Well considering you guys poked so many holes in my last team, try this one. -_-

[balagonn]

This is the team I'll probably use for an upcoming 450 point tournament--And where I play people don't throw tantrums over teams that are one or two points high.


V Ultron: 188 pts
V Firelord: 97 pts
V Dr. Strange: 87 pts
R Riddler: 34 pts
R Harley Quinn: 27 pts
V S.H.I.E.L.D. Sniper: 18 pts

Total: 451 Points

See, Ultron can use his multi-shot and his energy explosion to affect probably every opposing character on the board. The shield sniper can add to the damage, Harley and Riddler can add to the damage, so Ultron can do 4 clicks to nearly every opposing character with just one action! (Well, 2 if you count the sniper adding to his damage) Plus after Dr. Strange gets hit at all, he gets enhancement which can be used to just add more to Ultron's damage. Plus all 3 of the heavy hitters have very good all around values (11, 13, 14 attack, 17 (19 vs ranged), 18, 18 defense) and they can function well even without the perplexers. If Strange gets hit enough, he becomes a flying medic to heal Ultron and Firelord, and he gains and loses Pulse Wave, Probability Control, Barrier and Telekenisis throughout his dial.

[Zog]

The way I understand it, perplex doesn't add to Engery Explosion Damage. I don't know whether Enhancement does or not. If I were you, I'd definately find room for a medic on the team, other wise Firelord won''t last past the first few rounds. Ultron and the Shield Sniper are a great combo though.

[Mr. Pilkington]

Perplex will not add to an EE attack's damage. The Perplex power changes the figure's dial number, but EE reduces said number to 1. So SHIELD and Enhancement will increase an EE attack, but not Perplex.

I have no other comments as the point total is over the mentioned limit and the limit isn't even a valid one by the rules (build limits are set to even hundreds for action calculations). Note: this is not a "tantrum" per se, I am just not going to comment further since the unothodox setup is so far removed from what I use (i.e. the normal rules).

[balagonn]

Why do I need a medic? The perplexers can add to FL's defense, making him near impossible to hit, and if he does get hit badly enough I can get Strange into the thick of things 'till he gains support, heal FL to full, and back into the fight he goes! I tested this team against a Sinestro, Moondragon, and Key, and the battle was over in 10 mins. Ultron used multi shot and energy explosion, doing 8 clicks to Moondragon (KO) 8 clicks to Key (KO) and (cause of his superpowers) 8 clicks to Sinestro.:D I can't wait to test this team out against my friend's Perplexer/Super Skrull/Flash combo!:D

[balagonn]

*Rolls eyes* Okay then, swap out both perplexers for 3 or 4 V snipers. Even better! :p

[Random]

you can NOT add to FL defense with perplex. Perplex is not like outwit or barrier. It ends when your turn ends. not at the beggining of your next turn. ( poke poke poke poke)

[JacinB]

As two other people already pointed out, your Energy Explosion damage won't work as you'd like it to. Perplex doesn't effect it.

And, secondly, you're cheating.

A 450pt. build total is put into place for a reason. It's not a 450pts. or so build total. It's 450pts. Period. It means that you can build an army that is up to 450pts. worth of characters. You've exceeded that.

That's not throwing a tantrum. That's pointing out a fact.

Just because the people in your area don't complain (and I would bet that they would if they knew that you were playing an army that was over the point total), that doesn't mean that you aren't flagrantly violating the rules of the tournament.

Especially when you could take an Experienced SHIELD Sniper rather than the Veteran and come in under the build total and have the same effect.

If you were playing in one of my tournaments, knowingly disobeying the rules, I'd still take your $5.00 entry fee and let you play. But, I'd announce at the end of the tournament that you have been disqualified for cheating and award any prizes you might have otherwise won to the person who placed behind you.

[Noman]

Qoute from Random

"you can NOT add to FL defense with perplex. Perplex is not like outwit or barrier. It ends when your turn ends. not at the beggining of your next turn. ( poke poke poke poke) "

You can, however, Perplex to LOWER his defence during your turn, to make him easier to heal. Use a medic.

Firelord in all his forms is notoriously vulnarable to the Outwit/RCE Panther/Sheild Sniper (or other Outwit/RCE combos).
Enchantress is also a good piece for your opponent to play against him...

All in all, it's not a bad team, although I'd use Eddie Nashton LE rather than Riddler, juggling your points a bit if you have to...and again, I would take Plastic Man over Harley, but that's just me...

