Why I dont want to see Indy Clix! [Archive]

Noman

02/28/2003, 17:37

Depends which country you're in. Now, personaly, I prefere Marvel to DC in general (with some notable exceptions), and like some Indy titles, although I tend to be retro in my preferences.

However, the comic that Judge Dredd and Johnny Alpha are from, (2000 AD) has HUGE sales and popularity over here. So, for "a certain generation" do the Turtles.

I'm not to bothered personaly, although I will get them all, of course, but they will outsell both the DC and Marvel Clix in the UK with NO difficulty. There is also a large Manga type following over here (using the broadest meaning of the term), so while people will not recognise "Shi" et al, they will get the concept.

Hellboy and Spawn will probably have less of a fan following, but they will sell to those who like them. Comic book purists will buy Arwen and anything CrossGen-like.

Gamers will want them all in any case, as they expand the game system.

So role on Indy Clix...and please give me THUNDERAgents, Alien Legion, Futurians, and even Black Belt Geriatric Hamsters !

(...what do you mean, they're not Indy ???)

Game On.

LoL

All the Best

Noman

Noman

02/28/2003, 17:44

Oh, and you meant Amalgam.

"We have just one world, but we live in different ones..."
Dire Straits.

LoL

All the Best

Noman

Doc Martin

02/28/2003, 17:51

So role on Indy Clix...and please give me THUNDERAgents, Alien Legion, Futurians, and even Black Belt Geriatric Hamsters !

Man, THUNDER Agents and Alien Legion would be cooool!

Good work bringing those up!

:)

Martin..............................

ten2driver

02/28/2003, 18:00

...<yawn>...okay...don't buy any...:rolleyes:

Joe Kerr

02/28/2003, 18:01

I don't want to see Indy clix because of the unbalance they may cause. There might be a new team ability out there in Indy clix someone will try to exploit with a MOD or other wildcard figure. I really don't plan on buying Indy clix. I might get some singles if I see something that interest me but as far as buying boosters, I highly doubt it.

I don't want to see them get put into mixed games and mixed tournaments. I don't want to learn anything about these characters, but I will be forced to if they are allowed in tournaments. With tons of Marvel and DC it just isn't fair for someone who likes these two products to be forced to get the new one just to keep up with everyone else.

Who knows? These figures might not be all that great and maybe most venues won't even allow them. But it's that what if that bugs me.

Transprime

02/28/2003, 18:07

thanks Noman that's what i was thinking about. Clix for that might be pretty nice. Hey you can stipulate rules before you play now then if you don't like INDY. like all INDY or DC or marvel or whatever you want.

TheDarkKnight

02/28/2003, 18:09

Joe Kerr you took the words right out of my mouth

freakazoid_x

02/28/2003, 18:14

You do know there have been 2 or 3 Batman/Judge Dredd crossovers. I wasn't going to get Indy either... just buy a few of the select singles. However when I heard the Ninja Turtles were going to be in it I decided I'd buy boosters and stuff too.

Imagine some of the boss Uniques from the Turtles series'

Robo Donatello from the Image series

Super Shredder (AKA Kevin Nash)

Rapheal Shredder from the image series (His short lived run as head of the foot clan)

I loved Ninja Turtles and part of me still does. I'd buy a whole set of the Ninja turtles even if it were based on the campy sell-out cartoon. Which I also loved. I haven't decided if I like the new cartoon yet. I've only seen one episode of it. I thought it was very faithful to the REAL comic book.

I just wish the new turtles didn't say Cowabunga every 3 steps... it's 2003 they can come up with something new. Like ohhh I dunno, stuff I say. "sweet", "Niiiiice", "Tight", etc. I think that would add a whole new flavor to the cartoon. However I can't wait to see them as clix.

SciFiGuy

02/28/2003, 18:20

As it stands, you can't mix DC with Marvel in a Sanctioned tournament. If a Judge decides to have a non-sanctioned tounrament, then he may allow mixed, house rules, restrictions or any number of things. The point being: IndyClix will more than likely not be allowed in a DC or Marvel HC tournament.

I also don't see a high probability of non-sanctioned tournaments that would allow mixed play. The main reasons being; sanctioning means prize-support, sanctioning means the Judge earns redemption points. The main reasons a Judge runs a non-sanctioned tournament is just for fun. Oh, it will happen, but not as often and without prizes.

Just throwin' in my two bits (which have depreciated to 1.37 bits by the time I finished typing...).

TheLion

02/28/2003, 18:25

Originally posted by Joe Kerr
I don't want to see Indy clix because of the unbalance they may cause. There might be a new team ability out there in Indy clix someone will try to exploit with a MOD or other wildcard figure. I really don't plan on buying Indy clix. 0

Ok.. now we know where this is coming from. Joe Kerr and TheDarkKnight are wildcard weeines. "Don't cross universes because I can't handle the tactics Involved."

Which they will usually post that they can handle any tactics they just don't like it. :rolleyes:

Wildcard weenies are 2 steps below Firelord weenies and one step below Taxi weenies.

TheLion

02/28/2003, 18:26

I want a Judge Dredd and Groo, and hopefully we'll see a Grimjack. :cool:

SciFiGuy

02/28/2003, 18:31

Oh, absolutely!!

Personally, I want Grendel as well.

I can't wait 'til IndyClix, the more the merrier...

TheLion

02/28/2003, 18:34

... and JonL has alredy said thet therre will be new team and team abilities.

So...run TheDarkKnight and Joe Kerr, run.

Wildcard Weenies :rolleyes:

Joe Kerr

02/28/2003, 18:40

Wildcare weenie? Just a step below Firelord? Are you talking about the teams you copy from the internet and feel so cool when you walk into a place to play a tournament thinking, "Everyone will worship me?"

Could you do me a favor and point out where I had a problem with mixing Marvel and DC?

I personally do it in almost every game.

