Ashes to Ashes, Jean Grey to Phoenix!

[HeroComplex]

With Infinity Challenge we were given Jean Grey, and the newest Xplosion sneak peek gives us the first step on Jean Grey's ascent to power. Take a look and give your thoughts!

[shin-goji]

Woot Woot!
First to reply! that's cool, ain't it? No? Dag...

If she seriously does have a fll 12" range, i'd taxi her forward with a SHIELD agent or two.

[Mushroomfantas]

A better Moondragon

[quixotequest]

I don't know how she is a better "Moondragon" unless you need TK down the dial and a longer flight and attack range. Which of course are advantages in and of themselves. Yes, Moondragon only has a 10 range, but she does same damage, plus has Mind Control, Phychic Blast and Regeneration versatility. And, only costs 71 pts. Phoenix is a more versatile Jean Grey, not a better "Moondragon."

[the itsy bit]

is a better Jean then the one we had from IC.

I suspect that a Dark phoenix (when made eventually) will be a far better fig then say Moondragon.

[shin-goji]

She won't be cheap enough to throw around hordes of Vampire Lackeys, but she's be an excellent ranged combattant. Have her carry around a SHIELD agent or fly one up to her!

[Kiften]

Eh, with Super Senses and MC I think I'd rather use Moondragon...
biggs

[Dr Phibes]

I like her. She's a needed flier though they still need someone a little cheaper for a taxi.

But all in all her powers look good. I'd play her on my team.

[IJIT]

This is crazy, by the time x-plosion comes out we will know almost every character who is in the set....ahhhhhh, but the pineapple tells all.

[Namor]

A range of 12 a speed of 10 with TK and toughness, id rather have Phoenix, team her up with V Psylocke (for enhancement), U Wolverine, and U Prof. X. And you got a good 300 point team which is versitile.

[Tsannik]

Where does HeroComplex come up with all these super-cool phrases to put in his subject line?!?

[Emperor Kang]

Based on what the designers have told us, I've put together what Phoenix should look like. I did this completely by examining the article and looking at other Jean Grey clix. I have no inside knowledge of the figure!

PHOENIX
Points: 85
Range: 12
Arrows: 1
Team: X-Men

Move: 10 9 9 8 7 7 6
Attack: 9 8 8 7 6 5 5
Defense: 16 15 17 16 15 14 13
Damage: 2 2 2 2 2 2 2

Basically, she'll have 7 clicks of life. Her first 6 clicks of Attack have TK. Her first 2 clicks of Defense have Toughness followed by 4 clicks of ESD. Note that even though this Jean is more advanced than her V Jean Grey version, she's lost Support!

An even closer dial could be estimated if someone wanted to take the time to compare her 85 points with some of the point estimation schemes floating around.

[AshenFang]

Ahh HeroComplex, always have to come up with these nifty little thread names! :D

Just curious, are you able to move posts? (Like the one's from the other Phoenix thread into here?) And delete threads? (Imagine you can..) Just curious.

[HeroComplex]

Originally posted by Tsannik
Where does HeroComplex come up with all these super-cool phrases to put in his subject line?!? I take a deep breath. And then I take a paper bag and hyperventilate. And then I take an advil. And then I steal something from the bible. Formula works like a charm.Just curious, are you able to move posts?Yes. And if another thread starts up after this one has, I usually merge the two together to save space and unclutter the forum. However, the posts integrate themselves by the original timing. If I merged this with some of the other Phoenix threads that began before I had a chance to get in front of the computer, then those posts will be first and in general things just are a bit too complicated to figure out. For the Spider-Man preview, a substantial thread had begun by the time I showed up, so I just elevated that one to the top of the forum and made it the main thread, changing the title but otherwise letting it run wild. But I like having them all centralized, and I know how people love to see the catchphrases. ;)

[bizzirini]

Expect Phoenix to be hording those heavy objects! Phoenix+Outdoor pack Dumpster=OUCH!! Someone said you can't use flight and TK, why not?

[mwindu965]

She seems like a glorified taxi, and I think that if Storm is pretty cheap, her uses will be limited. The X-Men could still use her to some effectiveness, and she is a more versatile Jean Grey, however, Ive always liked Support on Jean and this one doesnt seem to have it.


MWindu965
Say "What" Again...

