View Full Version : The "Tips for Running a Mafia Game" Thread
It's alive again! Glorious rebirth!
Alright, carry on with whatever it is you do here.
charlesx
08/18/2008, 15:15
I'd tell you to go to the "need to vent" thread, but it had to be closed. :cry:
Seriously? Who closed it???
Truffle Shuffle
08/18/2008, 15:18
It was closed b/c some poopie heads couldn't control themselves and vented about being killed, but gave away too much info in their vents.
Personally, I used to love venting about work in that thread. Now I'm going to have to keep it all bottled up, resulting in me one day blowing up and leaving behind a really big mess for you all to clean up.
It was closed b/c some poopie heads couldn't control themselves and vented about being killed, but gave away too much info in their vents.
Personally, I used to love venting about work in that thread. Now I'm going to have to keep it all bottled up, resulting in me one day blowing up and leaving behind a really big mess for you all to clean up.
Really? If it were me, I'd just look at your avatar for awhile. The little people make me laugh.
Darkseid Sr.
08/18/2008, 18:07
I need someone to write my roles, because I'm lazy :cheeky:
sstralkowski
08/21/2008, 06:52
what? why? that thread is great!
Seriously? Who closed it???
I did. Because people keep venting about stuff from current games. It's become a borderline source for cheats. It's like the Napster of Mafia.
Maniac_nmt
08/21/2008, 07:12
Personally, I used to love venting about work in that thread. Now I'm going to have to keep it all bottled up, resulting in me one day blowing up and leaving behind a really big mess for you all to clean up.
Can I rent Daisy Maids to come clean up instead?:knockedou
St-Dumas
09/13/2008, 05:37
What's a good ratio of townies to non/anti-townies?
Amora's_best_friend
09/13/2008, 05:41
What's a good ratio of townies to non/anti-townies?
Depends how strong the townies are.
St-Dumas
09/13/2008, 14:13
So, like what?
I'd do something like 60% are town, 25% are mafia (either one or two) and the other 15% is independants (SK and others with flexible/alternate win conditions). I alter the other stuff in my games like the mafia and independants but the town is usually roughly the same amount as in others, its a delecate balance, too many townies and the mafia will never win, to few and it makes it too easy for the mafia to win and more difficult for the town to ever survive.
Note to self: In all future games, if I include a night-phase-skipping power, it will not be usable on night one.
Just wondered if anyones done a game where roles are given out but no powers are given with the roles? Only the mod knows who has what powers and basically everyone has to target someone during the night phase. You'd only discover what you did after night 1. I thought it'd be cool as you'd have someone with a kill power not knowing if they were the vig or the SK, the mafia would be in contact with each other but have no idea who's the don, misdirector, roleblocker etc......
Just something to ponder :)
Just wondered if anyones done a game where roles are given out but no powers are given with the roles? Only the mod knows who has what powers and basically everyone has to target someone during the night phase. You'd only discover what you did after night 1. I thought it'd be cool as you'd have someone with a kill power not knowing if they were the vig or the SK, the mafia would be in contact with each other but have no idea who's the don, misdirector, roleblocker etc......
Just something to ponder :)
Mmmmmmmm... no. You'd have to, at the very least, give out win conditions; the serial killer would know who they were simply by the "Be the last thing left alive" win condition.
Other than that... Part of the game is knowing what you can do -- and that others know what they can do. If you know Player A was antagonizing Player B, and Player B turns up dead, and Player A swears they have no idea how it happened... well, it's easier to tell if someone's lying when you know for a fact "I don't know what I can do" isn't an answer. You'd be giving a free-and-clear excuse to anyone for any night action... because anyone could be a bus driver or other misdirector.
Amora's_best_friend
10/20/2008, 18:37
Don't realise you hate all the roles in a game after you set the game up.
sstralkowski
10/23/2008, 08:14
I agree with the grand daddy of mafia...
The Vision
01/19/2009, 14:48
This is a great thread.