Second you can bring your Firelord and ANY combination of wildcards and I will beat it. I put my teams together and have a stratedgy around it. I am have won every tournament I have played in and that includes many battles with wildcard teams. And I'm not bragging about winning tournaments, I could careless about that as you will never see me mention that anywhere else on this board in the past or the future.

The whole point, the whole point being over your head, I'm a fan of Marvel and DC so why should I have to worry about Indy Clix? Now if you can process this one try and understand from a point of someone who buys cases of Marvel and DC and would rather by beer then put out a few bucks for Indy Clix that he has no interest in.

There will be figures in the set that will be able to hold their own with Marvel and DC and there maybe a new team ability that cheese armies (I'm guessing yourself) will love. You see my complaint isn't because I can't win or I fear cheese it's that I don't need to waste my money on Indy Clix to keep up with the cheese.

And another thing, after DC came out, I've played in a few different venues and all of them have had prize support and allowed mixed teams. So bottomline no matter what the rules say, judges are saying, "It's cool to mix the brands for the tournament" meaning you have to know both sets or you are out of luck. It comes down to money. Everyone wants to make it. If a store sells Marvel, DC, and Indy Clix then they are going to want to sell as much as possible. Therefore they are going to say, "Yes bring all Heroclix brands you want to the tournament" in order to sell the boosters and singles to the players who come out.

Back to my point, with this attitude, it's unfair for someone to have to buy Indy Clix just to keep up. So keep your flames to yourself kid.

dernjg

02/28/2003, 18:43

First, the Judge Dredd comic is NOT based off the Sly Stallone movie, it's the other way around. 2000 AD was around long before that movie mucked around with a nice universe.

Second, Amalgam comics (combining Batman and wolverine to get Darkclaw) is nowhere near indy. Amalgam is a joint opperation of DC and Marvel. While the two companies are starting to develope more and more friendly business relations (see JLA/Avengers), don't bet on their fairly different marketing strategies for Heroclix to mesh anytime soon.

And on the Indys, bring on the TMNT. But you'd better have Sam from Sigil boasting at least 170 points.
I also need to see a nice set of Exeter, Ashley and the rest of the Scion crew (even Skink) before I'm happy.

bullseye100

02/28/2003, 18:46

I can't wait baby!!!! Those Indy Clix are a comin'!!!
YEEEEEHAAAAAAA!!!!

TheDarkKnight

02/28/2003, 18:50

Cheese is the man. If you can take him down please do. If you cant prepare to be toated.

IceHot

02/28/2003, 19:04

I think that the Indy Clix could seriously dilute the Marvel Clix universe as does the DC to an extent. Remember that the sets have been designed and tested independently of each other.

Clix is a GAME. A game of minatures essentially. As follows, it attempts to illustrate the characters and how they would play out if your were the leader. To complete the illusion things must be in balance. If robin beats the #### out of the Incredible Hulk the illusion is shattered.

And this is the risk of cross-overs. Certainly, no-one wants to be forced into accepting something they are axiomatically opposed to (e. g. Judge Trade beating up Thor - not gonna happen on any planet I have ever dreamed of).

Nonetheless, I think the turtles are cool. There may be some other cool Indy Guys I will learn about as well.

Just two more cents, some things are just stupid, and if you don't have the moral fortitude to make the right call then you will be the first one I smash. Batman Ally on Ultron or Dr. Doom makes zipo sense. Maybe true in game mechanics, but the game could survive without that crossover. Personallly I try to avoid MOD and Spidey crossovers. Why do we have these 2 separate teams. To me it suggests that there are Good Guy teams and Bad guy teams.

Some other retarded ideas reserved for the unimaginiative:
1) multiple copies of the same guy - What universe is that?
2) Vulture+Spiderman
3) Anni+Blaastar (they hate each other)
4) Range Combat at base-to-base for hovering characters

I know Wasp (taxi) carrying Hulk makes no sense, but the concept of flyers carrying Close Combat guys is neccesary for a fun game with tactical complexity. I'm willing to make this sacrifice for playability, but the other goofy retarded ideas could be left for playing at home since they don't enhance playability.

If you don't understand the tactical importance of taxis try this fight. Mr. Hyde vs. Hercules or Jugs vs. Spiral. I believe the correct tactical decision to be pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-etc.

P. S. could someone please explain to me how Sandman got the spidey team ability.

:cool:

algrim

02/28/2003, 19:07

>>>>>>>>>>>
freakazoid_x said:

You do know there have been 2 or 3 Batman/Judge Dredd crossovers. I wasn't going to get Indy either... just buy a few of the select singles. However when I heard the Ninja Turtles were going to be in it I decided I'd buy boosters and stuff too.

<<<<<<<<<<<

Thank you, I was going to point that out (Dredd and Bats)... Anyways, where did you hear the TMNT being confirmed? I'd love it if they were, but I hadn't heard anything yet... just curious about your source...

And I MUST have Grendel...

That's all... go back to your lives now.

algrim

02/28/2003, 19:12

>>>>>>>>>>
IceHot said:

I think that the Indy Clix could seriously dilute the Marvel Clix universe as does the DC to an extent. Remember that the sets have been designed and tested independently of each other.

<<<<<<<<<<

I wouldn't tout that as fact... I have it on very good source that while DC and Marvel were meant to hve a different "feel" from each other, they were most definately designed and playtested together.

