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AZS
02/18/2003, 12:06
This article and content are property of the Author and is not to be redistributed or reposted in whole or in part without the Author's approval. However, feel free to link to the list page here (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16280) Thank you.

Welcome to my reviews and thanks for reading.
I’m writing these to start discussions, have some fun, and I hope you will too.
These reviews look at stats, cost, playability and strategy in the context of 200 and 300 pt games. Also, while I have nothing against mixing sets, to make this a little easier, these are only discussed in relation to the Marvel Universe.
Feel free to object or agree with anything! If you have a valid point, I’ll be more than happy to back you up.

Today’s furry Infinity Challenge nominee is: Sabretooth

This furry feral feline is one of the originals in the blades/claws/fangs club. Just don’t try to give him a bath or de-claw him, or you might end up looking like a Jerry Springer guest after an hour of “she’s my girlfriend!” “NO! She’s my girlfriend! All 300 pounds of her!” “Why you little! *expletive deleted*” (duck flying chair, etc).

Hey, I was snowed in yesterday, and it was either watch that, or the teen comedy/romance marathon on USA, and there’s only so many times you can watch “She’s All That” before you just want to hunt Freddy Prince Jr down, tie him up Clockwork Orange style, and force him to actually watch his own movies.
But I digress.

Ok, Sabretooth, right.

The hirsute ginsu has mostly the same things going for him across all versions; toughness, ample b/c/f, regen, and battle fury. The main difference is the stealth in the Rookie and Exp changing up for Charge in the Vet.

The rookie starts off pretty wicked with blades and toughness but only has a single starting click of stealth that gives way to battle fury on the second click. I personally like how Stealth and BF don’t overlap on this character. I can’t see how a figures who is supposed to have “Battle Fury” could be in stealth. Like your enemy would be walking around with his buddy and say
‘Hey, do you see that bush over there shaking and growling, what do you make of it?’
‘Well, it could be the wind.’
‘Yeah, but does that explain the animal grunts too?’
‘Not really, but I don’t see anything, so it must be safe.’

So Sabretooth doesn’t overlap those powers, and I dig it.
The stealth on the first click is helpful in getting Sabre up to his prey without getting picked off from range before he gets there. And if anyone wants to base him to take him out they have to contend with toughness plus 4 clicks of blades. But since the orange furred one only has a single click of stealth, a one – two combo punch from your opponent could do serious damage (one up close to get past stealth, and a second from range to take him out). Plus that battle fury shortly into the dial means you’ll be hard pressed to get him back to a medic. So it’s a good thing he’s self sufficient with Regeneration. On a really good roll of 6 Sabre can heal himself all the way back up to his first click. On an average roll though he’ll just bump himself back up to his toughness/Blades clicks to stay in the game and stay dangerous. But be careful about pushing to regen. There’s very little that your opponent can laugh at your more for than pushing to regen and getting a 3 to break even (and then be pushed) or 1 or 2 for a “Degeneration.”
For 38 points the rookie is an ok bargain, but there are some better b/c/f figures out there if you’re willing to mix it up.

The Experienced killer kitty is a better version of the Rookie with more clicks of stealth, better stats, and a deeper dial. Plus he gets the Brotherhood team ability so he can move for free. If you play with taxis a lot, that won’t help you much at the beginning of the game, but it can help him get back to a medic later and not waste your actions in the process. The team ability is also good for your wildcards to copy.

The staples are still there with toughness and blades, plus regen that can heal up to the first click with a fortunate roll. But the real benefit of the experienced version is that Battle Fury doesn’t rear its ugly head until the 3rd click. So you can taxi Sabre around longer to deal more carnage. All of this is a nice package for only 51 points. Very affordable for a figure that can be considered a big hitter on your team while still leaving plenty of points for a second big gun.