I took lots of this advice to heart when writing my first game.
Wade Wilson
02/18/2009, 01:25
so if you wanted to run a 16 person mafia game, how many of each role should there about be? (mafia, town, neutral?) sorry, trying to run my first game, and am trying to flesh out some roles tonight =/ if someone also wouldn't mind helping me out with the balancing of roles and what not as well, it would be greatly appreciated...
CarlosMucha
02/18/2009, 01:31
so if you wanted to run a 16 person mafia game, how many of each role should there about be? (mafia, town, neutral?) sorry, trying to run my first game, and am trying to flesh out some roles tonight =/ if someone also wouldn't mind helping me out with the balancing of roles and what not as well, it would be greatly appreciated...
never done a game with less than 20 players. :p
I think 1 Mafia for every 3 town is good as start.
Wade Wilson
02/18/2009, 01:33
never done a game with less than 20 players. :p
I think 1 Mafia for every 3 town is good as start.
was what i thought, thanks :)
sstralkowski
02/19/2009, 07:02
so if you wanted to run a 16 person mafia game, how many of each role should there about be? (mafia, town, neutral?) sorry, trying to run my first game, and am trying to flesh out some roles tonight =/ if someone also wouldn't mind helping me out with the balancing of roles and what not as well, it would be greatly appreciated...
In a game with likely only 4 mafia, you'll not be able to get allt he typical mafia powers into the mix so I suggest maybe making one or two of them able to do one of two powers each night. For example, mafia henchman #1 can either RB or misdirect. Henchman #2 can either doctor or track, etc. Be sure to give the don an active power like reflecting or double voting if he does not make the hit.
Wade Wilson
02/19/2009, 07:08
ok, thanks :) i think i basically got everything, been working with Darq on balancing things out...just need players =/ is there some trick to getting players to join your game? or is it just like hit or miss?
Hmmmmm, dunno, i think if you ran a first good game and people liked it a load more will sign up for the sequel, but as for your first game just try and make the topic material very interesting/commercial, doesn't hurt to tell people its your first mafia game either so they will take pity and sign up lol
With their superpowers they unite!!!
Do doo do doo doo do do dooite!
They got the badguys on the run!
They never stop til the job is done!
And when the world is losing all controooooooooool!!
TEEN TITANS GO!!!!!!!!!!
Yes, still need 6 players to get things going, help me out kids, will be fun i promise!
sstralkowski
02/19/2009, 10:12
ok, thanks :) i think i basically got everything, been working with Darq on balancing things out...just need players =/ is there some trick to getting players to join your game? or is it just like hit or miss?
Not really sure. I know I usually sign up for games of new mods just to help them fill it. Course, I've been cutting way back on my games recently in anticipation of my new work obligations. I know topic helps a lot as goodman noted. I tend to think that having a good mod as a mentor helps as well, but that's not a proven theory.
Wade Wilson
02/19/2009, 13:02
what if i say sign up, IS IMPORTANT?
Wade Wilson
02/22/2009, 21:18
how descriptive do you get in write-ups? i'm a very descriptive writer (not for ummm characters, but other things)
DarqFeonix
02/23/2009, 12:14
how descriptive do you get in write-ups? i'm a very descriptive writer (not for ummm characters, but other things)
Have fun with the write-ups, but the number one mistake a n00b mod can make is making everyone a flavor cop from the write-ups. If a Tracker tracks a Mafia RB'ing someone, it shouldn't appear in the write-up as "A perfect little angel spots a horrible monster pinning someone down". If the person is not an info gatherer, you shouldn't allow them to guess who mafia is from a write-up.
Sometimes you can throw some flavor text of your own in on stuff that doesn't really happen, to really confuse people. PaxZRake does a really good job of this in his games, he could give you some pointers.
PaxZRake
02/23/2009, 12:35
Sometimes you can throw some flavor text of your own in on stuff that doesn't really happen, to really confuse people. PaxZRake does a really good job of this in his games, he could give you some pointers.