Bluebeard

02/28/2003, 19:34

Now I really don't enjoy mainstream comics that much. In fact I only read one. The Flash. Now even though I don't enjoy the comics I still have a great time playing Heroclix! Even though I read a DC comic book I started out buying all the Marvel Heroclix because I happened to be more familiar with their characters. After people with DC teams started showing me some interesting combinations I started buying DC as well. I'm sure the new Indy heroclix when they come out will offer some interesting powers and such so I'll probably only buy the ones that I can see myself using.
I think even "Indy" still isn't going to cover the comics I read because most of the characters in these comics don't Have powers and such that would make them decent figures. They'd be worse than thugs! I don't read Spawn, or Shi, or Judge Dredd. I really hope that TMNT idea is real though 'cause I'd love that. I'd be willing to use the Turtles on a team. I watched them all the time when I was a kid. I really think Poison Elves could contribute some great clix to the Indy universe though, and who wouldn't love to see a Johnny the Homicidal Maniac unique? So it's not like I'm going to be buying Indy clix because I'm more interested in that world.
I do have my doubts about their introduction, but I say just wait and see how they work as playable figures. Hell, maybe in a few months everyone is going to have Splinter on their team for whatever reason. I'm more looking forward to a Punisher and Rhino clix, and more of those really corny Flash villians. (Although I really don't see Punisher being much more than Bullseye...)
(Oh, I just though of this... if they ever had He-Man clix, I'd buy them all in a second!)

Noman

02/28/2003, 20:28

The sanctioned tourney I have played in most recently allowed either DC teams or Marvel teams, but not Crossover teams. Now, personaly I LIKE crossover teams, but I happily played in the tourney, fielding my "Firelord and the Usual Suspects" team against Darkseid, DeSaad, Checkmate Medics, et al.
The LE's we won were DC LE's - but you don't hear me complaining.

Of course, no one has to buy Indy, but lots of us will...and if the Judge of the tourney allows mixing Universes (Crossover), then so be it.

Marquee tourneys and sealed tourneys will stay Indy or Marvel or DC only, of course.

...and guys, no one is forceing you to "learn about these characters" - although it might be cool if you did.
Personaly, I have never realy gone for Spawn or Hellboy, but I will learn how to play and or beat those pieces when they show up on the gaming table. The more pieces there are, from whatever Universe, the better the game becomes.

More Clix Please.

LoL

All the Best

Noman

freakazoid_x

02/28/2003, 20:37

I can't confirm it. I've heard it around on HCRealms. It would be cool and getting Mirage in on the act would be Awesome. But I cannot confirm it. I heard it as a rumor and I should point out that I pass it along as a rumor. Nothing more. I hope with every ounce of my being that it is, so maybe if I say it enough times it'll happen.

Spiritual_Ex

02/28/2003, 21:08

I'm with the no-Indyclix movement. Mainly because I'd much rather see time and effort put into Marvel and DC. BUT, I won't begrudge anyone the chance to see their favorite heroes in clix form, and if those heroes don't fit into the DC or Marvel worlds there isn't any other way but through IndyClix for people to get what they want. So I think Indyclix in general is a good idea, as it will make more people happy then it will PO'd. Hopefully it will be successful so that Wizkids continues to be prosperous. One of the biggest worries I have is that it will bomb, and in doing so it could affect the future of Heroclix. But that being said, I won't buy Indyclix just to support heroclix in general, as I'm not interested in any of the figures. So I'll cross my fingers when it is released, and hope those who want this set buy alot of it.

As for mixing, I'm generally against this (mainly because I believe mixing creates a totaly different game, and tends to promote a level of competitiveness that I don't like to see in Heroclix. I can deal with it when I have too, but for me the game becomes less enjoyable. And this game is about fun right?), but it is already being done. So introducing Indyclix won't have the impact that DC seemed to in my opinion. The damage of mixing has already been done, adding more models and an extra team power or two won't be all that drastic in my mind.

Just my 2 bits

WarHULK

03/01/2003, 00:37

I personally think that Indy is a cool Idea. I'm not a big DC fan and I still like my DC clix and I might not know alot about all the Indy characters, but I know some of them and the others will only increase my comic knowlage.

Anyway, to me it all boils dow to "more clix are more clix" and that means I've got more diversity to choose from.

The arguement of "I don't like Indy characters and thus don't want people to have them so I don't have to play them" could be applied to DC aswell, you know. I'm a huge Marvel fan, I'm not a big DC fan. I only own a handful of DC comics and they're all the new Batman with Lee and Loeb, some back issues of Harley Quinn I got for free, and the TPB of The Dark Knight Returns. I'll be first to admit that my knowlage of DC is lacking. I know a fair about of characters when I see them but I had no clue about people like Dove and Hawk and the like. It could have been said by many "I don't like DC, I don't want to play with them so I don't think they should make it" but was that really that vaild of an arguement? Is it not the same case here?

I bought DC because I wanted more clix, and I knew some characters. I continued to get them and gained much more knowlage about the DC U than I had previously and I'm glad I did.

Of course, I don't expect any anti-Indy people to listen to me objectively... but I don't see why anyone would be against getting any Clix, period.

bizarrome

03/01/2003, 01:09

The Shadow is owned by The Shadow Inc. but was licensed to DC in the past. I for one would love to see a Shadow fig in heroclix. I am not really interested in Indyclix, but if you all are, then great. I would consider buying Judge Dredd and Maybe the TMNT's, but I would have to see a list to cherry pick just the ones I like, which would only be a few, because most of the ones I like are Marvel and DC. I would like to see a Green Hornet and Kato figs, but since the title has been defunct for a number of years now, I'm not getting my hopes up....

Green Hornet, Kato, and the Shadow... Now that's a dream team for me....

MadHatter

03/01/2003, 01:29

I personally am all for the Indy Clix set, because I think that like any set, it will bring new tactical challenges to the game. I also believe it will be a far superior set to most of the Marvel offerings, simply because it will have to be. It cannot rest on its laurels with subpar paint and sculpt jobs, and dubious game mechanics. The vast majority of fans will not invest as heavily as in the big two; Wizkids realizes this and must therefore find ways to make the set more marketable, and the mistakenly released Shi 'greens' show that the sculpts are very well done and dynamic.

As for the argument that it shouldn't be produced, it is unlikely that you'll need more than a few key figs from the set, and if you're that afraid of the introduction of new mechanics and strategies, you can easily trade in order to obtain the new key figs from the set.

