Lunge and Pounce Questions

[spider_ham]

Please disregard the 10% Feat Rule for this.

1. Is Lunge + Shake-Off + Double-Time + Move and Attack a compatible combo?

Double-Time and Pounce aren't compatible, as one requires a move action (DT), and the other simply allows movement (Pounce). However, would a character be able to use an attack via Move and Attack at the end of the final movement?

R Ghost Rider (FF) or E Spider-Man (Sinister) are my choices for "Character X," due to having L/C and/or CCE to maximize Lunge.


With Lunge, Character X breaks away automatically and can move 2 squares before being given a move action. Shake-Off allows the character to deal 1 damage to all adjacent opposing characters when it does so (granted Character X is a giant or transporter).

MOVE ACTION BEGINS
Double-Time grants up to 2x movement.
Attack portion of Move and Attack ability commences after movement ends.


2. How about Lunge + Shake-Off + Drag + Pounce?


Character X uses Lunge to break away, deal damage with Shake-Off and move 2 squares.
Character X ends adjacent to an opposing character and is then is given a power action to move up to half its movement and carry the opposing target with it.
At the end of the movement, Character X drops off character, deals any knockback damage (from changing elevations), and performs an attack (Pounce).


Would the power action activate both Drag and Pounce, as movement is halved and within the parameters of Pounce (up to its [full] speed value)?

Finally, Ghost Rider could be given Loner, and Spider-Man could copy the Guardians of the Globe TA for more effectiveness.

[Maraud]

With Double time you can not make an attack during the movement and with the move and attack you are making an attack during movement so those do not work together.
Also Shake off requires a Break Away roll, so auto breakaways will not deal the 1 damage.
Lunge requires you to move the 2 square before the CCA not before movement. So are u giving them an action that is a CCA or results in a CCA? if not then u can not use lunge.
So with charge u give the power action (or what ever it is) are they being given a CCA yet? no lunge. Move half movement. Give CCA as a free action no u can use lunge.
Also drag requires a power action so you could not make an attack while using drag.

[CaptainNifty]

Why couldn't you use Lunge with pounce?

[Harpua]

Please disregard the 10% Feat Rule for this.

1. Is Lunge + Shake-Off + Double-Time + Move and Attack a compatible combo?

Double-Time and Pounce aren't compatible, as one requires a move action (DT), and the other simply allows movement (Pounce). However, would a character be able to use an attack via Move and Attack at the end of the final movement?

R Ghost Rider (FF) or E Spider-Man (Sinister) are my choices for "Character X," due to having L/C and/or CCE to maximize Lunge.


With Lunge, Character X breaks away automatically and can move 2 squares before being given a move action. Shake-Off allows the character to deal 1 damage to all adjacent opposing characters when it does so (granted Character X is a giant or transporter).
MOVE ACTION BEGINS
Double-Time grants up to 2x movement.
Attack portion of Move and Attack ability commences after movement ends.


As Maraud said, the Lunge comes immediately before the attack..which is after the movement begins (even if the attack occurs in square 1), so it could not be used to auto break away.
Furthermore, if you have to break away you are adjacent to an opponent and can therefore not even use M&A.
One thing he did get slightly wrong is DT + M&A. They can be used together, but no attack can be made. (You get to move 2x speed and ignore characters...which couldn't be done with only DT.)

2. How about Lunge + Shake-Off + Drag + Pounce?


Character X uses Lunge to break away, deal damage with Shake-Off and move 2 squares.
Character X ends adjacent to an opposing character and is then is given a power action to move up to half its movement and carry the opposing target with it.
At the end of the movement, Character X drops off character, deals any knockback damage (from changing elevations), and performs an attack (Pounce).


Would the power action activate both Drag and Pounce, as movement is halved and within the parameters of Pounce (up to its [full] speed value)?
This wouldn't work either. A power action can only activate one thing.


Why couldn't you use Lunge with pounce?
No reason...you can.

[jak7890]

Just to highlight what Harpua said:

LUNGE MOVEMENT HAPPENS JUST BEFORE THE ATTACK!

If you have an ability that's compatible with lunge that allows movement, do it first while following all of the standard movement rules and then you get to use lunge movement just before the attack.

[spider_ham]

To recap:


Lunge requires an attack to be made after moving
Lunge + Charge or RS or HSS or Pounce or Move and Attack = :)


Correct?

It seems as if Lunge and Movethrough could be compatible (given the right conditions), but must a break away roll be made?

[CaptainNifty]

To recap:


Lunge requires an attack to be made after moving
Lunge + Charge or RS or HSS or Pounce or Move and Attack = :)


Correct?

It seems as if Lunge and Movethrough could be compatible (given the right conditions), but must a break away roll be made?

I would actually word it as such: Charge or RS or HSS or Pounce or Move and Attack + Lunge=:grin:

I would also say that Lunge allows you two move before a close combat attack, but I think you've got the right idea.

[spider_ham]

Lunge activates after action is declared, with 2 movement prior to the actual movement portion of the action. Got it.

Thanks! I'm simply trying to come up with a feat stack that centers around L/C.

So far:

Pounce + Lunge + Vault + Retaliation : 28 points

[Harpua]

Lunge activates after action is declared, with 2 movement prior to the actual movement portion of the action. Got it.
I don't think you have it, though.

It comes before the attack, not the movement.

[Harpua]

I don't think you have it, though.

It comes before the attack, not the movement.

Say you have Lunge on Robin (Charge + L/C).

He is based by Joker. He wants to hit Penguin.

. . . . . . . . . . .
. . . . . . . . T . .
. J R . . . . . . P .
. . . . . . . . . . .

Robin declares a power action to activate Charge.
He rolls breakaway.
If successful, he moves (via Charge) on he red path.
He declares his free close combat action.
NOW he uses Lunge moving the two squares on the blue path and breaking away from Two-Face to attack the Penguin.

[tidge]

The above is one of the subtleties of Lunge: Does "no breakaway" mean that after the first square of Lunge Movement, when Robin has become adjacent with Two Face, he doesn't have to stop moving?

I just want to make sure we get this right, because it's highly confusing on account of the different things that work differently to ignore characters B2B (for example, Leap/Climp, Flight, feats).

(I see that Robin could use a different path to get to the final red square of course)

[Harpua]

The above is one of the subtleties of Lunge: Does "no breakaway" mean that after the first square of Lunge Movement, when Robin has become adjacent with Two Face, he doesn't have to stop moving?
First of all...that's a mistake with my diagram. I meant for it to be this:
. . . . . . . . . . .
. . . . . . . T . . .
. J R . . . . . . P .
. . . . . . . . . . .

That's why I mentioned that Robin would not have to break away.


Secondly, in the bad example above, using that path would stop the movement.
I still don't see how that is subtle in any way. Nothing at all indicates in any way that you ignore characters for movement.
I just want to make sure we get this right, because it's highly confusing on account of the different things that work differently to ignore characters B2B (for example, Leap/Climp, Flight, feats).
I don't see it as confusing.

(I see that Robin could use a different path to get to the final red square of course)
Yeah

[spider_ham]

I don't think you have it, though.

It comes before the attack, not the movement.

Movement -> Lunge -> Attack. :) Thanks, again.