Objects???

[Captain Spoon]

Could someone shed some light on this doubt?


I was viewing a Marvel vs Dc match , where a discussion about objects came up. Lets begin with the scenario...



XXXXXXXXX
XXXXXAHXX
XXXBXXXXX
XXXXXXXXX

A- aquaman ( he has super strength)
H- hawkman (he has charge)

B- black panther (he's on top of an object)

Well, the Dc player states that he will 'taxi' aquaman and charge towards black pathher. Here comes the situation, once hawkman and aquaman are in close combat with black panther like so....


XXXXXXXXX
XXAHXXXXX
XXXBXXXXX
XXXXXXXXX

The Dc player uses aquaman to grab the object which black is standing on and perceeds to smack him for 4.... Now, here is where i step in and tell him (politely) that he can't do that since aquaman is already in combat, that if he wanted to grab the object he would need to break away. So, he calls the judge,over and the judge says that what aquaman did was legal, that while in combat one (w/ super strength) a figure can grab adjacent objects...

who was right???

thx for the help

-SPOON!-

[Manchine]

Well Grabbing an object is a move action, which means he cant attack, unless he has charge. That is a basic rule. Also charging will be changed at the start of the month. Even though we already play this way. This below is in the new faqs. The charging rule was debatable until this.

A charging character with Super Strength cannot pick up an object as he/she comes into a square adjacent to an opposing character

[scowlingone]

You were right. Aquaman needs to use a move action to grab the object. As such, he needs to break away successfully to grab it.

And then he may not attack the same turn, as he does not have Charge.

Tactically, it's usually better to just forgo the Super Strength test and attack normally.

[Manchine]

I didnt think Aquaman had Charge, but I dont know DC as well as I know Marvel stats.

[Funky Jett]

Nope, he doesn't have Charge... the LE doesn't even have it.

[RavenProject]

Just to continue the line of questioning...

Here's the assumption:

Mr. Hyde (or other character with Super Strength) starts the turn adjacent to Elektra (or any other character with Stealth), who is hiding in a dumpster (or any other object).

Hyde wants to grab the dumpster without leaving the space he occupies.

Does he have to break away to do so?

I'm inclined to say no... here's why...

IC Rules, Page 20:
"Any time during a character's move action, he can pick up an object in a square he enters or on an adjacent square."

FAQ, under "Breakaway":
"Do not roll for breakaway unless you are actually attempting to move the figure."

In this case, you aren't actually moving the figure. You're using your move action to pick up the item. Thus, breakaway would not be necessary.

(I used this tactic to great effect just today... snatching up the item someone was hiding in so my ranged attackers could light him up.)

-J

[Todosi]

But you must move to pick up an object even if it means moving zero spaces. This was ruled on by Chapeau. Therefore, you must breakaway to move your character, then you could attack with it if you had charge.

Todosi

[HeroComplex]

The skinny:

Breakaway is required for a move action which entails actual movement. This includes Running Shot and Charge but does not apply to Barrier or Regeneration. Those in the second category specifically do not have the character move.

Picking up a figure, picking up an object, changing flight modes---all of these three occur during movement. Not just during move actions, but during actual movement. Any of these necessitate breakaway rolls if the figure begins adjacent to an opposing character.

[RavenProject]

Picking up a figure, picking up an object, changing flight modes---all of these three occur during movement. Not just during move actions, but during actual movement.

That's not what the rules say, though.

"Any time during a character's move action..."

Nothing in the FAQ contradicts this part of the rule that I've seen.

The FAQ is specific, however, about only requiring breakaway if you actually move rather than performing a different move action like Barrier or Regeneration.

So it brings me back to the question... where was it stated you had to actually move the figure in order to pick up an object?

-J

[Todosi]

Chapeau ruled on it on the official boards. You can PM him or do a search on the Wizkids site.

Todosi

[admironheart]

Hey I was about to ask the same q?

In the FAq it states that you only need a breakaway roll if you actually move.

In the FAQ it states that to use powers such as running shot,charge, etc you must first make a breakaway roll.

So I kinda thought the 2 were contradictory in this case.

this is the answer I was looking for

thanks
wes