Additionally the tournament limit is about to hit two constructed per month, 1 Marvel, and 1 DC. The introduction of Indy clix will necessitate the introduction of a third constructed tournament per month, and if your venue allows mixing, that's a third event which you can use your Marvel figs at.

If you don't like them, simply speak through your wallet, but don't attempt to ruin it for people who enjoy a versatile, fuller game with some of their favorite characters.

JoeyTheButt

03/01/2003, 01:40

and they're on ebay toooo!!!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3117802042&category=2537

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3117805231&category=2537

TheLion

03/01/2003, 07:03

Originally posted by Joe Kerr
Wildcare weenie? Just a step below Firelord? Are you talking about the teams you copy from the internet and feel so cool when you walk into a place to play a tournament thinking, "Everyone will worship me?"

Could you do me a favor and point out where I had a problem with mixing Marvel and DC?

I personally do it in almost every game.

Second you can bring your Firelord and ANY combination of wildcards and I will beat it. I put my teams together and have a stratedgy around it. I am have won every tournament I have played in and that includes many battles with wildcard teams. And I'm not bragging about winning tournaments, I could careless about that as you will never see me mention that anywhere else on this board in the past or the future.

The whole point, the whole point being over your head, I'm a fan of Marvel and DC so why should I have to worry about Indy Clix? Now if you can process this one try and understand from a point of someone who buys cases of Marvel and DC and would rather by beer then put out a few bucks for Indy Clix that he has no interest in.

There will be figures in the set that will be able to hold their own with Marvel and DC and there maybe a new team ability that cheese armies (I'm guessing yourself) will love. You see my complaint isn't because I can't win or I fear cheese it's that I don't need to waste my money on Indy Clix to keep up with the cheese.

And another thing, after DC came out, I've played in a few different venues and all of them have had prize support and allowed mixed teams. So bottomline no matter what the rules say, judges are saying, "It's cool to mix the brands for the tournament" meaning you have to know both sets or you are out of luck. It comes down to money. Everyone wants to make it. If a store sells Marvel, DC, and Indy Clix then they are going to want to sell as much as possible. Therefore they are going to say, "Yes bring all Heroclix brands you want to the tournament" in order to sell the boosters and singles to the players who come out.

Back to my point, with this attitude, it's unfair for someone to have to buy Indy Clix just to keep up. So keep your flames to yourself kid.

This is such a typical response for this site.

Somebody posts something is unbalancing or unfair, then when called on it, posts that they have never lost, and can beat any team out there. Which is easy to say because it can't be verified and is highly suspect because if their record were so good they wouldn't be concerned with certain so called "unbalances."

Noman

03/01/2003, 09:15

While I don't agree with it, I don't think it's that typical. At least it's reasonably long and expresses a point of view - albeit one I don't agree with.

I think the game is likely to develop naturaly into one where the use of characters from different Universes or Companies in the same game becomes normal, but having said that I'm sure there will always be (eg) Marvel only Tourneys etc.

...and Indy Clix, or anything else for that matter, is a bit like the Dark Wolverine Promo, or the Heroclix Objects Sets. You don't have to buy them, you can play the game without them, but they give you depth, complexity, cool figures, and less money...

All the Best

Noman

MidnigherApoll

03/01/2003, 14:18

I'm kinda exicted for them. I have the exact opposite problem of TheDarkKnight. I'm not familair with all of the characters involved, but I think that in some cases, Indy comics and characters are better than mainstream ones. Image, Dark Horse, and Crossgen never had a comci for that football player, SuperPro, now did they? My problem is, I easily think that Crossgen and Image could have their own expansions, and that I fear only a few characters from each of those companies will be represented, and the rest of the set is going to be watered down characters I don't know. I think there should be CrossgenClix, ImageClix, AND IndyClix!

Unasoda

03/02/2003, 12:33

I don't really see what all the fuss is about.

First, sanctioned tournaments aren't meant to be crossed between Marvel and DC anyway. If they are, they are going to be few and far between, and you risk losing venue status and prize support if you abuse it too much.

Second, I seriously doubt that there will be any unbalancing characters in IndyClix. I mean, it's possible to make a team of all IC, all HT, or all CT people and beat a team from any of the other sets - which means that, no matter how much people complain about one piece or another being "borken" (sic), it's still possible to WIN and WIN WELL if you have some basic strategy and team-building skills. I would pit an all-DC team against and all IC team any day.

Third, the point of HeroClix is not that it's all about massive arms buildups where you absolutely have to buy the latest and greatest expansions just to keep up. In fact, WizKids has been awfully good about NOT doing that so far with Mage Knight. If you want an arms race game, go play Magic.

The point of HeroClix is to the fantasy battles between comic book characters that would never happen in comics. Period. It's not about winning LEs, or strutting around some comic book or game store like you're the Biggest Rooster Around just because you can whoop up on Firelord in a freakin' game. It's about having fun with characters we all know and love. That's it, plain and simple, and Indy Clix is the ultimate extension of that premise: it bucks the corporate comic system and allows those of us who like Judge Dredd, Groo, Danger Girl, and Hellboy to play with our favorites, too.

In a word, relax. If all you can see is the arms race/winning tournaments/gotta-have-the-LEs aspect of this game, maybe it's time to find another hobby.

Noman

03/02/2003, 12:43

Hello Unasoda.

The others you mention have all been confirmed already, but are you in a position to confirm Groo is in ?

(...tastes like Strawberry to me...)

LoL

All the Best

Noman

GluttonCreeper

03/02/2003, 13:20

i believe sandman gets spidey team from the time he was an ally of spiderman....

disgruntled that he could never beat spidey, sandman joined up with him on several occasions.

then towards the end of his career he hooked up with silver sable and her crew of mercenaries.

ps i lose almost every tournament i play (except when in draft i get a real sucky team, i win with ####, and i lose with gold)

Unasoda

03/02/2003, 13:43

Noman,

I wish. :)

We still need to talk to Jon L. about it. I've spoken with Mark Evanier, and he said that he and Sergio are both game if WizKids is.

