How does poisen work?

[Dr.Notsoevil]

Does toughness and invulneabity and super senses work against it.

Just how does this power work?

[Tsannik]

Poison is not considered an attack.
Poison will deliver 1 click of damage at the beginning of your turn to all adjacent opposing figures.

Invulnerability and Toughness are immune to poison. There is no way to affect a figure with Invulnerability and Toughness.

However, Poison will ignore Impervious and Super Senses. Poison is not considered an attack. Since it does not target a spcific figure, Impervious will not activate. Since it is not considered an attack, Super Senses will not activate.

Does this make sense?

[shin-goji]

Drink some and find out ;)

[Funky Jett]

Originally posted by shin-goji
Drink some and find out ;)

You are on a tear today! :)

[shin-goji]

Thank you thank you :) Hey, I'm up past a 4.0 on my posting level, that's twice the legal limit.

[quixotequest]

Tsannik:

I know you're right, but do you know why Invul and Toughness are immune to Poison? Impervious is an expensive defense power just like Invulnerable, whose achilles heel is a lower numerical value anyway. Why the other two defense powers aren't affected also by Poison just doesn't follow. They cost less anyway. It seems in any logical sense a "tough" figure should still be able to be poisoned. Someone who is "invulnerable" or "impervious" shouldn't be able to be poisoned. And for game balance purposes, in my mind Impervious figures should have the least likelihood of being affected by poison--kryptonite notwithstanding. :D

[Funky Jett]

POISON. This character has a poison or toxin that damages his target. (Optional) At the beginning of your turn, this character delivers 1 click of damage to each opposing character in an adjacent square.

IMPERVIOUS. This character reduces damage delivered to him. (Optional) When this character is the target of a successful attack (either close or ranged combat) roll 1 six-sided dice. On a result of 5 or 6, the attack misses completely and the character takes no damage. On a result of 1 to 4, the attack hits, but reduce the damage by 2.

Poison is not an "attack", so it doesn't trigger the Impervious roll.

[Tsannik]

Funky pretty much beatme to the punch here.

Since Poison is not considered an attack, Impervious will not activate unlessthis character is the target of a successful attack

This is pretty much the same for Super Senses, whose power activates if this character is successfully hit by a ranged or close combat attack


The PAC descriptions for Invulnerability and Toughness stipulate:

Subtract from any damage inflicted on this character by ranged or close combat attacks, or super powers that deliver damage.

This is why Invulnerability and Toughness work, but Impervious and Super Senses do not.

[Mego13]

It does say the inital ability of imperviousness reduces damage.
Only the "Super Sense" part of imperviousness necessitates an attack.
So by that logic couldn't the iperviousness still elliminate the damage?

[Tsannik]

By logic...

The Impervious figure must first be the TARGET of an attack.

Poison does not TARGET anyone. It just happens to all opposing adjacent figures (I.E. no Line of Fire is drawn).

So, Impervious would never activate to either dodge all damage or reduce 2 damage.

More clear?

[quixotequest]

Funky-- I don't know if you posted that as a response to me but I'm keely aware of what the rules state. Having composed a PAC that attempts to combine all the convoluted and sometimes-mutually-contradictory FAQ rulings in one place in the fewest words possible, I've read over the FAQ more times than most people I know.

My point is that WK's whacked-out FAQ is a victim of it's own rules lawyering. The Poison ability clearly states in it's wording that its victim is its target. Invulnerability and Toughness reduce damage delivered in an "attack" hence they are deemed immune to Poison. How would they be immune if they weren't a target??. Yet, Yet, WK rules in the case of Impervious that Poison is not an "attack" since no dice are rolled. How can an Impervious figure be a victim if it isn't a target?? And if it is a target Impervious is supposed to prevent damage. This is a reasonable reading of their language!

Something "Impervious" should more likely be immune to Poison than something "Tough." My opinion is that a clarification should logically follow--even though many FAQ rulings don't often logically follow. Since Impervious is so expensive anyway, and has low defense numbers as a result, why single it out, when Invulnerability and Toughness are not? I feel like Impervious should prevent Poison damage if Invulnerability does so also, based on a fair reading of their langauge.

So this really is a beef with how screwed up and ineffective WK is in writing clear rules. I know they are free to have the Poison rules be what they are, no matter how poorly they articulate the langauge. The language used to convey those rules should be as clear and reasonable as possible. Yet, in the case of Poison in one instance they consider it an attack but in another it is not an attack. Is there something I am missing?

[Tsannik]

Missing.....hmmm

Well, this was brought up in the WK Judges forum. hey agreed that the written PAC wasn't very clear. Chapeau then clarified the entry by stating that Poison is not considered an attack.

[Funky Jett]

Originally posted by quixotequest
Funky-- I don't know if you posted that as a response to me but I'm keely aware of what the rules state...

1) I posted it as an answer to your question
2) There was no need to be rude, Tsannik would have posted the same thing as I did, I just saw it first
3) There are other people here that read these posts, so I was posting the PAC descriptions to show them as well

There was no need to be rude in your post. I guess from now on when I see that you have a question, I will not try to help you because you aready know the answer since you're "keely aware of what the rules state" and you've "read over the FAQ more times than most people I know." I was just trying to help, q

FJ

[quixotequest]

FJ--I am sorry I wrote that rudely. I didn't intend to be rude but I allowed my frustration with the way WK reasons FAQ judgements to show through in my language to you.

You know, if WK just said "Poison is prevented by Toughness, Invulnerability but not Impervious or Super Senses" it would be more clear. It might not make sense, but it is clear. The problem is they have the explanation contingent on language that isn't unilaterally reasonable, clear nor consistently used. They define english language that has application contrary to reason. Poison can damage a figure but it's not an attack. (Then what is it?) A figure can be attacked but it's not a target. (Then how could it be damaged if not a target?) Poison damages it's target which really isn't a "target." It's the same convoluted reason as is applied with Energy Explosion splash damage.

It would have been easier if "Impervious" had been defined as "Semi- Permeable." :D

[Funky Jett]

I'm cool with that. :D

[Dr.Notsoevil]

......um........Thankyou.