Character creation: Juggernaut

[Mongoose]

Well i've been hearing gripes, and have griped myself about the unstoppable one. Taking into consideration the fact that he doesn't charge as often as the Rhino, I have only given him a couple clicks of charge.
Speed- 8 7 7 6 5 5 4 3 3 2
Attack- 10 10 9 9 8 8 7 7 6
Defense- 17 16 17 17 16 15 14 13 12 11
Damage- 4 4 3 3 3 3 2 2 2 2
This would be for a unique character if I had my way. Obviously he would require the helmet for mental protection. I gave him more damage because the guy is actually as strong as Hercules. Check out www.marveldirectory.com if you don't believe me. Mind you his strength falls off faster then Hercules, because I don't think that he has as much endurance as the Demi-God. I figured that a guy w/ a class 3000 force field and unearthly body armor could have impervious for the first 2 clicks. Mind you Juggy isn't a world renowned fighter, mostly just a basher. Please tell me what you guys think.

[Mongoose]

Please note that he has only 2 clicks of impervious, then invulnerability, afterwards he has toughness. The colors are the same, so I know that it is hard to decipher.

[Morglum]

Take this comment with a HUGE grain of salt as I'm a newbie HC player and I know almost nothing of comic books...

But I really think tha Juggernaut should be one of those super high costed figs. He is so strong after all. I would up his attack and damage a little and would replace Impervious with Invulnerability as well as taking out some toughness .

[whiteperegrine]

I dunno, unearthy endurance is pretty durn good. does herc even have that? due to this I would wait a bit more before dropping his damage to 2 clicks. ...say the last two?...if then

I would drop impervious for invuln and have the invuln last longer if not all the way through his dial. after all, he does not get weaker as fight progresses...

how much is he with your given stats?

[mrtomsmith]

I think he deserves more charge. That's his thing - he runs into stuff. Two clicks is like Sabertooth or Mr Hyde or (DC) Hawk, and these are guys who aren't specifically known for it. Sure, Rhino should have more, but Rhino should have it on most/all of his clicks. I'd say Juggie should get 4-5 clicks of it. And I'd drop his speed a bit slower, to make it work better (8 8 7 7 6 6 5 4 4 3?).

Otherwise, I pretty much agree. Personally, I might drop his Attack a little faster, and his damage a little slower, but that's just my opinion.

[Mongoose]

how much is he with your given stats?
I wish I knew too. I would think that he is in the 180-200 point realm, but that is a guess. I didn't give him a high attack value because Cain isn't very proficient at fighting. The guy punches people in the face. There are no karate kicks, karate chops, or wrestling maneuvers performed by Cain. He just punches people (I think that Wolverine is alot better fighter in the comics, and the V. Wolverine only has a 10 attack). I guess I could give him a 11 though for the first click. On another note yes Hercules does have unearthly endurance as well. I just see Hercules as having lasting power. Mayhaps I could've given him another click of 3 damage. The impervious though is meant for his forcefield (That force field is almost impossible to destroy, should he be smart enough to actually use it, which is not that often).

[gelf13]

my 2 cents worth:
The charge is good, but could last for a few more clicks. He should have a fairly low movement (maybe 6) as he is the irresistable force, but not a speed demon. Also, I think he should have a lower attack (he is fairly easy to dodge.) and as you say, more of a basher than a fighter. I think he could also have a lower damage but have 3 last most of the dial. I wish he could have willpower instead of B/F because I think he should be able to push thru his dial, however, I understand that his helmet keeps him from being MCed. I would trade that for willpower tho.
for what it's worth.

Gelf

[JayThor]

Originally posted by mrtomsmith
I think he deserves more charge. That's his thing - he runs into stuff. Two clicks is like Sabertooth or Mr Hyde or (DC) Hawk, and these are guys who aren't specifically known for it. Sure, Rhino should have more, but Rhino should have it on most/all of his clicks. I'd say Juggie should get 4-5 clicks of it. And I'd drop his speed a bit slower, to make it work better (8 8 7 7 6 6 5 4 4 3?).

.
I disagree. He doesn't run into things. He walks through them. He should not have charge. Sabretooth and Mr. Hyde are known for aggressive attacks, as is Hawk, the aggressive half of Hawk and Dove. Juggernaut is more of a "bring it to me, cause you can't hurt me" type. He allows his defenses to cover him, and he walks wherever he wants, confident he can't be hurt.

[Headcase]

Hey Mongoose. :) The stats you gave above when plugged into the formula spreadsheet that's been circulating work out to Juggy costing 159.978 points. This asumes a range of 0, 1 target only, no team affiliation, and the last value under "attack" as 6. (You have nine values for attack, but 10 for the rest.)