I mean, there's enough cool characters in Groo to do a whole expansion... which will probably be what happens, since it's too late to get them into the initial set.

It could be called Indy Clix: Frays or Indy Clix: Mendicants or something. ;)

razz10555

03/02/2003, 14:31

I'm excited about indy clix, I don't know if I'll go spend crazy & get all of them like I did with marvel & dc, but there will be several indies in my collection

does anyone know if the savage dragon or shadow hawk are on the list

TheFallenOne

03/02/2003, 14:44

im all for indy clix, it will be a good chance for my pocketbook to have a break. I wont buy any of them. so it will be a nice chance to recuperate my funds for the next marvel of d.c. set to come out.

PsychoDBoy

03/02/2003, 14:58

Place I go has sanctioned mixed tournies too....there are of'en tournies with 100 pt min from each universe, and every tourny has prize support n such. Onto the indys: I can't wait. I hope there's a Milk & Cheese fig (They were in the Wildstorms CCG so could be put against spawn an the like, why not in here?), Scud, Turtles, an of course JTHM (even a PsychoDBoy! :p ). And I would NEVER complain about anything in clix again if the Adolescent Radioactive Black Belt Hamsters, or Geriatric Gangrene Jijitsu Gerbils were in em :D

Starman973

03/02/2003, 15:21

I would love to see Hellboy take a swing at Superman. Or see Ghost trade shots with Nick Fury. Or How about Brigid from More than Mortal spearing down Flash. There are some good True Comic book heros in INdy land, Spawn would be in Indy and Shadow is owned by DC. What about Savage Dragon and Savage hulk trading fists? open you mind. don't assume that wizkids is going to approuch the cartoonish comic book heros. After all They didn't make Captain Carrot and His Zoo Crew (DC) or Howard the Duck (marvel).

Noman

03/02/2003, 15:31

A Groo Universe set - Oh yes please...

and Howard the Duck

and the Turtles

and Cerebus the Aardvark

Do it guys...

And Unasoda, keep putting in a good word for Groo in the next Indy expansion !

"Did I ere ?"

LoL

All the Best

Noman

Jadehorde

03/05/2003, 00:35

Originally posted by IceHot
I think that the Indy Clix could seriously dilute the Marvel Clix universe as does the DC to an extent. Remember that the sets have been designed and tested independently of each other.

Clix is a GAME. A game of minatures essentially. As follows, it attempts to illustrate the characters and how they would play out if your were the leader. To complete the illusion things must be in balance. If robin beats the #### out of the Incredible Hulk the illusion is shattered.

And this is the risk of cross-overs. Certainly, no-one wants to be forced into accepting something they are axiomatically opposed to (e. g. Judge Trade beating up Thor - not gonna happen on any planet I have ever dreamed of).

Nonetheless, I think the turtles are cool. There may be some other cool Indy Guys I will learn about as well.

Just two more cents, some things are just stupid, and if you don't have the moral fortitude to make the right call then you will be the first one I smash. Batman Ally on Ultron or Dr. Doom makes zipo sense. Maybe true in game mechanics, but the game could survive without that crossover. Personallly I try to avoid MOD and Spidey crossovers. Why do we have these 2 separate teams. To me it suggests that there are Good Guy teams and Bad guy teams.

Some other retarded ideas reserved for the unimaginiative:
1) multiple copies of the same guy - What universe is that?
2) Vulture+Spiderman
3) Anni+Blaastar (they hate each other)
4) Range Combat at base-to-base for hovering characters

I know Wasp (taxi) carrying Hulk makes no sense, but the concept of flyers carrying Close Combat guys is neccesary for a fun game with tactical complexity. I'm willing to make this sacrifice for playability, but the other goofy retarded ideas could be left for playing at home since they don't enhance playability.

If you don't understand the tactical importance of taxis try this fight. Mr. Hyde vs. Hercules or Jugs vs. Spiral. I believe the correct tactical decision to be pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-etc.

P. S. could someone please explain to me how Sandman got the spidey team ability.

:cool:

there was a while there where Sandman was a good guy...right after Doc Ock blasted him with a ray gun turning him into glass..

rustolla76

03/05/2003, 18:50

Hey heres one for all you whinners. Indy will only help the clix game because it gives the player more options. I think the only people who don't want Indy clix are just the little ten year old kids playing. 'Cause there mommy won't let them buy comics that are scarry and the good guys don't always wear spandex in them. I know a lot of you have been moaning about new powers. The truth is there probaly won't be new powers just look at the new expansion set for Marvel not one new power. I think if you take time and look at the the powers out there now they cover almost every super hero and villain to some degree. If that still doesn't do it for you sorry about your luck and don't cry when my team of Tick,XO man o war,Savage Dragon, The Mask and, the Flamming Carrot open a can whupp Butt on ya in a game

bizzaro

03/05/2003, 19:07

Originally posted by TheDarkKnight
Batman taking on Judge Dred

Why wouldn't you? DC did a one shot special with Dredd and Batman taking on Judge Death and scarecrow .... which was decent (loved the part where scarecrow used his fear toxin on Judge Death ... :p )

CyberVenom

03/05/2003, 19:10

I'm 22, and personally, while I do love some of the Indy characters, I don't want to see them in Clix. But again, I'll still get them. I'd have preferred them not make a set, but since they are, then there's no need to complain about it.

Which is what I'm gonna do here anyway. :)

As a comic book fan, I've never been able to get into the Indy comics as much as I have Marvel and DC. While we all know that most Indy's are more personal to the creators, most of the time (for me at least) it doesn't feel that way. With the Big 2 ( I don't count Image. I'll get into that in a second), the history behind them makes you have actual feelings for the characters. Anyone remember the backlash from Peter not being the real Spider-Man? Superman dying at the hands of Doomsday? Of course. Does anyone remember when Eric Draven came back from the dead to avenge Shelly's death? Vampirella returning to her home? Barely.