Aw, I'm loved :)
A large part of my write up style comes from my love of playing as Mafia or Serial Killer. I think the worst thing that can happen to me in those roles is when it comes down to end game, everyone else can point to their character in the writeups and I'm left claiming some random who hasn't at all shown in the write up, it's hopeless.
The only people who make my write ups are killers and their victims. If it's a mafia hit person or serial killer I'll open up and even use their names in the write up, I don't see much point in hiding whom the enemy is.
The last few games I've ran I decided to play around with NPCs (Non-Player Characters) to enhance write ups without giving anyone a distinct advantage. I rather liked the effect it had on my creative process for the write up. My favorite bits being Arkillo foaming at the mouth hoping everyone he kills is Kilowog (even though Kilowog wasn't in the game) and Big Words falling in love with Natasha Irons on a night without any kills(neither of which were in the game, but both played an important part in the overall story).
I also really reccomend giving an active player a "Writer" role. I find that its effect on the game is really worthwhile.
That being said, I think CharlesX probably writes my favorite write ups, they're long as all hell, but totally worth the read.
Wade Wilson
02/23/2009, 12:44
ok, thanks trying to make sure everything is completly set-up right for when i get enough players
sstralkowski
02/24/2009, 23:20
To add to what both Darq and Pax said, I will purposely put things in there that could have more than one meaning. The SK (Bananas in Pajamas) in Monkey Mafia was described as both Silken stalkers and having sharp tyeeth and red eyes. People took it to mean that the vampire was not eradicated when in fact it was completrely gone on night 2. You want the story to progress but at the same time allow wiggle room for the baddies. It is fun to put both very significant hints and completely useless ones into the write-ups. It keep people guessing as to which are which.
As a side note, don't hesitate to make some roles dumb and or useless. It makes people think twice about disregarding a flawed roleclaim, true or false. It also gives the baddies even more wiggle room as their claims need not be airtight. See Guinan in Star Trek, Tardy in Random, Chicken Boo in Kids' Show, etc. Those kinds of roles leave people scratching their heads at the end of the game and wondering if I'm on crack, but I love them.
Wade Wilson
02/25/2009, 00:37
i think i have some of those :D it should be fun, i hope...just having issues getting players, seems it isn't a subject people are too into, just thought it'd be an easy fun theme to do for a first game
Wade Wilson
03/18/2009, 03:19
anyone know how to randomize roles using excel? :S i can't get it to work, i can't even get numbers 1-15 to show up in a random order...
DarqFeonix
03/18/2009, 03:23
=Rand() next to each role
=Rank(single rand() cell, All Rand cells)
Hit F9 a few times.
Copy all and Paste Values.
I think that's how I do it...
Wade Wilson
03/18/2009, 03:27
i found a list randomizer...
Wade Wilson
03/21/2009, 04:54
there any mods on that aren't in the nick jr mafia game that could look over my first night write-up please? :S i'm a bit worried it says too much
sstralkowski
03/21/2009, 14:23
there any mods on that aren't in the nick jr mafia game that could look over my first night write-up please? :S i'm a bit worried it says too much
I would just look over the write-up. If you see any way that someone could identify themself and get a useful clue about who they targetted, then edit out some details. The write-ups should be almost solely for flavor and paranoia factor.
Wade Wilson
03/21/2009, 14:26
it should be thanks :D i posted it, had 3 people look over it, one person's never played mafia in his life XD it made him interested he said without knowing too much of what was going on...
Wade Wilson
04/15/2009, 23:37
how many alt win conditions are considered too much in a mafia game?
CarlosMucha
04/15/2009, 23:50
how many alt win conditions are considered too much in a mafia game?
I like to do crazy games, so for me is not limit. it depends of the character and the story that I want to tell.
Wade Wilson
04/16/2009, 00:00
o, ok...hmm, thanks :D
PaxZRake
04/16/2009, 05:39
how many alt win conditions are considered too much in a mafia game?
