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*spoilers* Secret Invasion - Relooking at New Avengers 1-10 [Archive] - HCRealms

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Paradox Factor
04/18/2008, 20:56
So, after reading Secret Invasion 1, I got the hankering to re-read NA, to see if I could pick up on any of the clues Bendis had dropped. It was an interesting reread given what we know now. Here's some things I picked up on.

Pre NA - Ok, here's something I didn't see the first time I read Avengers 503. Go take a peak back at it. In the battle with the Kree, on the page where Hawkeye gets shot and his quiver set on fire, there's a Skrull in the first two panels. Suposivly, this was on purpose. What's it mean? Was someone swapped out in the battle at the mansion?

NA 1 - So we have the mystery man talking with Elektro. Obviously the fact we can't see who it is hampers any guesses as to what the ultimate plan is. But I was struck by one random though. The silhouette of the man doesn't give alot of details. Short hair and jacket, maybe a trenchcoat. It struck me that it looks alot like Nick Fury. Then again, it looks alot like many characters.

Something else to note. In the Director's cut of NA 1, they havethe script for the issue. For the script on page 5, where Cage, Murdock, Nelson all meat Jessica Drew, 4 lines are blotted out. Might have just been a revision that was struck. Or maybe something else.

Finally, and this will come up again later, some of the prisoners in the group shot at the Raft were dead as of when this issue came out. With no explination given onhow they came back. These include the Mandrill, Centurious, Doctor Demonicus, Graviton, and Cutthroat. NA 6 says 21 of them total were dead.The entries for Centurious and the Mandrill in the NA: Director's Cut even mention that they had died. What's it mean? Could some of the prisoners have beem skrulls? Or is it something involving SHIELD?

NA 3 - Interesting. I just caught that Jarvis has green eyes. According to his OHotMU entry they shoulod be blue. When Cap says he tried to contact him, he says he was on holiday. Odds are that's when he got replaced. Also worth noting, Spider-Woman does too. But, her eyes are listed as green in the OHotMU. Might not mean anything for her. But, there was the whole thing with the baby and Jarvis, it's worth noting.

NA 4 - Another green eye allert. Mia Salem (Man that sounds like an anagram or something. Too bad I suck at those), the woman Electro has been calling. Again, might be nothing. But, I'm pointing out any green eyes I see at this point :laugh:

And the reveal of Carl Lykos, AKA Sauron. Whoever locked his file has top level SHIELD access. Since Dum Dum wasn't replaced yet (From a comic on Marvel.com, we find he's replaced shortly after Cap dies), it's not him. Other suspects include Maria Hill and good old Nick Fury.

NA 5 - And now we come to Wolverine. After rereading this issue, I'm really starting to suspect that the Wolverine in NA might be a Skrull. He complanes about the Savage land scfrewing up his sense of smell, something that's never been brought up before. He says he flew in the Blackbird, solo. They never verify this. At all. And theirs never a mention in the X books of the Blackbird being crashed. He also has the wrong eye color. His eyes are shown as grey. The OHotMU says their black. Only problem with this is in House of M, the X-Men and the New Avengers all get together. So maybe not. Then again he did jump Lykos, letting him turn into Sauron, which was really stupid. And Sauron did have a few extra abilities after he fed off him. He's never stold mutant powers before and somehow he gets Wolvie's healing factor. What if Sauron reacted diffrently feeding of a Super-Skrull in disgise?

A bigger note is what Brainchild and Sauron say to each other.

Sauron - Well, you had to know they were going to come after us for it (He's refering to the jailbreak)
Brainchild - Actually we were told no one would. That was the deal. Seems we were lied to. Again.
Sauron - This is bad.
Brainchild - What are they going to do to us that they haven't already done? Rape our land? Enslave you?

Getting right to the core of the jailbreak, this sounds like a direct reffrence to the SHIELD mining opperation in the savage land. But the one thing I always wondered is why was Sauron sprung? Why is he so importand that the Mutates broke him out?

NA 7-10 - The Sentry. Right off the bat, I got to wonder, if the Sentry made everyone on earth forget he existed, did he make the Skrulls forget? and the whole thing about killing his wife, then she shows up, allong with the creator of the Sentry comic. Could it be the Skrulls trying to keep one of the most powerful beings on the planet an emotional basket case?

Mr_JTR
04/19/2008, 00:40
For the script on page 5, where Cage, Murdock, Nelson all meat Jessica Drew,

Hey now, I did NOT see them meat Jessica. That'd be the X-Rated version, I suppose.



BTW - Elektro is a robot hero (now appearing in "The Twelve"), I'm thinking you mean "Electro", the villian who controls electricity.

Mr_JTR
04/19/2008, 00:43
Also of note, revealed in an issue of the Marvel Knights Spider-Man series, when Spidey is looking for his Aunt, we see Electro with a shape-shifting prostitute.

