H-SHW Comic Book TOC: GREEN LANTERN (Hal Jordan) vs. BLACK ADAM

[DTM]

Hi all.

Its been a while since Ive done a comics related TOC, so I thought Id make use of the Power Scale Lists that we ALL had a hand in making, and set something up for us all to debate and participate in.

Pretty simple idea, 2 combatants engage one another on a completely neutral, planet-side, battlefield (ala Battleworld from Secret Wars) to Clash against one another, each winner (decided by your votes) moving on to the next Round, which finally a Grand Champion is crowned.

I give you this next of many matches to come:


GREEN LANTERN (Hal Jordan) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hal_Jordan)

vs.

BLACK ADAM (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Adam)


So, lets hear from you all on which of these two you think would win, and is deserving to move one step closer to our Final Match of the H-SHW Level TOC!!


Results


ROUND 1

Sinestro vs. Thor: Thor (10 - 1)
Beta Ray Bill vs. Wonder Woman: Beta Ray Bill (7 - 2)
Kurse (2X Thor) vs. Legion: Legion (5 - 4)
Allen The Alien (Original Form) vs. Eradicator: Eradicator (6 - 1)
Black Adam vs. Green Lantern (Alan Scott): Black Adam (10 - 0)
Captain Marvel (Billy Batson) vs. Green Lantern (Kyle Rayner): Captain Marvel (Billy Batson) (8 - 7)
Gladiator vs. Morg: Morg (4 - 1)
Drax (Power Gem) vs. Orion: Drax (Power Gem) (4 - 2)
Hulk (World War Hulk) vs. Quasar: Hulk (World War Hulk) (6 - 3)
Sentry vs. Zoom: Sentry (8 - 3)
Mon'el vs. Mongul: Mongul (4 - 3)
Mr. Majestic vs. Captain Marvel (Freddy Freeman): Mr. Majestic (5 - 1)
Circe vs. Green Lantern (Hal Jordan): Green Lantern (Hal Jordan)(5 - 5) - Winner Randomly Chosen
Adam Warlock (Post Annihilation) vs. Obsidian: Adam Warlock (Post Annihilation) (6 - 0)
Maelstrom vs. Superman: Maelstrom (7 - 4)
Silver Surfer (Pre Annihilation) vs. Theo Diggers: Silver Surfer (Pre Annihilation) (6 - 1)
Count Nefaria (Ionic Form) vs. Manchester Black: Count Nefaria (Ionic Form) (4 - 2)
Bizarro vs. Magog: Bizarro (6 - 3)
Miracleman vs. Ultraman: Ultraman (3 - 1)
Dr. Strange vs. Lobo: Lobo (7 - 2)
Cable (Full Power) vs. Wildfire: Cable (Full Power) (6 - 1)
Ravenous vs. Sabbac: Ravenous (4 - 3)
Jenny Quantum vs. Vulcan: Jenny Quantum (6 - 0)
Ares (Marvel) vs. Omni-Man: Omni-Man (6 - 0)
Abra Kadabra vs. Nova (Richard Rider): Abra Kadabra (5 - 4)
Loki vs. Nightmare: Loki (6 - 1)
Apocalypse vs. Starhawk: Apocalypse (7 - 2)
Deathurge vs. Hyperion (Supreme Power): Hyperion (Supreme Power) (6 - 1)
Hercules vs. Nero: Nero (7 - 0)
The Doctor (Jeroen Thornedike) vs. Waverider: Waverider (4 - 1)
General Zod (Russian) vs. Karnilla: General Zod (Russian) (4 - 3)
Martian Manhunter vs. Professor X (Ultimates): Martian Manhunter (7 - 0)