Personally, I like to make at least half the players normal townies.
Wade Wilson
04/16/2009, 06:05
ok, thanks :) think i got it set...just need to finish a few roles
sstralkowski
06/26/2009, 09:03
When co-modding a game, I highly recommend a google doc as Thawmus has been saying for a long long time now. I also recommend a separate proboard just for the mods to talk about issues and write the story and roles out before posting.
sstralkowski
08/14/2009, 12:18
In case it hasn't been posted on here yet, all doublers and mind controllers should not be able to target the same player twice. All silencers should not be able to target the same player twice in a row.
Maniac_nmt
08/14/2009, 14:05
When co-modding a game, I highly recommend a google doc as Thawmus has been saying for a long long time now. I also recommend a separate proboard just for the mods to talk about issues and write the story and roles out before posting.
I use Microsoft Excel to plot a lot of stuff out, and then word to get it organized for actions and spell checking (and I still goof!:tired::p:grin:).
sstralkowski
08/14/2009, 14:13
I use Microsoft Excel to plot a lot of stuff out, and then word to get it organized for actions and spell checking (and I still goof!:tired::p:grin:).
I have evolved into the Thawmus method. I use a proboard for my roles and write-ups, and an excel google doc for my spreadsheet.
Maniac_nmt
08/14/2009, 14:28
I have evolved into the Thawmus method. I use a proboard for my roles and write-ups, and an excel google doc for my spreadsheet.
I used a proboard+spreadsheet+sketchbook+paint+gimp(freeware art program)+word+other fiddly bits for MITP.
Despite having grown up with a pc (had one in the house since I was 4 or 5, back when a color monitor meant it could be white+black, purple+black, and amber+black, I remember thinking that was awesome when we got that first color monitor...) I'm a curmudgeon when it comes to things like google docs, facebook, twitter, etc.
Proboards can be helpful for sure though. Let's you get formatting in the first time, without having to mess with it here.
sstralkowski
08/14/2009, 14:32
I used a proboard+spreadsheet+sketchbook+paint+gimp(freeware art program)+word+other fiddly bits for MITP.
Despite having grown up with a pc (had one in the house since I was 4 or 5, back when a color monitor meant it could be white+black, purple+black, and amber+black, I remember thinking that was awesome when we got that first color monitor...) I'm a curmudgeon when it comes to things like google docs, facebook, twitter, etc.
Proboards can be helpful for sure though. Let's you get formatting in the first time, without having to mess with it here.
I was the exact same way. Totally feel the opposite now that I was forced to try it when Darq and I ran Gremlins together. No way we could have e-mailed the files back and forth during that game. Would have been a train wreck.
h2raider
04/03/2010, 11:51
I don't plan on running a game for a VERY long time (if at all) but out of curiosity, what is good ratio for town: neutral: mafia? Also let's say there's a bulletproof player that roleblocks anyone who targets him. He get's targeted by a roleblocker and a killer the same night, what happens?
I like the idea of 50:25:25.
It might seem a bit lopsided against the Town, but it always seems to magically balance itself out.
I never have nearly that many neutrals. A serial killer or two, a couple neutral survivors and maybe an alternate win condition.
That's about as many as I would ever have.
The BoyBlunder
04/03/2010, 17:16
I never have nearly that many neutrals. A serial killer or two, a couple neutral survivors and maybe an alternate win condition.
That's about as many as I would ever have.
Same
:bolt:
DocDoom187
08/22/2010, 02:37
I made a more complex version of an early Stan Excel sheet. My first game was shoddily thrown together, mainly because I didn't care about writeups (still don't really) and things like that.
Now I'm super organized and Stan-like. Let's hope it makes a difference.
