they play high-pedigree teams. They'll make the playoffs again this year, and not get to the Super Bowl, that seems to be Shannahan's strategy these days....
Indy HAS improved, don't get me wrong. I've been saying for years that they needed to start establishing a running game, and Addai has been nothing short of awesome this season. The question is whether or not Peyton gets selfish and wants to get his numbers up again, instead of W's. But I think he knows by now what wins championships. ;)
machineman
10/03/2007, 22:59
I think everyone knows it's gonna be Indy and NE to the championship. I think neither's defensive unit has gotten them where they are thus far, and I daresay, what will carry them through the season. Whoever's defense is weaker will lose in a matchup between the two. Unless its a sloppily played game for one or the other with alot of turnovers. I'd love to see this match-up in a rain-soaked outdoor arena, but that ain't gonna happen. Either way I hope the Colts prevail. As far as the AFC goes I can cheer for them and the surprising Titans(heck, I'm a native Tennessean, I have to pull for those guys). But I'm always gonna be hoping the Colts "bring it on home", unless my Cowboys can actually make it to the big dance, then I'll be torn, but edging towards the 'Boys.
I think everyone knows it's gonna be Indy and NE to the championship. I think neither's defensive unit has gotten them where they are thus far, and I daresay, what will carry them through the season. Whoever's defense is weaker will lose in a matchup between the two. Unless its a sloppily played game for one or the other with alot of turnovers. I'd love to see this match-up in a rain-soaked outdoor arena, but that ain't gonna happen. Either way I hope the Colts prevail. As far as the AFC goes I can cheer for them and the surprising Titans(heck, I'm a native Tennessean, I have to pull for those guys). But I'm always gonna be hoping the Colts "bring it on home", unless my Cowboys can actually make it to the big dance, then I'll be torn, but edging towards the 'Boys.
I know this is coming from a Steelers fan, but there are a lot of teams that Indy and NE can't afford to ignore.
Pittsburgh and Tennessee are probably going to be in the playoffs. And Denver is going to make their typical appearance, and loss to someone. Tennessee, IMO, is going to be tough to beat. Indy already had a near-death experience with them.
But the Dark Horse is the real question. Right now, it comes down to Cleveland and Oakland for me, which is pretty scary. I seriously see either of these teams pulling it together and making it to the playoffs. And if they pull it off, they're going to be very nasty to beat. Oakland is finally playing with a lot of heart, and Cleveland is on an upswing thanks to Derek Anderson's enthusiasm. A close 3rd for the Dark Horse is Kansas City. If Huard and Bowe keep hooking up like this, Gonzalez is going to start catching the ball again as well. And LJ will have more and more holes to run through. We might start seeing the Kansas City offense we were used to 2-3 years ago, that scored 60 points a game. What's scary is....they're playing defense this time..... :confused:
machineman
10/04/2007, 01:10
I agree, its too early to be counting most teams out of the hunt, but c'mon NE and Indy have been rather like juggernaughts so far. Yeah seasons are filled with ups and downs, but I think those 2 teams outclass the rest of the AFC, from what I've seen. The other teams you mention are showing good potential, but they've gotta go through the season also. The old addage of "that's why they play the games" certainly does apply this, and every season though. I'm not totally discounting the other strong teams. I've never been a follower of the "good on paper" type of mentality, and I truely believe any team can beat any other team "on any given Sunday", but those 2 beat the others hands down in terms of being impressive so far this year, to me.
Are there any other good football cliches I forgot to put in here? I hate cliches, sorry about that.
lensnart
10/24/2007, 20:42
I can't wait for November 4th, that is going to be one heck of a game, I wouldn;t be surprised to see NE falter this week, due to looking ahead to next week.
jsoccerdude
11/04/2007, 20:29
Ok, after Brady and Bellicheck run up the score like @$$'s in the other games, this game, they take knees with a minute left.
That pisses me off.
And our first TD,that they said didn't count?
It counted! We had a hold of it when we hit the ground, then it rolled out and they said had no hold on it. Damn it.
