Lightpost Question

[jhhump]

I was playing a game with the outdoor adventure pack. I was using the lightpost to make an attack. I was tought that it would do 2 damage on top of whatever the figure damage was. For example She-Hulk has 4 damage plus 2 for the lightpost for a total of 6. On top of the damage incapaciate occurs. My friend said that it was only 2 damage for the light post and incapaciate. She the 4 damage of She-Hulk wouldn't count. Which one of us is corret?

[Tsannik]

The lightpost is a very special case object...

It is a Heavy object so will add +2 to a close combat attack.

However, because it grants Incapacitate.... I believe it should do one of two things...

1) Annouce Incapacitate is turned off... object will do normally for close-combat attack...

2) Incapacitate is left on... the damage will be reduced to 0 (because of Incap)... and then +2 will be addded for normal heavy object damage. So the receiving figure would take 2 damage and have an action tokens assigned as per Incap.


I think this is correct. I know #2 is, but not sure about #1...

[Xanth]

According to a written battle description on the WK site a few months back (involving Jon Leithauser who is the HC developer) it was stated that you do not count the printed damage value of the character and treat it just like he was using the Incapacitate power. There were some rules mistakes made in that article so a number of people didn't accept this ruling. We have never received an official response to the question so it could go either way based on the printed blurb that comes with the objects.

[Funky Jett]

You mean the Incapacitate power, right? Not the Outwit power.

[Xanth]

Why...er...no...it's the variant light post which runs on gas and not electricity. Yeah! That's the ticket.

Thanks Funky. I edited my previous.

[Todosi]

I think the wording for the object is pretty clear.

"Object does normal damage for a heavy object and incapacitates the target as if the attacker has the Incapacitate super power."

So in your example She-Hulk would do 6 clicks and Incapacitate the target.

Is there some other discussion on this that I'm not aware of? The rules seem quite simple to me.

Todosi

[Tsannik]

2) Incapacitate is left on... the damage will be reduced to 0 (because of Incap)... and then +2 will be addded for normal heavy object damage. So the receiving figure would take 2 damage and have an action tokens assigned as per Incap.

If Incap cannot be turned off, then the above is how it would be used....

[Veggiehater]

*Sigh*

I just hope they finally give us an official answer to this in the next FAQ (assuming they ever post the new FAQ)

*Sigh*

VH

[FanBoy13]

If you're holding the lightpost a couple squares away, can you still get incapacitate?

Like, can you throw the lightpost, do 3 clicks for throwing a heavy object, and get incap to boot, or can you only incap with the lightpost on close combat actions, or, can you incap from range (using the normal 4-square range for heavy objects), but do 0 damage?

Thanks.

[Tsannik]

Theoretically...


when using the Lightpost in a Ranged attack....

You'd do 3 Damage as per the rules for a heavy object, but by using the Incapacitate, that damage would be reduced to 0.

So, you should do 0 damage, but Incapacitate the opposing figure.

[rgrayua]

Originally posted by Todosi
I think the wording for the object is pretty clear.

"Object does normal damage for a heavy object and incapacitates the target as if the attacker has the Incapacitate super power."



I agree, sounds pretty clear to me. Although I'm quite often wrong about these rules, they often don't make sense and seemingly contradict themselves (i.e. see the FAQ regarding Force Blast where one bullet says it does not affect figures with Charge and the very next bullet says it does!) It says it does normal damage for a heavy object and incapacitates the target AS IF the attacker has the Incapacitate super power. The operative words being "as if", it doesn't say it gives the figure the power. Now to me, normal damage for a heavy object is 3 if thrown and +2 to base damage if used in close combat. The last phrase describes the effect on the target "incapacitates the target as if teh attacker has the Incapacitate super power. Which doesn't seem to warrant reducing the damage to zero. If that is what WizKids intended, they could have written it as simply the user of the object has the Incapacitate super power. I know this is not determinative given some of the other drafting snafus, but I think it's a reasonable position.

[Funky Jett]

Then why did they bother to determine it was a 'heavy' or 'light' object? It is an Incapacitating object.

"This object does 0 damage, but Incapacitates him just like the Super Power."