The Veteran version’s biggest difference is the 2 clicks of Charge up front instead of stealth. Plus, battle fury once again pops up on the second click, so overlapping with charge is a big bonus since he can’t be carried at that point.
A deeper dial, sustained stats, and more clicks of regen are what make this feline 18 points more than the exp one. But to say straight up this version is better would depend entirely on your play style. For my game, I tend to prefer the stealth and delayed BFury to the Charge upfront. Plus the fact that the attack value is the same from Exp to Vet means there isn’t a specific advantage to the more expensive version. If you like the added mobility of Charge, then this figure is good for the cost. Plus looking at other figures with Charge (most of them having super strength) then Sabretooth is cheaper and generally deals more damage than the others.

However, on his first click he deals a straight 3 damage or b/c/f and that’s a big toss up. Do you use the straight 3, or do you go for a blades roll and try to do better? The decision is easier with the rookie and exp who only do 2 damage to start.

Overall, the exp version is the one I play when I play Sabretooth. The added stealth, better stats and delayed Battle Fury all make this figure playable and dangerous. The rookie is too close to other Blades figures to stand out for me, and the Vet doesn’t fit with my play style as much at the Exp.
In both the Exp and Vet, the starting attack value of 10 is good but not great, and between that, the b/c/f rolls, and the regen, a Sabre can really benefit from a teammate with Probability control. Because nothing sucks worse than rolling a 1 on b/c/f against someone with toughness.

The unpredictability of Blades adds a lot of fun tension to the game for me, and gives these lower point cost figures the chance at hitting like the big guns. Figures like Sabretooth can be great for the cost and fit on nearly any team with room for plenty of other figures and strategies. Because of the moderate 10 attack value, he might not be a primary big gun, but with the chance of hitting for 5 or 6 damage, he’s a great clean up hitter, or good for taking out support in a single hit. Add in the Regen and he’s nearly self supportive. This is necessary since BF in the middle of the dial prevents him from being air lifted to the veterinarian.

A solid figure all around, this killer kitty, feral feline, perilous ##### is a dangerous figure to field and fits well on any team with any strategy.


Check out my other reviews at these links:
Marvel Reviews (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16280) . . . DC Reviews (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14015)

gelf13
02/18/2003, 12:25
Hey, I get first response? woo-hoo!
First Azs, there was a batllestar galactica marathon on yesterday. And you chose Jerry Springer? My respect just went down.
<sadly shakes head>
Anyway, nice review for Sabertooth. He is one of my fave figs. Most people underestimate his value and tend to ignore him until... BAM! <OK, so I watched a cooking show. Sue me:D )
I tend to use the E version but recently I've started using the U IC elektra instead. How do you compare the 2 cheap BCFers?
Thanks
Gelf

AZS
02/18/2003, 12:30
You had respect for me? :confused:
What is this world coming to!?!

As for U Elektra vs Sabre, well I like the cost and AV of Ms. Electric Nachos, but for savagery and self sufficiency Sabre is great. So it depends on your team and strategy.

Mongoose
02/18/2003, 12:32
I personally like how Stealth and BF don’t overlap on this character. I can’t see how a figures who is supposed to have “Battle Fury” could be in stealth. Like your enemy would be walking around with his buddy and say
‘Hey, do you see that bush over there shaking and growling, what do you make of it?’
‘Well, it could be the wind.’
‘Yeah, but does that explain the animal grunts too?’
‘Not really, but I don’t see anything, so it must be safe.’
LOL
Yeah I like to play with the veteran version of Sabretooth. His charge attack has saved me several times. I love killing off Cyclops with 1 attack (I have done that twice, to my buddies dismay). Wolverine seems kinda weak comparatively, and he also costs more. The one unique is better all around then the V. Sabretooth, but that Wolverine doesn't have the X-Men team ability.

Oldguynewbie
02/18/2003, 12:41
Daredevil gets jealous and Wolverine sits on the sidelines!

gelf13
02/18/2003, 13:16
You mean both U Elektra and Sabertooth on the same team?? Sure and next you'll add Spiral and a few Vamp Lackeys too??
<The Horror, the horror>

webhead817
02/18/2003, 13:38
I prefer playing with the le Victor Creed, because for $100 it should find it's way on every team I play!

However, of the R/E/V, I like both the E and V. The E is a nice piece at only a quarter of your 200 point team. I really like the vet though, as charge with B/C/F is a sweet combo for reaching far across the board.