Jerry_Damage01
11/10/2010, 11:48
So I'm ready to give modding another go around. I've got my roles written, but I'd like to have someone go over them to ensure I've got everything balanced. My first game was pro-town and I'd like to try to keep it as even as I can this time around. So, is there another mod who won't be playing that could take a look at my list to make sure it's balanced this time around?
sstralkowski
11/10/2010, 13:31
So I'm ready to give modding another go around. I've got my roles written, but I'd like to have someone go over them to ensure I've got everything balanced. My first game was pro-town and I'd like to try to keep it as even as I can this time around. So, is there another mod who won't be playing that could take a look at my list to make sure it's balanced this time around?
I can try. I seem to be a tad rusty though.
Tip: There is no way to know for sure. No matter how well balanced you think your game is, Night 1 will happen and every player will end up targeting people that completely throw off the balance one way or another. Guaranteed. It's just Murphy's Law.
sstralkowski
11/10/2010, 13:49
Tip: There is no way to know for sure. No matter how well balanced you think your game is, Night 1 will happen and every player will end up targeting people that completely throw off the balance one way or another. Guaranteed. It's just Murphy's Law.
This is an issues as well. Aside from it being an excuse for me to never take responsibility for my outcomes, it really is true that the human factor can wreak havok on a game. More on this later.
When you guys review each others work what format do you like it to be in? Also would someone want to review the Muppet Show Mafia I'm working on? Someone who wouldn't be a lock to sign up of course. :)
Perhaps I should ask first: How much of it should be done before you ask someone to review it?
Mr Stranger
11/12/2010, 01:19
When you guys review each others work what format do you like it to be in? Also would someone want to review the Muppet Show Mafia I'm working on? Someone who wouldn't be a lock to sign up of course. :)
Perhaps I should ask first: How much of it should be done before you ask someone to review it?
Because I'm a writer in my spare time, I'll be speaking in more of that sense.
But generally speaking, you should do everything possible before asking someone to review it.
Think of different scenarios where landslides can happen, or try to use a positive/negative system to determine how good roles are.
"Well he's a cop so +1, he's a double voter + 1, but he has a 1/3 lynch -1."
Once you think something is completely polished, THEN get someone to read it.
The truth is, you will never be happy with your work but there's a certain point where you say, "screw it."
If that person says, "it's perfect!" then it's good enough, but hopefully they have something to critique with fresh eyes.
Because I'm a writer in my spare time, I'll be speaking in more of that sense.
But generally speaking, you should do everything possible before asking someone to review it.
Think of different scenarios where landslides can happen, or try to use a positive/negative system to determine how good roles are.
"Well he's a cop so +1, he's a double voter + 1, but he has a 1/3 lynch -1."
Once you think something is completely polished, THEN get someone to read it.
The truth is, you will never be happy with your work but there's a certain point where you say, "screw it."
If that person says, "it's perfect!" then it's good enough, but hopefully they have something to critique with fresh eyes.
So primarily the power balance? I've been wondering if folks do a lot of the write-ups ahead of time or if they just wing it since its hard to predict. So far I've assigned powers for a pretty vanilla game, with a few tweaks. I also wrote the write up for N0.
sstralkowski
11/12/2010, 10:51
So primarily the power balance? I've been wondering if folks do a lot of the write-ups ahead of time or if they just wing it since its hard to predict. So far I've assigned powers for a pretty vanilla game, with a few tweaks. I also wrote the write up for N0.
Stranger is right on all accounts.
Each night write-up must be done after receiving all actions. You can't predict what people will do.
Stranger is right on all accounts.
Each night write-up must be done after receiving all actions. You can't predict what people will do.
Alrighty, I'm going to go over the power balance several times and try to imagine possible scenarios that would end in a landslide.
Beyond that though my outline should include the following:
Role / Power List
N0 Write up
Ideas from source material for future write ups
I also think I'll be holding off sign ups anyway until there are not so many games going on.
DarqFeonix
11/12/2010, 14:39
Write-ups can be the downfall of a game, or the most fun part. I love putting write-ups together, but the biggest fear is you'll give one little bit of info to much to sink/save a player.
