Mafia Blacklist- Yea or Nay?

[Thawmus]

As some of you may or may not know- participation is becoming a problem. And players are routinely allowed to play in games, when they have long-standing histories of not participating in games, cheating, etc.

One proposed solution to this is to have a blacklist. This is the thread I would like to discuss such a blacklist. Whether or not we should have one, whether there are other solutions to be had, what the policies should be concerning it, whether we should hold one here or not, etc.

The benefits of having a blacklist, or any similar device, are as follows:

- New mods know who to allow into their games.

- Players are encouraged to participate, and not cheat.

- The rules of Mafia now have consequences when they are broken.

- Mods are spending less time replacing and modkilling players, which are things that throw their games out of balance.

The poll options are as follows:

1. Yes, I would like to see a Blacklist
2. No, I do not want a Blacklist
3. I don't care.
4. I would like to see a different solution.

Please comment on your poll choice, as well as list any additional benefits to the blacklist that I have missed.

[Reibello]

I see no poll. But if there was one for me to choose, it would be 1. Something impersonal, run by a few select people, that would make it easier for mods to run games.

EDIT: There is now a poll. I voted.

[pbdeberry]

No. I think it's a silly idea.

Take for instance... the following players... would end up on that 'list.'
'
k-ness ; frontman ; darkseid sr ; Amora's_best_friend ; TMNT99 ; rokk_krinn ; darkcorsair ; docdoon187 and pbdeberry.

At one point these guys, have all had real life issue or just couldn't post or be active one way or another.

All these guys are vocal and positive players. I don't see any of them being on any list... yet they've all vanished for periods of time.

[Thawmus]

No. I think it's a silly idea.

Take for instance... the following players... would end up on that 'list.'
'
k-ness ; frontman ; darkseid sr ; Amora's_best_friend ; TMNT99 ; rokk_krinn ; darkcorsair ; docdoon187 and pbdeberry.

At one point these guys, have all had real life issue or just couldn't post or be active one way or another.

All these guys are vocal and positive players. I don't see any of them being on any list... yet they've all vanished for periods of time.

I'm pretty sure most of those people wouldn't be on the blacklist.

I've vanished for periods of time. I've had 3 different "hiatus" sessions, each spanning several months of time. I kinda doubt I'm proposing something that would get me on such a blacklist.

We're not talking about people that vanish for periods of time. We're talking about people who are continually remiss in the fact that they are in a game, or cheat continually. The conditions for getting on the blacklist is something that is still up for discussion. Nobody's going to determine by their lonesome what those conditions are.

[anonym0use]

I know very few players that deserve a Blacklist.

I know a lot more that are in the grey.

[The Darkstone]

Perhaps the blacklist should have different levels in terms of inactivity?

[darius_dax1]

If it is an issue of real life problems getting in the way their names can be removed from the list.

This is for people who abandon a role or never participate in mafia. It isn't for people who don't play well (cause I'd make that list :laugh:) or people who have RL issues that take them away from silly games.

[sstralkowski]

I think a blacklist would be nice. I have a couple new players in my game who I've never had play mine before. It'd be nice to know beforehand if they're going to be active.

pbd, I can't speak for others, but the people who got on my personal black list are there because of repeated lack of participation after signing up in the first place. It's not something you earn your way onto for a single instance, and it's not something that once you get on, you're there permanently.

I'll give an example. I've already publicly stated this so it's no surprise, but jsoccerdude, while a really ncie guy, never participates in my games. I don't dislike him for it or anything. It's just a fact that I have to beg him for targets and even then, he rarely posts. One game he even won doing that because he died early and was resurrected close to the end. That game was the final straw. If he were to pm me asking to be allowed into a game and promising to be active, I'd allow him on a probationary basis.

[sstralkowski]

If it is an issue of real life problems getting in the way their names can be removed from the list.

This is for people who abandon a role or never participate in mafia. It isn't for people who don't play well (cause I'd make that list :laugh:) or people who have RL issues that take them away from silly games.

totally agree here. One all accounts including the one where I'd be blacklisted if it were for lack of skill.

[goodman]

Thing is i think certain people are active in certain games, just because they are not active in other ones doesn't mean they are inactive mafia players and should be blacklisted.

I mean for example in Mario Kart mafia CrusaderC didn't participate much at all that i had to replace him yet i know for a fact that he plays in other mafia games and participates more. It just really depends, i think theres really only a few names that need to be mentioned but i'm just worried that personal grudges will play their part here and players will want other players blacklisted because they don't like them.

[darius_dax1]

Thing is i think certain people are active in certain games, just because they are not active in other ones doesn't mean they are inactive mafia players and should be blacklisted.

