Some questions from a Noob

[payback1977]

Hey there all, Long time player but have recently tried to up my game in to more competitveand a few questions have come up in my head:

If I Thunderbolt to another team ability that shares (ie Defender or Batman Enemy), can the Thunderbolted character share with others of his (new) kind?

Also can you PC rolls like the roll for how much you heal on support or your opponents Super Senses roll? Basically is there a roll of the dice that you cannot PC?

Thanks you all your help and here is to the return of Clix

It's Hammer Time!!!!!

[CheeseWiz]

1. Yes, if you mean for example, Ant Man, with his 20 defense, is T-bolted to Defenders; he could then share that defense with other Defenders on the team. As an aside, Wildcards can no longer copy ATA's, nor lend their combat values out to other team-mates.

2. For the most part, you can re-roll your dice on your turn, and have your opponent re-roll his dice on his turn. There are other instances of not being able re-roll the dice, like for the earthquake BFC, but I don't have a handy rule of thumb to catch every scenario. Sorry.

[Crow]

1. Yes, if you mean for example, Ant Man, with his 20 defense, is T-bolted to Defenders; he could then share that defense with other Defenders on the team. As an aside, Wildcards can no longer copy ATA's, nor lend their combat values out to other team-mates.

Hang on... I'm not sure T-bolting actually gives you possession of the Defenders team symbol (which is a requirement to lend defense). I thought it merely lets you use the ability. After all, there's a clause in T-bolts that says "their affiliation does not change".
T-bolts says they "gain the ability", but not necessarily that they possess the symbol being copied, ergo it's kinda like wild-carding.

[lancelot]

Hang on... I'm not sure T-bolting actually gives you possession of the Defenders team symbol (which is a requirement to lend defense). I thought it merely lets you use the ability. After all, there's a clause in T-bolts that says "their affiliation does not change".
T-bolts says they "gain the ability", but not necessarily that they possess the symbol being copied, ergo it's kinda like wild-carding.

It does give them the ability. CheeseWiz is correct.

[Quebbster]

It does give them the ability. CheeseWiz is correct.

Indeed. It was ruled around Origin (when the Mercenary feat was released) that Thunderbolts possess the TA they choose. Wildcards and Mercenaries only use it though.

[CheeseWiz]

Hang on... I'm not sure T-bolting actually gives you possession of the Defenders team symbol (which is a requirement to lend defense). I thought it merely lets you use the ability. After all, there's a clause in T-bolts that says "their affiliation does not change".
T-bolts says they "gain the ability", but not necessarily that they possess the symbol being copied, ergo it's kinda like wild-carding.

I was so afraid I was going to have to eat crow on this . . .

[Harpua]

I was so afraid I was going to have to eat crow on this . . .

I'm not sure he'd be in favor of that.

[Crow]

Indeed. It was ruled around Origin (when the Mercenary feat was released) that Thunderbolts possess the TA they choose. Wildcards and Mercenaries only use it though.

Boy is THAT ever broken! I can't say it's a very pleasant ruling... after all, who wants to see Ant-Man's 20 defense getting around. I never thought I'd say this, but thank goodness for retirement.

... then what does the clause "their affiliation does not change" mean? Is it for things like when I've declared Ultimate X-Men TA against all members of the "Avengers". If they chose to T-bolt to Defenders, are they "Defenders" as well? They possess the team symbol, as we've established. What then happens if I call Ultimate X-Men TA against all "Defenders".

[normalview]

Boy is THAT ever broken! I can't say it's a very pleasant ruling... after all, who wants to see Ant-Man's 20 defense getting around. I never thought I'd say this, but thank goodness for retirement.

Well, if you don't like it now, you would have hated it pre-Fantastic Four rules. Back then, wildcards could copy the ATA, so you could have a characters like Shadow Lass or Positron copy Ant-Man's T-bolted Defenders, borrow his 20 DV, the use Defend to share it with any character that is adjacent adjacent.

... then what does the clause "their affiliation does not change" mean? Is it for things like when I've declared Ultimate X-Men TA against all members of the "Avengers". If they chose to T-bolt to Defenders, are they "Defenders" as well? They possess the team symbol, as we've established. What then happens if I call Ultimate X-Men TA against all "Defenders".

Eh, basically it all stems from the ever fluid and changing terminology in the game (which was particularly problematic during the early days of feats, when Thunderbolts was released). Essentially, we've never had a rock-solid definition for "affliation". There was a lot of back and forth initially over exactly what that meant and the current interpretation (and has been for awhile now) is that it means that the Team Symbol remains unchanged (they still have the Avengers symbol), but they possess a different team ability. Think of it like taking white-out to the Avengers entry on the PAC, leaving the symbol, but then re-writing everything that comes after the symbol. So, yes, a T-bolted Ant-Man does indeed possess the Defenders (or whatever) TA because that is what is now written next to the Avengers symbol thanks to this feat.

To answer your specific question, it depends on if the game effect is referencing the possesion of the ability or the symbol. For example, part of the Hypertime/KC TA requires the Hypertime/KC symbol (if that character wants to freely move adjacent to other Hypertime characters)... a T-bolted character could use the rest of the TA (characters have to roll to move adjacent) but they would not be able to use the part of the TA that requires team symbol possession (they would also have to roll to move adjacent). Ultimate X-men on the other hand only requires that a TA is used; T-bolts would qualify (and techinically even wildcards... but then wildcards could simply choose to not use the targetted TA).

HYPERTIME Whenever an opposing character given a move action, power action, or free action attempts to move from a square that is not adjacent to the character using the Hypertime team member ability to a square adjacent to the character using the Hypertime team member ability, roll one d6 before moving the opposing character, even if it ignores the effects of characters on movement. On a result of 1 or 2, the opposing character can’t move to any square adjacent to the character using the Hypertime team member ability that turn. Characters with this team symbol and characters suffering knock back ignore this team
ability

Ultimate X-Men ™ At any time during the game, a character using the Ultimate X-Men team ability can choose an opposing character or a team; this choice can be made only once per game even if the character has used another team ability. When this character attacks the chosen character or an opposing character using the team ability of the chosen team, modify this character’s attack value by +1

[CheeseWiz]

I'm not sure he'd be in favor of that.

Well, I don't think I'd be too happy about it either. I'd probably at least get feathers stuck between my teeth. Me, at least I'm Kraft Cheesy!