As for Image. I really don't want to get too heavy into it, but I'll make a quick statement about them. In my honest opinion, the founders of Image, while extradinarily talented, where also extraordinarily dumb. When joining Marvel, they knew what their contracts said, about characters and all. And while Todd McFarlane did help out in creating my favorite character, I feel he's become Comic Book business equivilant of The Rock in Wrestling. He made his money, so he's gonna screw the fans so he can do other stuff.

Todd was always a comic book artist, never a comic book fan.

Jadehorde

03/06/2003, 01:24

Originally posted by CyberVenom
I'm 22, and personally, while I do love some of the Indy characters, I don't want to see them in Clix. But again, I'll still get them. I'd have preferred them not make a set, but since they are, then there's no need to complain about it.

Which is what I'm gonna do here anyway. :)

As a comic book fan, I've never been able to get into the Indy comics as much as I have Marvel and DC. While we all know that most Indy's are more personal to the creators, most of the time (for me at least) it doesn't feel that way. With the Big 2 ( I don't count Image. I'll get into that in a second), the history behind them makes you have actual feelings for the characters. Anyone remember the backlash from Peter not being the real Spider-Man? Superman dying at the hands of Doomsday? Of course. Does anyone remember when Eric Draven came back from the dead to avenge Shelly's death? Vampirella returning to her home? Barely.

As for Image. I really don't want to get too heavy into it, but I'll make a quick statement about them. In my honest opinion, the founders of Image, while extradinarily talented, where also extraordinarily dumb. When joining Marvel, they knew what their contracts said, about characters and all. And while Todd McFarlane did help out in creating my favorite character, I feel he's become Comic Book business equivilant of The Rock in Wrestling. He made his money, so he's gonna screw the fans so he can do other stuff.

Todd was always a comic book artist, never a comic book fan.

While you definitely seem to have put some effort into your comments and are entirely civil...it doesn't really make any sense...

I don't understand why making Indyclix seems to equate to bad because you don't particularly find them interesting. They aren't as well-known as Marvel or DC, but that's hardly being fair...none are as old, so of course there is going to be a bigger fanbase/draw from the "standard" characters...

A much better question to ask is...created completely separately from an established character...what character created by your favorite comic company (Marvel/DC for the people who are Indyclix detractors) in the last 5-10 years has so much draw over an established character that justifies your claims?

Basically, you're saying Indyclix is not good because not many people are moved by the character's stories...because they aren't of the big two...my rebuttal is name a recently created character from the big two that has created some huge storm of interest that proves your point. Using characters decades old that your grandfather read is completely unfair...use something contemporary of the comics Indy will use...and divorced from established characters (ie no Doomsday or Bane, etc...their claim to fame is almsot soley due to their involvement with established heroes).

I find the concept of Indyclix refreshing..I'm not too sure of the characters as given so far, but there is definitely something to this. I've not heard any real argument to be made against Heroclix except elitist whining that they aren't from comics the posters read so they must suck...or the ridiculous argument that somehow the Indyclix line is gonna take away from the "real" Heroclix lines...because of course Wizkids isn't going to expand their production abilities, and testing,marketing, etc...if the line is successful...and like someone else said...the exact same argument could be made as to why there is more than one line being made right now...DC was signed first..it would have sucked if they got exclusive rights because some DC guys didn't want their fave product from being "diluted" by some other product (ie Marvel) that didn't suit their interests and so must suck.

Further, find comics in the big two that absolutely put the Indy stuff to rest..
Red Star for drama and plot, Powers for witty dialogue and engaging story, Danger Girl for camp and cheesecake, etc...I challenge anyone to find comics that operate so much better in the big 2 that puts these titles to shame.

MCalamari

03/06/2003, 01:45

Originally posted by Joe Kerr
I don't want to see With tons of Marvel and DC it just isn't fair for someone who likes these two products to be forced to get the new one just to keep up with everyone else.

What about say the Marvel fans that don't like playing against DC characters?

I only follow a few indy comics, but I'm looking forward to the Indy expansion just the same, as it will make the games I play (and watch) all the more interesting. I mean, who really needs to watch Black Panther and Batman sneak around and outwit Steel or Firelord one more time?

I think more expansions, especially ones that introduce more new characters, will only bring more players into the game. More players = greater chance to trade away those figures you may not like.

bizarrome

03/06/2003, 11:51

the founders of Image, while extradinarily talented, where also extraordinarily dumb. When joining Marvel, they knew what their contracts said, about characters and all. And while Todd McFarlane did help out in creating my favorite character, I feel he's become Comic Book business equivilant of The Rock in Wrestling. He made his money, so he's gonna screw the fans so he can do other stuff. Todd was always a comic book artist, never a comic book fan.

I agree, With this statement, especially concerning Todd Mcfarlene. While I do not like McFarlene's work (Except for his short run on the title "Spiderman"), I think that much of the talent in comics never considers the future. I remember reading in a Marvel Universe Hardcover that Stan Lee and Jack Kirby along with Steve Ditko and a few others always left openings for plot additions or spin off stories when they would plot and create a story including in the artwork. I have read a few Image comics and overall I have not been impressed enough to follow a character very far. (The same can be said of Marvel and DC over the last fifteen years.) But when considering that I have purchased nearly all the Heroclix currently available just on my love of the old versions of the same charaters, You won't have that in the Indy set. So I don't think that as many people will be ready to purchase any of the Indy set.

I don't understand why making Indyclix seems to equate to bad because you don't particularly find them interesting. They aren't as well-known as Marvel or DC, but that's hardly being fair...none are as old, so of course there is going to be a bigger fanbase/draw from the "standard" characters...