Ah well. We'll see who the real team is when Brady loses in the AFC Championship.
St. Cuthbert
11/04/2007, 21:48
Ok, after Brady and Bellicheck run up the score like @$$'s in the other games, this game, they take knees with a minute left.
That pisses me off.
And our first TD,that they said didn't count?
It counted! We had a hold of it when we hit the ground, then it rolled out and they said had no hold on it. Damn it.
Ah well. We'll see who the real team is when Brady loses in the AFC Championship.
I unfortunately wasn't able to watch the actual game, so I can't comment on the bad call for the TD.
But every single team in the NFL would take a knee with a minute left when they're winning against the Indianapolis Colts. There's no way you can complain about that. It's just smart football.
jsoccerdude
11/04/2007, 21:59
I unfortunately wasn't able to watch the actual game, so I can't comment on the bad call for the TD.
But every single team in the NFL would take a knee with a minute left when they're winning against the Indianapolis Colts. There's no way you can complain about that. It's just smart football.
Yeah, I realize my post here was sounding a little b****y.
In a post on another forum, I did admit that it was just smart playing on their part.
malakim2099
11/05/2007, 13:19
Well, the ironic thing here... is that I think the Colts wouldn't mind playing in Foxboro instead of Indy in the AFC Championship. Really, they are playing more of a smashmouth offense than the Pats, who are doing the Colts offense from a few years ago.
Just remember who won those early Colts v. Pats matchups in the playoffs. ;)
And our first TD,that they said didn't count?
It counted! We had a hold of it when we hit the ground, then it rolled out and they said had no hold on it. Damn it.
Well, you were handed 10 points on bad pass interference calls, so I don't think it's that bad that they didn't call it a TD when he actually failed to have control of the ball the entire time. :rolleyes: :p
NeoShazam
11/12/2007, 00:41
OMG.
I feel sorry for the Colts tonight , they outplayed San Diego up and down outside those 2 blown special teams.
-Blown Ref call on that INT returned to the opposing 7.
-Missed Horsecollar call on Merriman tackling Addai.
-"simulated snap" penalty on Ben Utecht when it was 4th and 1.
Argh.
Colts and Manning played like Champs...need to keep the injuries down.
machineman
11/12/2007, 01:21
They will be fine with 2 loses. If they can get healthy, that is. Manning's 6 picks also had alot to do with this loss, not just the kick returns and refs, just to be fair.
I feel sorry for the Colts tonight , they outplayed San Diego up and down outside those 2 blown special teams.
..Were we watching the same game?
The one where Manning got 6 INTs?
That's outplaying someone? :confused:
lensnart
11/12/2007, 03:49
..Were we watching the same game?
The one where Manning got 6 INTs?
That's outplaying someone? :confused:
Sadly, yes. All of those INT's were in the first half, (except for the last second hail mary which is like counting an empty net goal against a goalie in hockey), and the Chargers did outplay the Colts in that half, but I would argue that the Colts outplayed the Chargers even more in the second. Even with all of the INT's Manning still played a far better game then Rivers and Indy's Defense totally shut San Diego down.
Even with their worst performance in years, without bad special teams on O and D, there would be a 19 point shift and this is a lobsided Colts victory, unfortunately woulda's and coulda's don't get W's.
Sadly, yes. All of those INT's were in the first half, (except for the last second hail mary which is like counting an empty net goal against a goalie in hockey), and the Chargers did outplay the Colts in that half, but I would argue that the Colts outplayed the Chargers even more in the second. Even with all of the INT's Manning still played a far better game then Rivers and Indy's Defense totally shut San Diego down.
Even with their worst performance in years, without bad special teams on O and D, there would be a 19 point shift and this is a lobsided Colts victory, unfortunately woulda's and coulda's don't get W's.
