DC Heroes Vs. Villains

[Sinister SID]

I'm wondering which side would win this epic battle (heroes vs. villains -- assuming you took the most effective version of each character and threw in every unique) in the opinion of those who have played almost every DC click available -- I only collect and play villains and although there are some very powerful bad-guys kicking around I have a sneaking suspicion that the heroes would wipe the floor with them. Any thoughts?


P.S. You want me to field Black Manta!?! I'm going home.

[kingbrendarr]

By saying the most effective versions that opens the door for promo Batman and OWAW Superman and I have to say that while Darkseid and Doomsday are beefy villians and that there are a lot of powefull villians in thier own right in the set the cheese that is Superman and Batman would probably win out.

[CyberVenom]

I gotta agree with Brendarr here. While the bad guys are good, the good guys are better.

[Mjolnir]

The only way to make it fair would be for it to have a set point limit. No unlimited points.
that being said....i think it could be close.
Brainiac13, Doomsday, Gorilla Grodd, Bane..... those 4 figs could cause most opponents to pause. Throw in Darkseid, the Key, Desaad for some outwit and healing.....
yes, the Good Guys have Batman, Superman, Nightwing, Flash, and some others....That's something interesting, anyone want to play it out and see who would win?? I don't have enough of the figs.

I tend to play Good Guys only.

[kingbrendarr]

once you put a point cap on it you can make anything viable even 300 points of thugs has a chance to do something, but I do think that the villians have a good team its just that the LE superman and the promo batman in particular are plain unbalanced to start with.

[DeepPsykedelic]

Very interesting topic...

I used the HC Army Builder and the DC Villians (using what I think is the best version of the character including LEs, w/no dupes, and omitting a few characters I think are "useless") totalled 22 characters and a total of 1500 points.

The DC Heroes (chosen the same way as the villians, no promo batman since he's not tournament legal) totalled 21 figures and a total of 1451.

In looking at the teams, I think the heroes would lose to the villians. The villians only have three flyers (heroes 5), however, the villians have 3 medics (including desaad) (heroes 0), 8 characters w/outwit (heroes 3), 4 characters who can potentially perplex up damage (heroes 1), 4 mind controllers (Heroes 0), and 4 psychic blasters (Heroes 0). Who would be that frightened of the OWAW Superman when Darkseid could potentially do 7 damage to him with no chance of ever healing?

I clearly like the villians more, so I'm probably biased, but if a game like this were to pan out (and it probably will now that the idea has been put in my head), I think the villians would obliterate the heroes.

Comments? Thoughts?

DP

[PMMJ]

Originally posted by kingbrendarr
once you put a point cap on it you can make anything viable even 300 points of thugs has a chance to do something, but I do think that the villians have a good team its just that the LE superman and the promo batman in particular are plain unbalanced to start with.

I actually don't think 300 points of Thugs has a chance to do much of anything, thanks to the action token system. Mobs are only good for having a lot of health levels, so it's just a matter of killing enough to make it worthwhile doing.

[kingbrendarr]

First 300 points of thugs means that team never has to push so the token system allready favors the team that can always go . 2nd 300 points of thugs means more total clicks of life than a "classicly balanced team" and before you even think it medics are going to be tied up by that many models. Im not saying that 300 points of thugs is uber but it is an army that will make you work for your win and thats balanced is it not ?

[kingbrendarr]

Originally posted by DeepPsykedelic
Very interesting topic...

I used the HC Army Builder and the DC Villians (using what I think is the best version of the character including LEs, w/no dupes, and omitting a few characters I think are "useless") totalled 22 characters and a total of 1500 points.

Comments? Thoughts?

DP

can I see the list ? Im curious how it broke down before I can comment too much.

[DeepPsykedelic]

Villians

LE Harley
LE Riddler
LE Manbat
LE Catwoman
LE T.O. Morrow
U Darkseid
U Desaad
U Joker
U The Key
V Arcane
V Bane
V Brainiac 13
V Clayface III
V Doomsday
V Gorilla Grodd
V Intergang Agent
V Intergang Medic
V Grundy
V Weather Wizard
E Black Manta
E Criminal
E Lackey
=1,500 pts


Heroes

LE Aquaman
LE Hawkman
LE Booster Gold
LE Blue Beetle
LE Superman
U Catwoman
U Gordon
U Flash
V Changeling
V Dove
V Flash
V Gotham Policeman
V Hawk
V Huntress
V Metropolis SCU
V Nightwing
V Plasticman
V Robin
V Steel
V Swampthing
E Batman
=1451 pts

Those are the two teams....

