Wildcards and ATAs

[Ihsan]

I've heard people saying that under the new rules wildcards will no longer be able to copy or use ATAs. I've checked the sections on wildcards and feats, but can't find anything that explicitly states this rule change. However, both sections mention that wildcards (who are able to use other TAs) cannot meet the prereqs of a feat. Maybe people are interpreting this new rule as meaning that wildcards cannot copy ATAs, but I interpret it differently. I believe it means that one cannot assign ATAs to wildcards; thus, if an ATA feat has a point cost per character, one does not pay extra for all wildcards on the team. Furthermore, it closes up any possible loopholes that might allow a wildcard to use an ATA that otherwise states that a wildcard cannot use that particular ATA (i.e., a wildcard could try to copy the prerequisite TA and therefore meet the requirements for the ATA to gain possession of that TA).

However, even though ATA feats cannot be assigned to a wildcard character, the other characters who actually have the prerequisite TA or team symbol can be assigned the ATA feat and will ultimately possess the new TA. Therefore, under the new rules, the wildcard can still use the ATA possessed by his or her teammates.

Am I missing something? Any pointers to new rules or rulings that could clarify this for me?

Thanks in advance.

[Quebbster]

Am I missing something?
Yeah... nbperp has said this is the way it works now. As far as interpretations go his is the best. :)

[TheFreak]

Yeah... nbperp has said this is the way it works now. As far as interpretations go his is the best. :)

Oh yeah, like his interpretation that Alpha Oracle won't be able to be placed on the card, but the two other Ra's can get a discount going onto the Pit?

[Quebbster]

Oh yeah, like his interpretation that Alpha Oracle won't be able to be placed on the card, but the two other Ra's can get a discount going onto the Pit?
Precisely.

[Harpua]

Oh yeah, like his interpretation that Alpha Oracle won't be able to be placed on the card, but the two other Ra's can get a discount going onto the Pit?

I agree with the people who say that the rules do not support the assertion that WCs can't copy ATAs.

I asked nbperp about this in Philly. Essentially, it is an intent ruling. GD told him that the text written was inteded to convey this.


As for the Oracle/Ra's thing...he said that he was going to try and get errata to prevent Alpha Oracle from going onto the card. The errata is what will prevent that, not just a ruling. The errata entries are rules. In the end, I'm sure that it is a game balance thing. Remember when we had soaring? A soaring figure could not affect a non-soaring one. Why? Game balance. Alpha Oracle being allowed on that card would be incredibly powerful. Alpha or Icons Ra's getting a point reduction for using Lazarus Pit would not be nearly as powerful.

It really is nothing over which an issue should be made.

[Ihsan]

I asked nbperp about this in Philly. Essentially, it is an intent ruling. GD told him that the text written was inteded to convey this.

I was afraid that that was the case. Oh well. Hopefully in the printed version the rules will be worded better (*crosses fingers*), because being able to point to a rule in the rule book is so much more convincing at a tournament than saying "well, that's what nbperp said online".

Maybe that's why they released the rules so early: to get enough feedback from the online community to see what sort of changes they might need to make for the real deal.

Thanks, all.

[Entertainer13]

I agree with the people who say that the rules do not support the assertion that WCs can't copy ATAs.

I asked nbperp about this in Philly. Essentially, it is an intent ruling. GD told him that the text written was inteded to convey this.


As for the Oracle/Ra's thing...he said that he was going to try and get errata to prevent Alpha Oracle from going onto the card. The errata is what will prevent that, not just a ruling. The errata entries are rules. In the end, I'm sure that it is a game balance thing. Remember when we had soaring? A soaring figure could not affect a non-soaring one. Why? Game balance. Alpha Oracle being allowed on that card would be incredibly powerful. Alpha or Icons Ra's getting a point reduction for using Lazarus Pit would not be nearly as powerful.

It really is nothing over which an issue should be made.Yeah handing out that Mind Control, Leadership and Perplex is soooooooo game breaking. We've never had a piece that could just give characters cool powers... :rolleyes:

[Donveersingh]

I think the ESD is the worst of her powers to assign. KC Flash on hindering with ICWO ESD = 23 Defence from range.

[kontrol]

I think the ESD is the worst of her powers to assign. KC Flash on hindering with ICWO ESD = 23 Defence from range.

:Shrug:
Break out the LAMPs then.
or the Icicles and the Constructs, etc.

[burleigh2]

I think the ESD is the worst of her powers to assign. KC Flash on hindering with ICWO ESD = 23 Defence from range.
...and MC and perplex.... Or if it was put on KC GL, Icons Superman, Unl GL (tank), etc, etc. Being able to add perplex, MC, and ES/D to ANY figure for only 50 points while OW, Perplex, OR Leadership was barely less than that.... that's just way too cheap and potentially nasty.

[Harpua]

...and MC and perplex.... Or if it was put on KC GL, Icons Superman, Unl GL (tank), etc, etc. Being able to add perplex, MC, and ES/D to ANY figure for only 50 points while OW, Perplex, OR Leadership was barely less than that.... that's just way too cheap and potentially nasty.

Exactly...

The Agent given the action may use any power showing on Oracle`s dial until any Agent with zero or one action tokens is given a power action to turn Oracle`s dial.

So if you put her on the second click, you'd get to use MC, ESD, and Perplex, not just any one of them.

[yakmala]

So, does this mean and Wild Card can no longer copy a TA granted via Thunderbolts? I know the card is no longer tournament legal, but I mostly play in an unrestricted environment.

[burleigh2]

So, does this mean and Wild Card can no longer copy a TA granted via Thunderbolts? I know the card is no longer tournament legal, but I mostly play in an unrestricted environment.
Exactly right. Even in a game that allows retirement won't allow WCs to copy the ATAs.... unless it's a home game and you make a house rule that lets you. ;)

[Glen Quagmire]

This might be a stretch, but if Norm is looking at doing a FAQ or errata for a retired feat, that could be a good sign as far as the future of unrestricted tournaments from WK. During the entirety of the first "ignore BFCs" period, there was never any FAQ provided for retired BFCs. Which fit into WK's game plan for only providing new prizes for restricted, sealed and floor. Why spend time on retired game mechanics when they provided little support for them, after all. If WK is trying to move this quickly on an answer to the Oracle situation, it could mean more new prize-supported unrestricted play to come down the pike, like the "all-DC unrestricted" event from Crisis.

Just a theory. Sure, the comparison is the difference between simply FAQ'ing one card (ICWO) vs. all the pre-Armor Wars BFCs, I'll concede that point.

[Artarus]

Of all the rules changes, this one annoys me the most.. I can't think of any ATA's that WC's shouldn't be able to copy.. I don't mind that WC's can't contribute to some TA's.. JSA, Defenders, FF.. but why can't they copy ones like The Society, or Monster Society of Evil.. or even the Green Lantern Corp. ATA?