ROUND 2

Thor vs. Beta Ray Bill: Thor leads (7 - 3)
Hulk (World War Hulk) vs. Mr. Majestic: Hulk (World War Hulk) (6 - 6) - Winner Randomly Chosen
Silver Surfer (Pre Annihilation) vs. Bizarro: Silver Surfer (Pre Annihilation) (7 - 6)
Abra Kadabra vs. Apocalypse: Apocalypse (8 - 0)
Green Lantern (Hal Jordan) vs. Ravenous (Annihilation): Green Lantern (Hal Jordan) (3 - 2)
Adam Warlock (Post Annihilation) vs. Martian Manhunter: Martian Manhunter (5 - 2)
Eradicator vs. Hyperion (Supreme Power): Hyperion (Supreme Power) (4 - 1)
Black Adam vs. Loki: Black Adam (6 - 0)
Morg vs. Lobo: Morg (4 - 0)
Drax (Power Gem) vs. Count Nefaria: Count Nefaria (4 - 1)
Captain Marvel (Billy Batson) vs. Cable (Full Power): Cable (Full Power) (4 - 4) - Winner Randomly Chosen
Maelstrom vs. General Zod: Maelstrom (6 - 0)
Ultraman vs. Omni-Man: Omni-Man (10 - 2)
Sentry vs. Mongul: Sentry (5 - 0)
Legion vs. Nero: Nero (5 - 0)
Jenny Quantum vs. Waverider: Waverider (4 - 4) - Winner Randomly Chosen

ROUND 3

Green Lantern (Hal Jordan) vs. Black Adam: ??????

[Maniac_nmt]

Going to go with Black Adam here. He won't win them all, but he will win a lot. He can smash through GL constructs, and eventually get into Jordan's face where he'll starting beating down.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Pretty much how I see it. He can't beat Hal every time (unless he's got the Death upgrade...which I'm still a little fuzzy on) but he'll beat him more often than not.

Black Adam to advance.

[Jawapimp]

Hal squeaked through the last two rounds. He isn't as lucky this round.

Black Adam to move on

[Q99]

I'll throw a vote to Hal. It's a fairly close fight and he's one of the lanterns who does fight in close sometimes (not as much as Kyle or Kilowog, but it won't take him off guard).

[DTM]

Im going to support Black Adam here. Personally, I think high level uber powered flying bricks (ala Superman, Capt Marvel, etc.) to be a bit higher up the scale than even the best of ring-slingers, and Black Adam counts as the former here. If this were Gladiator or Hyperion or Eradicator, Id probably give Hal the slight nod, but not someone of Black Adam's overall level.

[Cryomancer]

Ill add to the votes, Black Adam for just about all the reasons above.

[Q99]

I put the top-tier lanterns in the same "slightly below Superman" level as Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel, etc..

[DTM]

BLACK ADAM - 5 votes
GREEN LANTERN (Hal Jordan) - 1 vote

[Maniac_nmt]

I put the top-tier lanterns in the same "slightly below Superman" level as Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel, etc..

Mmm...I dunno, I'd put Black Adam and Captain Marvel above Wonder Woman. Alan Scott is on that level as a GL, but is magic and not tech based. Quasar is on that level, but he's more powerful then a regular GL (Hal, John, Guy, Kyle...)

BA and CM really only loose out to Superman on him having more powers. Physically for speed, strength and durability they're all pretty interchangable.

[DTM]

I mostly agree with Maniac, though I feel Superman is a slight (but evident) physical superior to the likes of CM and BA, its their magic bonus that helps bring it back and make it a more even fight. Add in extra powers, greater experience and intelligence, and a stronger will, and Id vote for Kal to beat Billy and co more than not in the end - shame he met such an early demise in this TOC. :p

[Maniac_nmt]

I mostly agree with Maniac, though I feel Superman is a slight (but evident) physical superior to the likes of CM and BA, its their magic bonus that helps bring it back and make it a more even fight. Add in extra powers, greater experience and intelligence, and a stronger will, and Id vote for Kal to beat Billy and co more than not in the end - shame he met such an early demise in this TOC. :p

Well, in theory BA has more experience than Clark. Though it's debatable as to if he actually learns anything from it. He's not the type to sit and analyse his experiences like Clark.