The Pats broke Manning, he's done. :p
lensnart
11/12/2007, 04:09
The Pats broke Manning, he's done. :p
Dude, that sort of talk isn't going to win you any friends in these parts;) Just wait until Marvin is back in the playoffs and we will see who breaks who.
mutter mutter, stupid patriots, big dumb jerks, stupid dumb brady and his big dumb face, mutter, mutter
Dude, that sort of talk isn't going to win you any friends in these parts;) Just wait until Marvin is back in the playoffs and we will see who breaks who.
mutter mutter, stupid patriots, big dumb jerks, stupid dumb brady and his big dumb face, mutter, mutter
Hey, if everyone is going to talk about how the Pats are the bad guys of the NFL, I might as well embrace it. :p
NeoShazam
11/12/2007, 14:41
..Were we watching the same game?
The one where Manning got 6 INTs?
That's outplaying someone? :confused:
Look at SDiego's Offensive Stats. Those 2 blown special teams plays = 13 points. SD accounted for 10 more in the first half and then got nothing. That blown INT Return call would've gotten Indy their first TD score way earlier.
Plus that 4th and 1 call was crucial, though Tony Dungy said he wasn't going to go for it, their offense and Manning's gestures show otherwise, they just needed a yard and it was presumably over.
If Vinatieri doesn't blow that freakishly routine kick ( by 1 yard ) its back on the SD Offense that hadn't realized there was a 2nd half of football to play.
So yes , I think a team that got 5 crucial INTs and 1 extra were outplayed to win by 2 when the refs and a marquee kicker miss key plays.
Look at SDiego's Offensive Stats. Those 2 blown special teams plays = 13 points. SD accounted for 10 more in the first half and then got nothing. That blown INT Return call would've gotten Indy their first TD score way earlier.
Plus that 4th and 1 call was crucial, though Tony Dungy said he wasn't going to go for it, their offense and Manning's gestures show otherwise, they just needed a yard and it was presumably over.
If Vinatieri doesn't blow that freakishly routine kick ( by 1 yard ) its back on the SD Offense that hadn't realized there was a 2nd half of football to play.
So yes , I think a team that got 5 crucial INTs and 1 extra were outplayed to win by 2 when the refs and a marquee kicker miss key plays.
Man, that is a whole lot of rationalizing there. They got outplayed by a lesser team. Rivers didn't throw 6 interceptions did he?
Indy was lucky to be in a position to win at the end. Yeah, Vinatieri should have made that kick, but Manning should have been more accurate, and special teams should have made their plays.
Bad calls happen all the time. Talent overcomes the bad call in my book.
Indy had a bad day is all. Maybe they had a bit of a Patriots hangover? :rolleyes:
Look at SDiego's Offensive Stats. Those 2 blown special teams plays = 13 points. SD accounted for 10 more in the first half and then got nothing. That blown INT Return call would've gotten Indy their first TD score way earlier.
Plus that 4th and 1 call was crucial, though Tony Dungy said he wasn't going to go for it, their offense and Manning's gestures show otherwise, they just needed a yard and it was presumably over.
If Vinatieri doesn't blow that freakishly routine kick ( by 1 yard ) its back on the SD Offense that hadn't realized there was a 2nd half of football to play.
So yes , I think a team that got 5 crucial INTs and 1 extra were outplayed to win by 2 when the refs and a marquee kicker miss key plays.
All I'm sezzin is when you toss 6 INTs in a game, you're not outplaying anyone. Especially when a few of them were just poor poor decisions on Manning's part.
NeoShazam
11/12/2007, 15:20
Those INTs were basically punts. Cromartie made a great catch on the one handed INT.
Maybe a Patriot hangover on Special teams but they just kept getting more injuries which doesn't help either.
And Rivers tossed 2 INTs and fumbled a TD away to let the Colts back in.
Those INTs were basically punts. Cromartie made a great catch on the one handed INT.
:confused: You're reachin' there dude.
NeoShazam
11/12/2007, 15:27
:confused: You're reachin' there dude.
Obviously they aren't literally punts. But I don't consider them devastating because they still should've/could've/would've won that game.
Somebody needs to open a Bengals/49ers thread (then again with their years, maybe not) , I'm not even really a Colts fan but this loss was about as bad as the Bills losing that one to Dallas on MNF.
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