Paradox Factor
04/19/2008, 00:52
Hey now, I did NOT see them meat Jessica. That'd be the X-Rated version, I suppose.



BTW - Elektro is a robot hero (now appearing in "The Twelve"), I'm thinking you mean "Electro", the villian who controls electricity.


*sigh* See, this is what happens when you type something like this up after 8 hours of class while functioning on only 3 hours sleep *mummble mummble, knew I should have spell checked, grumble grumble* :laugh:

biz567
04/19/2008, 15:00
My buddy Trent and I(He works at my comic shop) are thinking there are more then one Wolveinre running around. The one in Origins is him, the one in NA or X-Men is not.

Also, great catches. I just looked at the Skrull in Avengers! Holy carp!

And the Jarvis thing! Great catch!

Rottgutt
04/19/2008, 15:14
shape-shifting prostitute

I can't decide if that's a better band name or album title, but either way, it rocks.

grendal
04/19/2008, 15:30
"But the one thing I always wondered is why was Sauron sprung"

well sauron steals mutant powers and the "hyper" skrulls seem to be able to copy mutant powers...and all that talk of experiments...

vicious x
04/19/2008, 15:37
My buddy Trent and I(He works at my comic shop) are thinking there are more then one Wolveinre running around. The one in Origins is him, the one in NA or X-Men is not.

Also, great catches. I just looked at the Skrull in Avengers! Holy carp!

And the Jarvis thing! Great catch!

well there always have been more then one wolverine running around. how else could he be apart of 3 x-men books do a solo book, show up in countless non x-men books and most recent join the new avengers,... :p

Paradox Factor
04/19/2008, 15:47
"But the one thing I always wondered is why was Sauron sprung"

well sauron steals mutant powers and the "hyper" skrulls seem to be able to copy mutant powers...and all that talk of experiments...

Hmmm, could be. But remember, the new Super-Skrulls can copy more then mutant powers. In Secret War Saga Iron Man says the one impersonating Black Bolt has all the Illuminati's powers. Also, the discustion between Sauron and Brainchild made it seem more like the Savage Land Mutates wanted him. It also is strongly hinted that the deal was made with this rogue SHIELD faction that was mining in the Savage Land. It's also worth noting that Barbarus, one of the Savage Land Mutates was imprisoned on the Raft too. So, it wasn't that the Mutates wanted one of their own back.

Paradox Factor
04/19/2008, 15:51
My buddy Trent and I(He works at my comic shop) are thinking there are more then one Wolveinre running around. The one in Origins is him, the one in NA or X-Men is not.

Also, great catches. I just looked at the Skrull in Avengers! Holy carp!

And the Jarvis thing! Great catch!

Could be. Like I said, after rereading Wolvie's appearance, and the fact he didn't go public with the rest of the team, a few bells went off. Then again, that means the Wolverine at the begining of House of M and in the Sentry arc would have to be a Skrull too. Seems like a lot to juggle at once.

The Avengers one, I heared online somewhere. But it seems like most people hadfn't heared it so I figured I'd mention it. As for Jarvis, that suprised me. Now I need to reread the rest of NA with my OHotMU collection next to me so I can check EVERY green eyed character, LOL.

VicVega
04/19/2008, 15:58
It's been quite awhile since I read the issue but during the esape doesn't Jigsaw (who has always been normal human strength and ability) break Spider Mans arm? I believe they previously explained it away as a miscommunication between writer and artist but I guess it could mean that for some reason the Skrulls have replaced Jigsaw. I don't think any upcoming Punisher War Journals are SI crossovers though, and Jigsaw is showing up in that book right now.

tidge
04/22/2008, 22:15
You forgot the issue of NA where I dropped the series because it was painful to read.

Mr_JTR
04/22/2008, 23:25
It's been quite awhile since I read the issue but during the esape doesn't Jigsaw (who has always been normal human strength and ability) break Spider Mans arm? I believe they previously explained it away as a miscommunication between writer and artist but I guess it could mean that for some reason the Skrulls have replaced Jigsaw. I don't think any upcoming Punisher War Journals are SI crossovers though, and Jigsaw is showing up in that book right now.

Actually, some years back, Jigsaw supposedly gained some powers from a supernatural source, like BlackHeart or Mephisto.

VicVega
04/23/2008, 00:07
Actually, some years back, Jigsaw supposedly gained some powers from a supernatural source, like BlackHeart or Mephisto.
Not trying to derail the thread. Just curious. I remember an exo-skeleton strength suit thing and I know Belasco and Rev healed his face and resurected him but I don't remember him being augmented beyond the suit.

Paradox Factor
04/23/2008, 00:58
Not trying to derail the thread. Just curious. I remember an exo-skeleton strength suit thing and I know Belasco and Rev healed his face and resurected him but I don't remember him being augmented beyond the suit.