As always, great analysis azs.

Spiritual_Ex
02/18/2003, 14:05
I've been on the recieving end of this guy (primarily the Vet) way too many times not to have a whole lot of respect for him. Definately would make my top 10 cost effective characters in the game. I've beat him down to regererate 2-3 times in a game before only to have him boost himself back up to full or nearly full power. The Charge gives him a great range when combined with a 8-10 move flyer or a TKer. This guy drives me nuts, and I shake my head with a bit of fear every time I see him. That isn't to say he is unbeatable, I mean as soon as you see his Regen clicks come up you just have to really lay into him (sometimes easier said than done if he's smacked you with claws a few times...).

Oh well, nice review, I pretty much agree with it all.

Mr. Pilkington
02/18/2003, 14:30
I have yet to do much with Sabretooth (used the rookie in a 100 point game with R Rogue and R Quicksilver vs a team of V Daredevil, E Elektra and E Blade... I lost, but I was teaching the other player the game). I have *never* *ever* successfully made a Regen roll. Not with Sabretooth, not with Wolverine, not with Thanos and not with V Hulk. I have always rolled a 1 or a 2. It's like a rule or a FAQ entry. "Regeneration: If Jason ever tries to Regen he just uses up an action. And if he pushes to try all other players must laugh as he hurts his own figure for nothing."

I haven't used PC with it yet (I like themed teams and haven't played enough BoEM to put r Scarlet Witch in with Sabretooth). The Vet Hulk did have Dr. Strange on his team, but due to Outwit, a ranged attacker and a big hit with an object Hulk never got to try to regen (not that Stephen was even on his PC click anyway... that came *after* "HULK NAP!"). In general for me healing just isn't helpful, other than swapping clicks with X-men or Titans in DC. So if you ever see a medic on my team just ignore it... I'll never get any benefit anyway. Or better yet, target it. Yeah! Go right at it 'cause this might be the game where all of my abysmal luck changes. ;)

All in all I think Sabretooth is a great figure. His powers fit and he can be dangerous. I'm just waiting for that Victor Creed to come in so that I can fail my regen roll with an LE! :D

Thorgrin
02/18/2003, 14:57
Too bad we can't make Freddy Prinze Jr. an "uber Thug" and have sabretooth smack him around all day long.. :)

Good review! I kind of like battle fury quicker on the dial. Helps prevent those mind controllers of making him kill all my figures. lol.

Mok
02/18/2003, 14:59
Azs,

I don't know if I've replied to any other of your reviews, but its about time. I read them, soak it all in, and then try to use your reviewed figures in games. I have to say, in my experience, you are right almost every single time. Not only do you do the figure justice, but you also do a great service to the character. Bravo!

Keep up the good work, and review any other figures you want, I'm always looking for some good reads!

Mok

Spookythecat
02/19/2003, 00:34
Nice. Always good to see Feline themed reviews.

And I agree that regenerate is tough to use... Very rarely is the opponent going to let the Kitty alone long enough for him to clear tokens and regenerate..

the itsy bit
02/19/2003, 05:50
I primarely use the V version because I like him to charge in (and with it he always has the first attack on Wolverine !).
how's that for a "feline" !:confused:

PC is a really good back-up plan for him (B/C/F and later on Regeneration), but I've not used him yet with it.

Overall I prefer Sabretooth over Juggernaut in the Brotherhood !

EmperorNorton
02/19/2003, 06:07
Nice review azs, just as always. And I was looking for a review of Sabretooth, because I'm just building a b/c/f team.
But could you add a review of LE Victor Creed, please?

EmperorNorton

AZS
02/19/2003, 09:00
Thanks for the kind words all.

It has been a while since I've mentioned my stance on reviewing LE's so here it is again...
I don't want to review the LE's because I want to write about figures that everyone has (mostly) an equal opportunity to play and not everyone has access to LE's, or can win them. Victor Creed LE is the epitome of that.

So for now I'm just sticking to figs in regular circulation. Maybe (maybe not) in the future when I run out of figs for the moment I might do a top "x" list of LE's, but that's pretty far off.