Look! ^^^ one sentence takes care of all the problems.

[rgrayua]

Originally posted by Funky Jett
Then why did they bother to determine it was a 'heavy' or 'light' object? It is an Incapacitating object.

"This object does 0 damage, but Incapacitates him just like the Super Power."

Look! ^^^ one sentence takes care of all the problems.

but most of these problems could be prevented by careful draftsmanship.

[Funky Jett]

Originally posted by rgrayua
It says it does normal damage for a heavy object and incapacitates the target AS IF the attacker has the Incapacitate super power. The operative words being "as if", it doesn't say it gives the figure the power.

I think they said "AS IF" so it couldn't be Outwitted... but it's a freakin' object! How can you Outwit an object? :rolleyes:

[azhael]

But that would be too easy and make too much sense.

[FanBoy13]

You know, funny thing is, I didn't even know this about the lightpost - I thought only the dumpster was special in that it can't be destroyed. Any other 3-D objects that are special?

[Funky Jett]

Originally posted by rgrayua
but most of these problems could be prevented by careful draftsmanship.
Agreed, 100% They rushed the Adventure packs out too fast. Look at the typos in the Scenario cards as proof.

[Tsannik]

Hm... I don't have my 3-D objects rules handy....

If someone could type those word-for-word, maybe I might be able to give a better interpretation...

I'm assuming that the Lightpost *grants* Incapacitate. If that's the case, then it would be able to be Outwitted.

But if the Lightpost Incapacitates.... then it would not be Ouwittable....

[rgrayua]

the soda machine adds +1 to damage (which is nasty), the crate adds 1 to the range, so it can be thrown 6 or Tked 12, the bookcase & computer add +1 to attack (I think), mailbox adds +1 to damage and desk adds +2 to defense when held.

[FanBoy13]

Just a clarification:

The crate adds 1 to range - isn't its range already 6, being a light object? Does this mean you can throw it seven squares? And how is TKing it 12 adding 1 to range? I thought the TK power was limited to 10 squares no matter what - in that case, wouldn't it be TKing it 11 squares?

The mailbox adds 1 to damage - does this mean you treat it as a light object in all respects except for the fact that it can do 3 clicks if thrown and adds +2 to a close-combat action?

Thanks.

[Tsannik]

The crate.... yeah when thrown it can be thrown 7 squares....I do believe, though it can TKed only 10 squares.

Mailbox.... does this one add +1 to Attack, not Damage?

[DS-00-0, FSD]

I believe the crate is +2 to range. I've seen it added to TK as well.

Mailbox is +1 to damage, so +2 if used in close combat, 3 total if used in a ranged attack (but still gets to be thrown 6 spaces per rules for light objects).

[Funky Jett]

Originally posted by FanBoy13
You know, funny thing is, I didn't even know this about the lightpost - I thought only the dumpster was special in that it can't be destroyed. Any other 3-D objects that are special?

ALL the objects are special in one way or another. I don't have my rules for the objects here either, but I know the desk adds 2 to your defense if you are holding it (NOT hiding beneath it). Some add to your range, some add to your attack value, some add to your damage, there is the lightpost, and we know about the dumpster.

[rgrayua]

Originally posted by DS-00-0, FSD
I believe the crate is +2 to range. I've seen it added to TK as well.

Mailbox is +1 to damage, so +2 if used in close combat, 3 total if used in a ranged attack (but still gets to be thrown 6 spaces per rules for light objects).

The crate is +2 to range and it applies whether thrown or TKed the insert makes this abundantly clear. Mailbox is correct also.

Edit--I see the confusion, I mistyped (kinda like misspoke) when I said crate add 1 to range, I meant 2. Sorry. :)

[rgrayua]

have similar functions--attack bonus, damage bonus & special.

Attack Bonus:

Light--Bookcase
Heavy--Computer

Damage Bonus:

Light--Mailbox
Heavy--Soda machine

Special:

Light--
Crate--+2 to range when thrown or TKed
Desk--+2 to defense when held

Heavy--
Dumpster--not destroyed after being used in attack
Lamp Post--does normal damage PLUS incapacitates target (which is pretty clear based on above posts).