Just getting around to looking at custom dials/stats myself...innit fun? ;)

Hope that helps.
~HC.

[Mongoose]

Thanks Headcase. I appreciate it. Where is the formula at. Oh and I goofed up on his attack. My bad.

[Silverlynx35]

Hmmm, my fav character, that obligates me to chime in.
I think those stats are good. I guess what I would like to see is replace the BF with 5 clicks of Willpower and make him an even 200 pts. Then, with the high defense, he is hard to MC but would get easier, representing his helmet coming off, plus if he is MC'd, it would do its toll on the attacker. Would I play this 200pt Juggernaut? H3LL yeah, every time I imagine.
I agree with Gelf in making the movement a 6 and making the charge 4 clicks. That would better represent his lumbering, yet formidable nature. Even without charge, I get nervous being within 3 squares of Juggy. I would leave the move at 6 until halfway through the dial then drop it to 4 or 5 the rest of the way. And I'd leave the starting damage but have it bottom out at 3 for the rest of the dial.

Just a thought
SL35

[Mongoose]

Good points from all of you. I just didn't wanna make him too powerful. I guess that he could have more clicks of charge attack. The 8 movement was taken off of my V. Juggy's stats. I have to admit that i don't see him as moving very fast (He probably should have a 6 move, not an 8 like Sabretooth).

[Silverlynx35]

Why not make him very powerful? He's held his own against the best and teams of the best. I've rarely seen him truely defeated. Ok, WarHulk got him recently...with the help of Apocolypse. Otherwise he just gets MC'd into submission or distracted by shiney objects. I'll be curious to see how many points the "Rampaging Hulk" is going to be but I don't think 200pts is out of the question for Juggy.

SL35

[akdov]

juggernaut is my favorite character especially marvel vs capcom 2.
if i had to make this character i would have to keep in mind that he is supposed to be an unstoppable force.


movement: 8 7 7 6 6 5 5 5 4 4 first click has charge

attack: 11 10 9 9 8 8 7 7 6 6 super strenght till the last 2
clicks

defense 18 17 17 17 16 16 15 15 14 14 invulnerability for the first 5 clicks then toughness for 4 clicks and then last click has regeneration. besides superstrength this is what juggernaut does he is easy to hit but so hard to actually hurt. meaning characters with low attacks should have no chance to hurt him. and several times he just simply recovers from horrible wounds in seconds giving him 1 click of regen

damage: 4 4 3 3 3 3 2 2 2 2 he has battle fury for the first 3 clicks. and then willpower for the next 3. i would love to switch these 2 around but i think it would be unfair to be able to taxi him on his first few clicks. and about willpower, the guy is UNSTOPABLE! hes like a terminator never tiring never stopping and certainly not taking damage for doing 2 things in a row.


for goodness sakes look at titania and she hulk. those 2 are not even in the same league as juggernaut and yet they have better dials. juggernaut fights the hulk to standstills and can take on the entire xmen team.

no team affiliation. about 160 points. id love to play this guy. hes a one man army.

akdov

[Thunderbolts]

Hey y'know there is hope yet for a new Juggernaut fig, since they can do one for his X-Men membership.... although I strongly disagree with him being an X-Man in the first place, any excuse to get a Juggy with CHARGE is a noble one.

[Supamain]

Juggernaut is my 2nd favorite! (tied with Magneto, which I'm sorry, got TOTALLY scr3wed w/stats) This is what I would've done with him-

Speed- 6 7 7 6 6 5 5 5 4 4 3
Attack- 12 12 11 10 9 9 8 7 9 8 6
Defense- 17 16 17 16 16 15 15 14 16 15 14
Damage- 4 4 3 3 3 2 2 2 3 2 2

The "3" on the 9th click you ask? When he stops folding 18 wheelers around his foes, he's still able to knock guys around for the KO. :D

[the itsy bit]

first off..
for you people who want willpower on Chucky, OK but that's a defencive stat so it would mean the Juggernaut loses INV !!!

I wouldn't mind having impervious on him though because not much can hurt him (IMP is better then INV in my opinion !).
1 click of charge would suit him fine, charge throughout his dial is overkill and really doesn't fit him.

let him keep 4 damage for longer 3,4 clicks, he is a brute !
BF is as much part of his character as his INV, I just wish it wouldn't prevent him from throwing objects.:(

[ORION-TREVORAN]

The only solution :

Double color Dials - Invulnerability+Willpower

For Magneto : Energy Shield/deflection + invulnerability

.......