[Tsannik]

Okay somehow I knew this would come up.... I want to preemptively strike...

Expect Phoenix to be hording those heavy objects! Phoenix+Outdoor pack Dumpster=OUCH!! Someone said you can't use flight and TK, why not?

Please remember that when doing a Telekinetic attack with objects, the maximum Range is 10, regardless of light or heavy.

She will be able to make a regular attack at 12 Range and 2 Damage, but when using objects, she will be at 10 Range and 2 for light, 3 for heavy.

Does this make sense?

[bizzirini]

My bad. Thanks for the clarification. I still think she'll be a welcome addition to the X-men team. I play mostly theme teams, and have been waiting for more of the flying X-men.

[HotSauce]

It seems to me that pheonix is replacing E magneto. They are pretty similar stat wise. I love magneto's sculp so much, I don't know if I can make the switch.

Marc

[Joe Kerr]

She'll find her way to a lot of my teams.

[ohoni]

Well, this is more or less how Jean should ALWAYS have been, at least her E/V versions. How they took pretty much the strongest overall X-Man and gave her that original pathetic waste of a figure I have no idea.

Now, if only we can get a CURRENT Jean, perhaps in her New costume, and wielding her FULL set of powers, including things like Mind Control, Psychic Blast, TK, Shape Change (to emulate her ability to cloud minds), Super Senses, Flight, and pretty much the same stats as the current Phoenix.

Jean SHOULD be a 150+ point powerhouse, not their current weaklings.

[Noman]

Yes, obviously.

But this model does represent the early Byrne period Pheonix pretty well.

Hooray !


I think the combo of flying and TK will be realy usefull.

Now, where's Rachel ?

LoL

All the Best

Noman

[hoffmandu]

Jean grey is lame.........she's rehashed Prof X. Although, I do have to admit 12 range is gonna chnge things up a bit.

[AshenFang]

Originally posted by bizzirini
Expect Phoenix to be hording those heavy objects! Phoenix+Outdoor pack Dumpster=OUCH!! Someone said you can't use flight and TK, why not?

I said that, and why not? Because a single figure can only take a single action in a single turn. I.E. You can Fly, or you can TK, but not both.

Don't get me wrong, having the choice is nice, but depending on her speed, I don't see having them both being points effective.

I personally prefer TK, leaves the support unit out of harms way. Even if it leaves the Attacker in the field alone. Unless youhave an Avender/Brotherhood flier, then free taxi is always loved! :D

[LuckyJ]

The Phoenix preview specifically says that she can throw objects for her full range of 12. There is not a limited range on attacking (10 squares by default, but range value if it's greater). Just like MC's minimum range of 4, TK has a minimum range of 10. But there are plenty of MC figs to use a higher range than 4.

Now there is one for TK

You can still only "taxi" for 10 spaces and can only throw an opponent 10 spaces.

If you disagree with me, then reread John's preview.

[Draggor]

Originally posted by LuckyJ
The Phoenix preview specifically says that she can throw objects for her full range of 12. There is not a limited range on attacking (10 squares by default, but range value if it's greater). Just like MC's minimum range of 4, TK has a minimum range of 10. But there are plenty of MC figs to use a higher range than 4.

Now there is one for TK

You can still only "taxi" for 10 spaces and can only throw an opponent 10 spaces.

If you disagree with me, then reread John's preview.


Quote from rule book page 21
"Attacking with an object: to use an object as a weapon, give the character a ranged combat action, even if the characters range is 0. the character can then fire the object at an opposing character up to 10 squares away or at an opposing soaring character 5 squares away."
Sounds like maximum of 10 range to me. It means it's pointless using light objects with Phoenix. Nice figure though. I'll be using her. Taxi Cyclops up and then both open fire. I'll probably miss support though. That's what I mainly use the current Jean for. Now all we need is a current continuity Phoenix. Picture a Moondragon with better abilities.

[PFloyd]

What does anybody think this whole, force shield ability is going to be, I mean, they said it would be used for a defensive power, but is it going to be like defend or something different. I know that it's not a new power but I'm wondering what they're going to make the ability, or if there will be any new abilities?

[HeroComplex]

I'm not sure quite what you mean, but Jon L said that Jean Grey's force field (uncapitalized) is represented by a high defense and a few clicks of Toughness.