I mean for example in Mario Kart mafia CrusaderC didn't participate much at all that i had to replace him yet i know for a fact that he plays in other mafia games and participates more. It just really depends, i think theres really only a few names that need to be mentioned but i'm just worried that personal grudges will play their part here and players will want other players blacklisted because they don't like them.

CrusaderC sounds like the type of person that needs to be "black-listed" Not that he's a bad guy but if he is in too many games he either needs to play in fewer or step up.
Players won't be keeping the list. The mafia mods will. I know that the mafia mods are players as well but I would trust most of the mods with maintaining a genuine list of "bad" players.

[DocDoom187]

I voted yes. I don't mod games, but I HATE having inactive players, especially teammates. Inactivity makes games run longer, which also contributes to the scheduling problem, too.

[CarlosMucha]

I vote yes.

this is need. Mods should give the reason of why those people are in his black list. if a Mod take that person as a player is under his own risc but at least the list give the Mod a warning about what players may have problems with.

the list will be a guide. it don't mean that a player can't play in any game, it means "Be careful" to the Mod making that person player in his game.

[Magnito]

I voted "yes", but that shouldn't come as a surprise.

[Amora's_best_friend]

I voted "I Don't Care", because I can't make up my mind.

I think I should be on a grey list, because I'm really bad for signing up for games, and forgetting they are running.

[DocDoom187]

He's Back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[loganspeedo]

I'd like one, but I also agree there can be some grey area. I've moderated 3.1 games so far (just started PPG Mafia) and I find the one thing that keeps it from being 100% enjoyable are the people who don't participate. I also think this should go both ways if there are mods who don't run games right or just quit mid-game and leave the players hanging.

[The BoyBlunder]

We could use the new social group function, make it invite only, and only invite those that are experianced mods. That way the probation and black lists would be completly hidden from the public, and most feels could be spared. We would just need to have one person who would be in charge of keeping the list up to date, as well as who gets invited into said group.

Not it!

[Thawmus]

We could use the new social group function, make it invite only, and only invite those that are experianced mods. That way the probation and black lists would be completly hidden from the public, and most feels could be spared. We would just need to have one person who would be in charge of keeping the list up to date, as well as who gets invited into said group.

Not it!

The problem with having something that is hidden from public is that it makes said list completely useless to everyone. Only the paltry few that would be allowed to make changes, would benefit from it.


I'm not on board with that.

[The BoyBlunder]

I was thinking that the people in the group would then be responsible for keeping mods informed. As in if someone on the list joins a game of someone who isn't in the group, one of the group members could privately send a pm to the mod of the game, and still leave it up to the mod. Like a Mafia Illuminati.

If it's posted for everyone to see, feelings get bruised. If it is haddled ina discrete manner, I think it could work to help things run smoother.

[Thawmus]

I was thinking that the people in the group would then be responsible for keeping mods informed. As in if someone on the list joins a game of someone who isn't in the group, one of the group members could privately send a pm to the mod of the game, and still leave it up to the mod. Like a Mafia Illuminati.

Few things:

1. Have you seen the sign-up forum lately? There's way too many games in there for a small group to try and take responsibility.

2. What happens if that small group quits playing Mafia? I, again, have no faith in that being remedied by the staff.

3. This still only helps a small group of people. Newer mods, or those that aren't aware of the list, get no benefit from it.

4. So help me God, if we did a system like this, I'd grab the blacklist, and make a public posting of it. I would consider it MUCH harsher toward the feelings of other people for them to know that they MAY be on a blacklist that they can't see, rather than let them know for sure if they were or not. So, FYI, if you do this, better not let me have access to it.

If it's posted for everyone to see, feelings get bruised. If it is haddled ina discrete manner, I think it could work to help things run smoother.

Okay, let's be honest here. If someone has caused enough infractions that they've ended up on the blacklist, do you REALLY think they're going to get into a tizzy over it? I mean, I PMed a few players yesterday that were signed up for my game, making sure they would play. They KNEW why I was PMing them, and they didn't have a problem with it.

It's far better for people to be honest with one another, than try and keep secrets between "Prestigious" Mafia mods.

I mean, we're talking about a BLACKLIST, folks. Not a graylist. These are the folks that never ever ever participate, and continually sign up for games. These are the folks that have cheated in 3 or more games, and still sign up for games. We're not talking about gray area material.

If you guys want a graylist, and want to make that private, fine. But, again, don't let me have access to it. Cuz I'll spill it all over. ;)

[Jackofhearts2005]

I think a lot of us have personal blacklists, players that have been unparticipatory in one or more of our games that we wouldn't let back into them. Those people's names generally don't belong on a public blacklist.

But what Thawmus is proposing right now...post it. We'll fill it in. Anyone who we truly believe shouldn't be allowed in any mafia games will be put on the list. Chances are there won't be an argument.