[QUOTE] A much better question to ask is...created completely separately from an established character...what character created by your favorite comic company (Marvel/DC for the people who are Indyclix detractors) in the last 5-10 years has so much draw over an established character that justifies your claims? [QUOTE]

What I do forsee is that most will want to cherry pick a few favorites and leave the rest, Whereas with Marvel and DC most have purchased complete or near complete sets. I for one do not know what the list of Indy clix will contain, but at this point the only independent character I have an interest in purchasing from the one's I have heard about is Judge Dredd. With that being said. I want to see them make the set for those people who do want it, simply because it will generate more sales for WK's and that just helps the company continue and will boost interest and hopfully keep the Marvel and DC sets coming.

For the record I think Marv Wolfman who created blade deserves credit, but he did sign a contract and he knew what he was getting into. No one forsaw Blade becoming as popular as he did. The same with Wolverine too. No one knew he was going to become so popular either. Also Spawn hasn't been near as popular for years now as when he was first introduced. I don't think he even has a title currently. I never liked Spawn he was too big a rip-off of Ghost Rider and others. Especially the original Ghost Rider, I didn't like him either. while they seem to be good guys. Once you sell your soul to the devil, It doesn't matter how much good you do, your still condeemed. Also, everyone knows that the devil is a liar and a cheat, so why trust him to keep his part of the deal it makes the main character look pretty stupid. I don't think that Marvel, DC, or Image has come out with any characters that have rocked the market in the last 5 - 10 years.

With this said, has anyone seen a list of the coming Indy Clix, or a pick of the unique Shadowcat from Explosion??

DS-00-0, FSD

03/06/2003, 12:36

I will buy a starter for the map and new tokens and then probably cherry-pick. Not knowing who a character is tends to take the fun out of using the charatcer for me.

Top on my list is Hellboy. He will be the one fig I'll probably end up purchasing as a single. I'd personally like to see John Byrne's Next Men, but seeing as how they haven'y seen print in a while, that's not gonna happen. :(

Logan Myrddin

03/06/2003, 14:51

Go to hell, DarkKnight. And I don't usually get that mean.

maddog

03/07/2003, 12:55

Most of the "Indy" figures that I would personally want to see are now owned by DC. The WildStorm line, with Gen13, WildC.A.T.S., and Astro City (among others) would all make great clix. I think that these figures should eventually be made.

However, there are alot of pretty obscure comics that people will ask for. The question is this: Would a particular figure make good business to produce? Wtih properties like Hellboy, yes (there is a movie in the works); Milk and Cheese, while cool, would not be as acceptable to the general public. Would Marv from Sin City sell? Maybe, I know I would buy it. Would the Tick sell? Again, maybe.

The success of movies like Spider-Man, X-Men, Daredevil, Superman, Batman, and Blade, plus the upcoming Hulk flick means that there are alot more people exposed to the comic book genre. While these folks can get into Marvel & DC HeroClix, chances are that most Indy stuff will escape them.

darius_dax1

03/07/2003, 15:27

Just to support Marvel/DC/Indyclix cross-overs:
a list of some of the comics:

Wolverine/Shi
Shi/Cyblade
Daredevil/Shi
Darkseid/Galactus
Superman/Spider-man
Batman/Punisher
Silver Surfer/Superman
Batman/Captain America
Ironman/X-O Manowar
Hulk/Superman
Green Lantern/Silver Surfer
Star Trek/X-men
Star Trek NG/X-men
Batman/Spawn
Savage Dragon/Marshal Law
Savage Dragon/Hellboy
Savage Dragon/Megaton Man
Savage Dragon/ Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
Joker/The Mask
Tarzan/Superman
Batman/Hulk
Batman/Hellboy/Starman
Superman/Madman
X-men/Teen Titans
and there are many more.

PMMJ

03/07/2003, 15:37

Originally posted by Jadehorde
I challenge anyone to find comics that operate so much better in the big 2 that puts these titles to shame.

Anything Elseworlds/What If? right off the bat.

Indy comics don't have the same sense of history, the same legacy, as it were. Look at the Secret Origins of the Flash and the Green Lantern, the sense of family and a mantle being passed down from generation to generation. DC and Marvel can do that, because they *have* that weight of history and backstory to them.

Or Grant Morrison dragging up some two-bit villian from the 70's and making him a Justice-League-level threat again.

But, I'm just beign a devil's advocate here, as I am pro-Indy.

Jadehorde

03/07/2003, 19:45

Originally posted by PMMJ

Anything Elseworlds/What If? right off the bat.

Indy comics don't have the same sense of history, the same legacy, as it were. Look at the Secret Origins of the Flash and the Green Lantern, the sense of family and a mantle being passed down from generation to generation. DC and Marvel can do that, because they *have* that weight of history and backstory to them.

Or Grant Morrison dragging up some two-bit villian from the 70's and making him a Justice-League-level threat again.

But, I'm just beign a devil's advocate here, as I am pro-Indy.

sure...but again...find something divorced from established characters that can do what those comics do better...

That was exactly my point...there is a lot of history to fall back on...my whole "the comcis your grandfather read" addresses that. It isn't fair to compare the interest in Superman or even second tier X-men to some Indy comics characters because they haven't been around as long. I was addressing the comment that the Indy comics are bad because they don't have the draw...so my argument was simply find a comic/character from the big 2 that was created recently and divorced of another character's participation that has the same draw or does things so much better than Indy comics of a similar time period.

Basically, can you think of a comic made recently so much better than the comics I listed in the way I listed???

CyberVenom

03/07/2003, 20:06

What about the hoopla over Blink and the Exiles? Pretty much every new character in X-Force? The Authority? Preacher? Deadpool (although he might not count)?

Jadehorde

03/09/2003, 17:03

Originally posted by CyberVenom
What about the hoopla over Blink and the Exiles? Pretty much every new character in X-Force? The Authority? Preacher? Deadpool (although he might not count)?

Exiles barely counts...it relies heavily on established characters..giveing them unique twists and visions of alternate worlds...eventhough I like it a lot...it cheats by using the universe to boost the characters.

X-Force is pretty good...I wouldn't know what to compare it to in the Indy world though...