[Q99]

Well, in theory BA has more experience than Clark. Though it's debatable as to if he actually learns anything from it. He's not the type to sit and analyse his experiences like Clark.

Not all that much- he's 4,000 years old, but he was only really active in ancient egypt and the modern day. So we're likely talking maybe a few decades.

Fighting skill wise, he's not bad but does tend to pull around even against Captain Marvel. I think they both rely on the natural fighting talent the SHAZAM package includes mostly.

Mmm...I dunno, I'd put Black Adam and Captain Marvel above Wonder Woman.

I wouldn't. In War of the Gods, she matched CM in strength, and she's stalemated Superman about as often as Billy has, even has some wins while he doesn't (though Clark's still overall the stronger). DC's push

Their power sources are really nigh-identical when you think of it, that is god invested and champions of a pantheon.

When there's only two people who regularly stalemate Superman I think it odd to put them on different levels.

Alan Scott is on that level as a GL, but is magic and not tech based

In practice, the other GLs and Alan tend to operate on pretty much the same level in terms of power and feats.

Power output is the same but he has an edge against things with magic weaknesses, but is similarly disadvantaged against things with magic resistances like Adam. Hal, lacking that disadvantage, is better off.

Id vote for Kal to beat Billy and co more than not in the end

Agreed. He can get a stalemate for awhile but Clark has more versatility so has the overall edge.

Still, barely anyone can regularly do that well.

[DTM]

Not sure Id say WW stalemates Superman personally, most every single time Ive seen them fight Superman clearly has the upper hand, or outright beats her down. Still, it is Superman, so being able to hang with him for a little while is a very impressive feat all on its own (though to me there is a difference between stalemate (aka tie) and hang with him for a bit).

[Gargantua]

I'm going to vote for Black Adam. Not 100% of the time, but enough. If this were Kyle with the Ion power (or I suppose Hal as Parallax) that'd be different, but it isn't.

[Q99]

Not sure Id say WW stalemates Superman personally, most every single time Ive seen them fight Superman clearly has the upper hand, or outright beats her down.

Sacrifice, mixed (if you break it down into the three sub-parts of the fight, loss/win/win-by-sucker-throw). Superman: For Tomorrow, stalemate, he eventually distracts her with civilians in danger. League of One, stalemate, she eventually distracts him with leaguers in danger. Those're the three most recent fights to my knowledge, and something of an exceptional streak for her, but quite impressive.

I fully agree he's stronger and has the upper hand. No one on DC Earth has a favorable ratio against him, at least out of regular heroes. I think she and Captain Marvel are the same tier.


Though it's too bad she didn't actually fight CM or Adam in the tourney... the lasso makes those a bit unfair :) She can and has made them say the wizard's name.

[DTM]

Hmmmmm, I had a whole post set and written to counter your WW "wins" there Q, but I think Ill pull that, and say were going to have to agree to strongly disagree about her stalemating abilities vs. Superman, and agree that BA here will beat on Hal.......what, we cant even do that, you voted for who??? :p

[Q99]

Personally I think people are harsh on WW for some reason (perhaps remembering some of her less well-written runs). In arguments it's hard to get credit for stalemates and wins that heroes like CM'd have no problem getting credit for. She just doesn't get credit for what she does very often, even when she manages it repeatedly and people in-universe often give her the number two hero on the planet slot.


what, we cant even do that, you voted for who???

Yea, Hal and Kyle don't do all that badly against brick types :)

Though oddly they almost never get to fight actual kryptonians, which'd really settle it.

[DTM]

Oh I dont think Hal will do badly here, Im sure hell do quite well, though against such high level Superman-types like BA here, I just think the massive combination of strength, speed, toughness and endurance is too much for any ring-slinger to handle more than not. Personally, Id give Hal maybe a 40% win ratio over BA/CM, which unfortunately for him isnt enough to get him my vote here.