Number one tip is that a player should never be able to point to a player and 100% give them a role copping power. It's hard, because you want to have fun with it, but if a Roleblocker targets a Nightkiller, you have to avoid saying something like "The short man with the metal claws slashed at Russian with the carbonadium tentacles, halting. His progress"
Next day, "I'm Wolverine and I blocked Omega Red, as seen in the writeup"
Write-ups can be the downfall of a game, or the most fun part. I love putting write-ups together, but the biggest fear is you'll give one little bit of info to much to sink/save a player.
Number one tip is that a player should never be able to point to a player and 100% give them a role copping power. It's hard, because you want to have fun with it, but if a Roleblocker targets a Nightkiller, you have to avoid saying something like "The short man with the metal claws slashed at Russian with the carbonadium tentacles, halting. His progress"
Next day, "I'm Wolverine and I blocked Omega Red, as seen in the writeup"
Right so like saying "a man in a tie" versus "the British secret agent". I actually learned about that one along with Jerry in his first game.
Quebbster
11/12/2010, 15:32
This is an issues as well. Aside from it being an excuse for me to never take responsibility for my outcomes, it really is true that the human factor can wreak havok on a game. More on this later.
Is it later now? :)
But yeah, writeups are hard. Have a general outline in place for how to describe the various characters, and use each description consistently. Ideally, everyone should go "which of you is man with beard?"
Other than that, there's not a whole lot you can do to plan ahead... weird things will happen.
I must say though that writeups for my Eddie Izzard mafia (which had a bunch of strange roles) were actually pretty easy to put together...
So I'll make a Role / Power / Generic description list, and compare the generic descriptions to make sure no one is too obvious. Then with luck I can just plug those into my writes ups.
sstralkowski
11/12/2010, 15:41
Is it later now? :)
I gave my comments after SF ended.
Quebbster
11/12/2010, 15:54
I gave my comments after SF ended.
Doesn't hurt to have them here too. :)
I actually think I'm as close as I'm going to get for my first shot at this. If someone wants to review it for me let me know.
Still looking for someone to review my game.
DarqFeonix
11/20/2010, 22:38
What's the theme? If I'm not in it, I'll review
The Muppet Show. Primarily based on the original variety show.
I need someone to look at a potential game set up. Theme is undetermined but I'm planning on having the roles dictate what theme I use. I'm leaning towards a generic mish-mash to keep mafia role claims fluid.
I don't have enough time to actively participate in games at the moment, but I wouldn't mind looking at your roles if you don't mind. :)
I don't have enough time to actively participate in games at the moment, but I wouldn't mind looking at your roles if you don't mind. :)
I'll probably send them out to you tonight or tomorrow.
Thanks
deadshot042
01/27/2011, 02:13
Would someone mind reviewing roles for a Dresden Files game I'd like to run? I'm working on a basic layout and would like some advice.
Also, if anyone could point out how to set up a proboard, that would be helpful when I run this.
Quebbster
01/27/2011, 10:36
Would someone mind reviewing roles for a Dresden Files game I'd like to run? I'm working on a basic layout and would like some advice.
Also, if anyone could point out how to set up a proboard, that would be helpful when I run this.
Go to www.proboards.com and follow the instructions. :)
Feel free to run your ideas by me by the way. :)
Is there an order of actions that one would recommend using?
Also, how can you tell what is too much detail in a write-up?
Quebbster
08/31/2011, 17:24
Is there an order of actions that one would recommend using?
Also, how can you tell what is too much detail in a write-up?
Different mods have different styles. I usually let misdirection trump blocking, or I just resolve stuff in the order the actions were submitted. The important thing is to be consistent.
As for detail, no one should be able to tell for sure what is going on.
DarqFeonix
08/31/2011, 17:36
Is there an order of actions that one would recommend using?
Also, how can you tell what is too much detail in a write-up?
Check out this old thread, Heirarchy of Night Actions (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?t=237252) to get a feel for the thoughts of many
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