In the meantime, if anyone wants to send me a Victor Creed, that would certainly go a long way towards getting me to review him. :D

RavenProject
02/19/2003, 11:17
I'll take this one...

Victor Creed is basically V Sabretooh with a few adjustments. One is straightforward -- an additional click of Claws. His Attack value remains an 8 at this point, so it's a solid strike particularly in the late-game.

The other addition is four clicks of Stealth after his Charge. This is a mixed benefit, depending on which of those clicks you've hit.

For the first two, you've got the small problem of Battle Fury. The poor kitty can't be taxied. It's also highly unlikely that you've got Sabretooth near a telekinetic at this point, so he's got to get around on his own power. With a movement of 6 or 5 -- and, of course, less if you tuck him inside Hindering Terrain -- he's going to have a hard time playing catch-up. At the very least, he has the Brotherhood ability so that movement doesn't detract from your actions.

But on those second two clicks of Stealth, you can get a nice little treat. This is when Victor hits Regenerate. Tuck the kitty into Hindering Terrain and make the Regeneration roll in a safer place.

With that in mind, watch carefully to see if you've hit that second click of Stealth right before Regen. If you're there, push away to get yourself into place and go for Regen ASAP. Either get to hindering terrain like I said above, or run for your telekinetic so he can chuck you back into the fray right off.

Question is, is he worth it?

Hm... what do you mean by that?

For playability, he's a serious consideration. This is a solid upgrade from V Sabretooth for a small cost. If you'd consider using V Sabretooth, see if you can spare the six points for Victor... if you have him.

Which brings us to the real meat of the issue (raw, of course): Should you spend the $100+ to get Victor Creed?

I know of a lot of players who feel that if they spend mad ducats for a figure, using him should be an "instant win" situation. If you're expecting Victor Creed to be a Firelord cheese grater just because you're dropping a Benjamin, save your money. Victor Creed is a very strong and playable figure, but you could buy a lot of other figures for that c-note who would provide you much more game-breaking potential.

He is a *fun* figure, though. There is a lot of dice rolling involved with Victor -- as well as any version of Sabretooth or Logan. Every time you send those cubes clacking across the table, there's a tension and anticipation that makes the game more suspenseful and exciting. Will you nail a six on the Claws? Will you botch the Regeneration? I love those moments, and Victor Creed gives you a lot of new strategy options with his added clicks of powers. That's why *I* made the trade for him.

Does that help?

(Anyone want me to do more LE Reviews?)

-J

Mr. Pilkington
02/19/2003, 11:49
Cool! I'd like to see more LE reviews. I can even put a in good word for you with the guy who maintains the lists of the azs reviews to get you listed. ;)

Styrix
02/19/2003, 11:55
RavenProject,

azs has enough to do without reviewing the LEs, and your review was bother intelleigent and artixulate. Keep it up! If you make a regular schedule of them, like azs tries to do, you could quickly have a semi-following, especially with J Plink's logistical support. Go for it!

EmperorNorton
02/19/2003, 12:09
Thanks a lot RavenProject!
Your comments were very helpful for me and I'd surely appreciate if you did review some other LEs. Here in Germany there are few people who know about/want them, so it's not too difficult or expensive to get them. I got my LE Victor Creed for about 15$...

EmperorNorton

Styrix
02/19/2003, 12:10
I got my Creed by winning the CT Marquee and trading my not-so-Fantastic-prize with a very nice man I'd just beaten. He may not be worth a C-note, but he's better than LE Ben and Johnny.

the itsy bit
02/19/2003, 15:57
are a few clicks of extra B/C/F Stealth worth the effort of buying Victor ?
I say NO, If I ever pay big bucks for a unique/LE it will be a fig I can't get another version of.
Like : NIGHTCRAWLER !!

V Sabretooth will serve me just fine and at least I will be not to depressed If I roll badly for B/C/F,REgeneration !;)

Phantom
02/19/2003, 19:23
V Sabretooth is just a fiend, especially if the Dice Gods are with you. I’ve seen him single-handedly take out U Electra and U Wolverine, despite a BCF double-team (the dice gods were REALLY with me that day).