No worries about derailing. This is actually the stuff I was talking about. I don't know Jugsaw well enough to say one way or the other. And getting details on is he strong enough is he is good. Especially since he reapears later in NA with the Hood. And I have a very strong hunch atleast a few skrulls are infultrating the Hoods group

Maniac_nmt
04/23/2008, 01:39
No worries about derailing. This is actually the stuff I was talking about. I don't know Jugsaw well enough to say one way or the other. And getting details on is he strong enough is he is good. Especially since he reapears later in NA with the Hood. And I have a very strong hunch atleast a few skrulls are infultrating the Hoods group

It could also be that Peter was a Skrull during that fight.

BLACKHEART25
04/23/2008, 16:34
I believe Sauron was sprung for either: THE DIRECTOR or AGENT BRENT JACKSON. (whomever was in control of Weapon X near the end). I don't know it it was skrull related.

Can skrulls not change they're eye color?

da-Craig-O
04/23/2008, 17:08
See Matt, this is why I love that big brain of yours. :)

Love the thought of Wolverine in Origins being the 'real' one. In fact, it is quite possible that one or more of the X-Men being Skrulls allowed the Skrulls to keep the real one and the fake apart.

We're meeting to talk about Wanda going nuts? Better lay low Wolvie-Skrull. I really hope we get a scene where the real Wolvie shows up and is like "I left you guys a note that I would be gone for a while to clean up my old memories." only to find that Emma-Skrull tore that note up before someone could see it. :)

Also, Bendis is so awesome that not only did we have tons of E-hate about his lack of 'research' because so many dead characters were showing up and how people were acting 'not themselves', but now that the curtain is being lifted we see the genius. Of course, it's being done so well that many will claim it was a 'retcon' to fix all of the problems that fans complained about.

I love the internets.

Milo Garret
04/23/2008, 17:15
On a side note, Mighty #12 is actually a pretty good read.

Mr_JTR
06/16/2008, 10:24
Can skrulls not change they're eye color?

I'd think that they could.

Paradox Factor
06/16/2008, 16:05
Can skrulls not change they're eye color?

They can. Later appearences by 'Jarvis" shows this. But the green eyes on him in NA 3 and the baby kinda make me think Bendis is using this as a tip off on who is and isn't a Skrull. It's subtle ('sept for the baby. Shesh that was like hamered in your face)

Mr_JTR
06/16/2008, 16:32
They can. Later appearences by 'Jarvis" shows this. But the green eyes on him in NA 3 and the baby kinda make me think Bendis is using this as a tip off on who is and isn't a Skrull. It's subtle ('sept for the baby. Shesh that was like hamered in your face)


Actually, that baby isn't a skrull at all, it's a reborn Thanos.

lukebuchanan
06/16/2008, 16:43
On the Jigsaw thing...

...it was an admitted mistake by David Finch. He was supposed to draw Piledriver, who could easily break Spidey's arm, but screwed up.

Not a skrull, the scapegoat of Marvel screw-ups, but an admitted real-deal screw-up.

freakazoid_x
06/16/2008, 16:44
Or it could be the truth that they're just gonna pick random heroes to be skrulls with no real logical way for a switch to have taken place.

thanosstar
06/19/2008, 14:13
Actually, that baby isn't a skrull at all, it's a reborn Thanos....is that true

Mr_JTR
06/19/2008, 15:15
Actually, that baby isn't a skrull at all, it's a reborn Thanos....is that true


Could be true... could be false.

XocgX
06/19/2008, 15:33
Could be true... could be false.
You'll be given the same reward....
Socrates and Milhouse Nixon
both went the same way through the kitchen!
Plato the Greek or Rin tin Tin,
who's more famous to the billion millions?

Oh, i love the Clash!

Mr_JTR
06/19/2008, 15:58
You'll be given the same reward....
Socrates and Milhouse Nixon
both went the same way through the kitchen!
Plato the Greek or Rin tin Tin,
who's more famous to the billion millions?

Oh, i love the Clash!

Umm... I honestly had no idea I was quoting anyone.

The Mattador
06/19/2008, 19:50
You forgot the issue of NA where I dropped the series because it was painful to read.

QFT. I cosign this statement and see you some rep, sir.

stark's heir
06/19/2008, 21:10
Tony Stark was right and will save us all! That's all you folks need to know about Secret Invasion...

Mr_JTR
06/23/2008, 09:47
Tony Stark was right and will save us all! That's all you folks need to know about Secret Invasion...

He was right... till, at some point years ago in our time, he had been kidnapped by Skrulls and replaced by one, one who started the whole Civil War thing. And even before that, when he killed all of those innocents.

Scott Neelan
06/25/2008, 01:45
He was right... till, at some point years ago in our time, he had been kidnapped by Skrulls and replaced by one, one who started the whole Civil War thing. And even before that, when he killed all of those innocents.

Nah, Tony's not a Skrull. He's just being mind-controlled by Kang...again...