Comments?

DP

[kingbrendarr]

Well to adress the lack of support .. checkmate is a "goodguy" operation so you can add the checkmate agent and medic to the goodguy team balanceing out points and powers and thats a darn good matchup I would say no team has a clear advantage really. although if you want to stay true to the spirit of the no dupe rule one of the catwomans should go so there is only one selena kyle on the board but thats just my rambleing. Also the good guys have three HSS figs that might make for a rough time for a the badguy medics and perplexers.



Edited to add further reflections sorry for the rambleing nature of my post.

[DeepPsykedelic]

I completely forgot that the villian Catwoman and the hero Catwoman were the same person. Thanks. I have taken the villian Catwoman out.

I also added to the hero side a vet checkmate medic and agent. I thought they were villians, but they are not (double-checked).

That brought the villians down to ~1425pts and the heroes to 1486. So I removed some additional, in my opinion "useless", villians (Black Manta, Clayface III, and the Weather Wizard), upgraded the Lackey and Criminal to vet status, and added the 200 pt Sinestro.

Now the villians have 19 figs totalling 1495 pts. The heroes 23 figs totalling 1486pts.

I'm thinking fifteen actions and no time limit.

Comments?

DP

[kingbrendarr]

I wish I had the time to play it out myself ... as is its very close the vilians have more total clicks of life thanks to sinestro but the heros have a lot of raw power .

[epr065]

I'm pretty new to the game, but my friend and I have only been playing good v. bad games. We started with a DC Premier set, quickly added 4 DC boosters, then 2 more, then one Marvel IC (Juggernaut Unique!) and one CT booster. The addiction grew, and last night we picked up a Marvel Premier for $12, a IC booster and a DC starter ($8). We're going hunting today for more clearance priced clix....

Anyway, we've always played good teams v. bad teams, even when blending Marvel and DC, and every time the good guys have won, until last night. Last night we pulled a Rookie Doomsday out of the DC starter. My friend wanted to play some of the newer characters, and neglected to put Batman on his team for Outwit, or anyone with a true 3 or more damage. His only hope at hitting Doomsday was Huntress, with RCE, but Doomsday took her out in one swip in a Charge attack, so the game was over really fast. We finished anyway, letting D sit to the side, but if he had had Batman with outwit, I fear the result would have been different.

[DeepPsykedelic]

I psychic blasted someone's vet doomsday once for a total of 6 damage (Darkseid w/damage perplexed up by 3). The bad thing about Doomsday is his point cost and his vulnerability to psychic blast and outwit. However, in this scenario they would be on the same team gunning after the same enemy, OWAW Superman.

I think that the heroes have sheer numbers to their advantage, but the villians have power.

I mean, look at the roster for both teams. It has to be Villians all the way!!!!

Which got me thinking, after this game is played (and the DC villians win), who would win, DC Villians or Marvel Villians. I think that this matchup would be more fair.

[kingbrendarr]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by DeepPsykedelic
However, in this scenario they would be on the same team gunning after the same enemy, OWAW Superman.


As Batman and Nightwing smile in the shadows outwit doomsday into a thug and beat the tar out of him . Go on clark fly around some more and get us another one this is great.

[Comte]

Which got me thinking, after this game is played (and the DC villians win), who would win, DC Villians or Marvel Villians. I think that this matchup would be more fair.

Well there is a small snag with this little planMarvel already has one expansion out and this gives them a shocking villian advantage. This can easly be summed up with Blaastar, Dr. Doom, and Super Skrull. So first we would have to limit it to basic sets but even then Marvel would still have an advantage. Many of marvel's most effective figgures are villians. First of all we have firelord, then bulls eye, as well as some other excelent figgures that aren't puppet master. Then on the sheer brute force side of things we have Thanos, Nightmare, Juggie, and some other things. To make matters worse for DC the points will probley be wonkey because of certain figures who should cost more points but don't.

Still...it would be an interesting fight. Marvel has a sevear lack of outwit on its side. On top of that its big figgure isn't as effective as other big figgures. If sinestro and darkseid were put to goo effect then they could seriously gut the Marvel offensive. Still it would be rather close. After all if someone didn't do something about vet ultron and bet boomerang then between them they could whip out a horrific amount of damage. Especialy if Nightmare is backing them up with enhancement. It would be a tricky game on many levels. Afterall there wouldn't be enough taxis to go around. I retract my earlyer statement of marvel's advantage. I think DC has a very good shot of comeing out ahead if for no other reason than because of three outwitters, four perplexers, and a couple of thick charecters who can absorbe a lot of damage.