All the Best

Noman

[Legacy]

ok your team dosent work for one thing the tournament is messed!! in the rule book it states that you may only go in interviles of 100 so you cant have a 450 game and someone allready seid this but Perplex is only for YOUR TURN so it dosnet make def. better!!

[Mr. Pilkington]

Once again for the record: you cannot gain benefit to a Support roll using Perplex. Support states that it is an unmodified attack rool and perplex currently counts as a modifier. So while you *could* Perplex FL's defense down the attack roll for Support would still ba applied to his original defense value. All you will have done is waste a use of Perplex.

[Noman]

Ummm....but your not Perplexing the attack role, so the attack role isn't modified.

It's the defence that's modified, and you can do that.

Qoute from HeroComplex (Moderator) when we were discussing whether Perplex worked on the 'bolt symbols, to give an extra bolt (I't Doesn't)

"The five Perplexable combat values are speed, attack, defense, damage and range. Lightning bolts cannot be Perplexed as they are the symbol for a combat value, but are not themselves a combat value. "

So Defence can be, and that's what the Perplex is effecting.


All the Best

Noman

[Mr. Pilkington]

What I am trying to convey, logical or not, is that WizKids has ruled that Perplex cannot effect a Support roll. They have flip-flopped on this in the past, but the current ruling is that you cannot. Like I said, it isn't a question of logic. It is simply a matter of what they have ruled.

The definition of perplex that you quoted does nothing to support your arguement. It says that you can perplex the numbers. In my first post on this particular topic I *said* that you *could* use your perplex on the Defense value, but it would not count for the Support roll itself. The Support power cancels it. Support says: ignore all modifiers to the close combat attack. WizKids has stated that Perplex is a modifier. Thus Support cancels it. End of story.

I'm not saying that I agree with it, but there are a number of issues in the game where the rules and logic are at odds.

[Noman]

....but Perplex is NOT a modifier to the attack role ! It's the same attack number, and the same dice role, just a different defence number - it was NOT the attack statistic or the dice role which was modified !


(groan)

With huge respect, I would follow your ruling if you were the Judge of a tournament I was playing in, but as it does not seem to follow either the rulebook or any kind of "game logic", I think I personaly would still allow it.

The FAQ is a different matter. Of the players I know over here, most havn't read it, nor would they know where to look. However, lots of us read HCRealms and quite a few post.

In any event, as you said, this is the kind of "ruling" that WK reverse / alter / change from time to time - which will hopefully happen here.

The "can't Perplex 'bolts" reasoning was logical.
The idea that Perplexing the defence of a friendly figure counts as a modifier to a dice role made by a second friendly figure isn't.
It sounds like a way of ensuring, given that the number of Perplexers will rise substantialy soon, that Healers don't dominate the Battlefield.

...of course, the new rulebook, (with Indy) will address all these issues, and the FAQ can be finaly thrown away, allowing us all to play using the rules...(gosh, what a novel concept...)

LoL

All the Best

Noman

[Mr. Pilkington]

I agree that the rules need an overhaul.
They want to keep things simple, but the very nature of the game includes lots of ambiguity that would be almost impossible to catch all of in play-testing (or else the game would never get out of Q&A). A rules rewrite could go a long way to fixing a lot of confusion. And they need a firm statement in print about this perplex/support issue. I was very disappointed to not find one in the new FAQ.

They also need a disclaimer that says "Please note: some of these rules are in place for purposes of game balance only and do not necessarily make logical sense.". Like soaring figures not shooting back at the ground figures that just shot them. Doesn't make logical sense, but it does make game balance sense.

[malchyor]

dude? um...the guy who started this thread?

sorry that no body was nice to you. but in their own ways, most of them are right.

s#### the team and start over. or play it, beat the pants off of the other folks who show up at your tourney and then prove us all wrong.

[Noman]

Qoute from Mr.Pilkington (Judge) re Perplexing Defence down so that a second character can heal the target easier not being allowed, apparantly :-

"They also need a disclaimer that says "Please note: some of these rules are in place for purposes of game balance only and do not necessarily make logical sense.". Like soaring figures not shooting back at the ground figures that just shot them. Doesn't make logical sense, but it does make game balance sense."

I thought it had to be something like that !

Now, back to discussing the guy's team...

LoL

All the Best

Noman