[jhcrouch]

Here is a little idea. I know that there will be a few people out there that think that this idea will completely ridiculous, and furthermore will want hc realms to kick me out on the street and tar and feather me like we used to do to the British (no offense my fellow clicksters across the pond). Anyway, what if Wizkids took Dark Phoenix and made her into a big fig the same way they made a fig out of Senestro. Now hear me out, how sweet would it be to have Dark Phoenix in all her glory and evil power suspended in the middle of a huge translucent orange and red phoenix. I don't know, it just thought like an interesting idea, and Wizkid could do a really powerful and, dare I say, awe inspiring fig that could capture the raw fury of one of Marvel's all time most devistating villians

[Rogueslaw]

Would rather them have a inquest send away and have her repainted and if they aren't to lazy have flames around the base of her and kind of outlining her

[Invisible_Jon]

Originally posted by LuckyJ
The Phoenix preview specifically says that she can throw objects for her full range of 12. There is not a limited range on attacking (10 squares by default, but range value if it's greater). Just like MC's minimum range of 4, TK has a minimum range of 10. But there are plenty of MC figs to use a higher range than 4.

Now there is one for TK

You can still only "taxi" for 10 spaces and can only throw an opponent 10 spaces.

If you disagree with me, then reread John's preview.

And John's description teaser says:

...and she can actually use her telekinetic abilities to do damage at a range of 12 – no this isn’t something new to the Telekinesis power; she just has a range value, so she can do damage at range. She still has Telekinesis, which allows her to toss her teammates and any enemies that might get to close up to 10 squares away.

John's description says outright that the 12 range isn't something new to the TK power. He then says that it means that she has a range value (unlike previous incarnations), allowing her to inflict her damage score on people at range.

I beleieve what John is saying is that the "special effect" of her 12 range, damage 2 attack is telekinesis (Note the little "t" in his write up, contrasted with the big "T" used later when he refers to Telekinesis directly.).

Phoenix lets you zap someone at a range of 12 for 2, >or< whack someone with an object at a range of 10 with Telekinesis. The "special effect" for both of these is that she's using her telekinetic abilities.

Best Regards,

[Jean_genie]

My eyes just about bugged out when I saw that she had a 12 range. I'm surprised that nobody else saw that as quite as important. If she really does have a 12 range, that'd mean that Phoenix has a longer range than anyone else in the game. Wow.

Between the shake-up that will insue with the 12 range, and the obscene 160-point cost of the new Elektra, I wonder if WizKids isn't just trying to cause a stir. I certainly hope that's not the case.

[Aron]

Er

12 range? and 3 damage with beast.. 4 with psylocke

Or 13 range, 3 damage

Shakeup? I think they're planning an... *get ready for it* XPlooooossiioooonnn :P

[Jean_genie]

Ouch.

[FueledByRaimen]

Are we looking at characters that are becoming obsolete? Mravel clix have a great balance, but what if Pheonix range is just a little too much? I don't know what they are thinking, but it looks like stronger, adn better is the idea for the new set, and in that case I may have to retire my jugger Magneto combo, and that would not be a good thing. Maybe a little discreation is needed, and then again, this set will probably be awesome. All I want is for omega red to come out.....Hammer and sickle all the way, comrad.

[Noman]

12 range is Nasty, certainly, but as Range can be perplexed, we have already seen ranges bumped up beyond 10. It's good, but it's not "inevitable victory".

LoL

All the Best

Noman

[feralparrot]

Someone wrote "...they (X-Men) still need someone a little cheaper for a taxi. "

Well... if they make an "Angel" figure... he'd probably be good for a Taxi...

I don't remember him being worth much more than flying...

Correct me if I'm wrong...

<flame on, everyone>

FeralParrot

[Rogueslaw]

Your right about ange for the mos part. Though he could get CCe but, that may be streching it a bit, also he couldhave leadership. All in all once he comes out he should have great movement for a cheap cost.
Though if they decied to do archangel now he could be brutal. I wouldn't be supised if he has eiter toughness or invulerability. Algong with a range attack and most like CCE since he was Death. I figurewe will see archangel before we see angel since the 4 horsemen's leader may becomingut soon.
Side note I'm so glad once mega con comes out and they sell xplosion there that we will finally beable to talk abot the newset since people will have figs in hand.