[kaizot]

OK, here is my version... a one man 200 pt team

Juggernaut
Cost: 200 (using Retardog's Formula)
Range: 0 Targets: 1
No team affiliation

Speed: 6 6 6 6 6 5 5 5 5 4 4
Attack: 11 10 10 10 10 9 9 8 8 7 7
Defense: 17 16 16 18 17 17 16 15 15 15 14
Damage: 3 4 5 4 4 3 3 3 3 2 2

Like many have pointed out, just d@mn hard to take out! He does get a little angrier at the beginning, but then starts taking his lumps. Until the end, the only way to MC him is to outwit his helmet. Just enough charge to last him into his anger. And a dial that just won't quit.

This is the Juggernaut that I would like to play! (he would still go down to numbers though)

[JayThor]

Why do folk on this thread and the Gladiator thread keep putting Impervious on these characters? Marvel clix don't have it. That has only been on DC figs, who do not have Invulnerability. Have any of you heard that those will cross over? I think they will be kept separate and Marvel won't have Imp.

[Mournblade]

I'm in the 'No Charge for Juggernaut!' camp. His main schtick is walking. He walks through things. Over things. But never around things. Walks. His phrase, 'Nothing can stop the Juggernaut!' is not a measure that he walks up and hits you, it's that he's impossible to stop once he starts walking. You know, like a (duh) juggernaut.

Impervious I agree with. That's his schtick, he takes it and takes it and takes it. In fact, often the only way to defeat Juggernaut in his first dozen appearances was to rip his helmet off and mind blast him. His strength is a byproduct of him being unstoppable.

So, I'm thinking Charge is the wrong thing to give Juggernaut. He doesn't need it, but Impervious is good. He takes it and takes it and takes it and takes it and takes the best you have and then hits you. With a truck, preferably.

Juggernaut is a gimmick with life, a damage sponge and walking wall with flair. I think that the current 'Clix is good, but could be better. This though, is a bit much.

[the itsy bit]

Originally posted by JayThor
Why do folk on this thread and the Gladiator thread keep putting Impervious on these characters? Marvel clix don't have it. That has only been on DC figs, who do not have Invulnerability. Have any of you heard that those will cross over? I think they will be kept separate and Marvel won't have Imp.

Nightcrawler has HSS (quicksilver didn't though) a power first introduced by DC, so it 's very possible/likely the powers will get mixed in Marvel/DC.
If it's more like the manifestation of powers then WK will give them that power whether it's Marvel or DC !
I would like to think INV as a very though to damage fig and IMP is a step above that.

[Mongoose]

I gave Juggy impervious because he has a Class 1000 force field (In short he can survive not 1, but 2 nuclear bombs). I have to admit that i botched up his speed (WAY too high). He does have charge though. Go here for those that don't believe me.
www.marveldirectory.com These guys know what they are talking about. I will try to redo Juggy next month, and w/o impervious.

[Manchine]

Now I have looked at all the posts and such. Debating this back and forth about Juggy. Cain usually doesnt take anything to serious until he starts loosing or if its a heavy hitter (no colussus doesnt count). I figured start out as he gets hurt he litterally starts paying attention and starts fighting. Not to the extent of Hulk and others but Blastaar and Super Skrull.

Juggernaut Unique

Speed 5 5 5 6 6 6 5 5 5 4

Attack 9 10 11 12 11 10 9 8 7 6

Defense 15 16 17 17 16 15 14 14 16 14

Damage 3 3 4 4 4 3 3 3 3 2



Charge He starts to get hurt he starts fighting for real.

Super Strength Same as above.

Invulnerablity Its juggernaut!!!

Toughness Again its Juggernaut!!!

Battle Fury It makes sense no mind control.

[Mongoose]

His speed looks OK Manchine, but Juggy starts out strong. He really doesn't need to build up a temper like the Hulk. That damage is kinda high too. 3 clicks of 4 damage is kinda beyond Thanos, and he is a bigger hitter then Juggy. I definitely agree with you on the defense stats, although the target number should be higher the 1st click.

[Manchine]

Juggy usually doesnt take his fights seriously, except when he is fighting Thor or Hulk or the entire Xmen team and he has learned to do that. As for the 4 damage Thing does the same damage right now. So thats not that bad. He is 1 over She Hulk. So this damage isnt that far off.

Thanos is another one they goofed up on. He should be far more of a monster then what he is in IC.

Juggy doesnt fight that well until he has to or gets mad. He not that hard to hit until he starts not goofing around. When he finally starts to really fight he gains charge. His strongest klix is if he gets hit for 5 damage, which is his 4th klix.