The Authority is up there...as is Preacher...though they aren't in the mainstream DCU...and so are allowed to get away with some things that Indy is famous for.

Deadpool might count...it's a tough call on that one.

The point still remains though...just because as many people don't follow Indy comics it doesn't make them bad because you'll now have to be at leat somewhat aware of them...for all your examples...most haven't blown away the numbers the higher level Indy comics bring in. Good niche stuff will always be that...a niche product...so the big 2 can make some good stuff, but that doesn't exclude Indy comics from doing the same...and going by how many people actually care what's been going on in the major money characters...it's not too far off...

Meaning going by the reasoning about why people didn't want Indy clix...

Everyone cares about Batman, Superman, Spiderman, X-men. because they've been around forever and everyone is familiar with them...but how many major plot events can the average comic reader even recall for the last however many years about these big names?? If the answer isn't the majority of things, then how can one say that Indy comics suck because not that many people follow them? It's an extreme example, but that is my point. Saying Indy comix suck because not a whole lot of people read them is ridiculous, because in your example (and you made it better than I could), most of those comics don't move the most comics, yet it's hardly arguable that they operate at a high level of quality in comicdom.

bizarrome

03/09/2003, 23:52

Personally I don't care for Independent comics as a whole because I don't really care for most of their characters. But I personally don't care if they make them or not. I won't be buying many (if any). I said before Judge Dredd might (and it is a big might) find his way into my collection. If I can get one in trade or cheap. But I can't think of any other Indy clix that I have heard might be in the set that I would want.

As far as new from the big two, how about the Power Company?? They have 4 new characters that seem do be doing quite well. Striker Z, Witchfire, Sapphire, and Josiah Power. Josiah was injured in a assasination attack a few issues back and is near death. I found the writing and art very compelling and I actually care what happens to the team(wich is refreshing with what mostly is out there now). There is a new Manhunter and a little known chracter named Skyrocket and a thug named Carl Bork who has been mutated into a powerful creature. Before the series Bork had made one appearance in a Brave and the Bold issue facing off against Batman and the Flash. The only resemblance in the character now is the name. Manhunter is a clone and has no history of the old character who is dead, and his costume is different as well. Also Skyrocket was such a minor character that very few even remembered her. So given the similarities that many or most of the independent characters have to parts of characters in the big 2, I think this series is definitely a first rate answer to your question Jadehorde. The series at this point has only been out a little over a year and is doing quite well.

Firestorm has been added to the team in the most recent issue and he is more well known. But he too is different than he used to be. He no longer is merged with Prof. Martin Stein who was the scientific part of the merger, and he is now having to learn chemical composition and recognition of different types of atoms to make his powers work. Also since he is no longer joined with the professor, he is having to rebuild his life on his own. So in effect he is like starting over. How many times has Spawn started and stopped?? How many times has a book in any of the genre did the same thing?? That is how how it is in the big 2 and the independents.

So the new Title's name is Power Comapny and the new Characters are Striker Z, Witchfire, Sapphire, and Josiah Power.

honky

03/10/2003, 00:00

oooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!

just think of it! fish police!

darius_dax1

03/10/2003, 09:15

These are not only independent comic book characters where Heroclix is concerned. Indyclix are game pieces that one only needs to learn how to use in the game. If this sparks an interest in the character and compels one to investigate further, all the better.

Jadehorde

03/10/2003, 13:31

Originally posted by bizarrome
Personally I don't care for Independent comics as a whole because I don't really care for most of their characters. But I personally don't care if they make them or not. I won't be buying many (if any). I said before Judge Dredd might (and it is a big might) find his way into my collection. If I can get one in trade or cheap. But I can't think of any other Indy clix that I have heard might be in the set that I would want.

As far as new from the big two, how about the Power Company?? They have 4 new characters that seem do be doing quite well. Striker Z, Witchfire, Sapphire, and Josiah Power. Josiah was injured in a assasination attack a few issues back and is near death. I found the writing and art very compelling and I actually care what happens to the team(wich is refreshing with what mostly is out there now). There is a new Manhunter and a little known chracter named Skyrocket and a thug named Carl Bork who has been mutated into a powerful creature. Before the series Bork had made one appearance in a Brave and the Bold issue facing off against Batman and the Flash. The only resemblance in the character now is the name. Manhunter is a clone and has no history of the old character who is dead, and his costume is different as well. Also Skyrocket was such a minor character that very few even remembered her. So given the similarities that many or most of the independent characters have to parts of characters in the big 2, I think this series is definitely a first rate answer to your question Jadehorde. The series at this point has only been out a little over a year and is doing quite well.

Firestorm has been added to the team in the most recent issue and he is more well known. But he too is different than he used to be. He no longer is merged with Prof. Martin Stein who was the scientific part of the merger, and he is now having to learn chemical composition and recognition of different types of atoms to make his powers work. Also since he is no longer joined with the professor, he is having to rebuild his life on his own. So in effect he is like starting over. How many times has Spawn started and stopped?? How many times has a book in any of the genre did the same thing?? That is how how it is in the big 2 and the independents.

So the new Title's name is Power Comapny and the new Characters are Striker Z, Witchfire, Sapphire, and Josiah Power.

True...I've read it and collected some of the issues. My point is though, how many people here know much about those characters?? Do many people care? I'd wager not many because the title is new and the characters aren't yet established....and if you're a fan (you seem to be) wouldn't you like some Clix of these characters? Wouldn't it be terrible if a few people who had a very narrow minded view as to what a good comic was...prevented those characters...or any favorite niche character...from being made into clix??

Like the Outsiders, Doom Patrol, Alpha Flight, or any other team that doesn't burst with big names and recognized icons?

True, these teams have had big names on board, but the key members...it would take a comic buff, or someone with a particular interest in these teams and characters to recall all the members. Would it not be terrible...that they were passed over simply because they didn't have a huge following and were not icons? That they were ignored because "who cares about these comics"?

That's been my ultimate point. I'm not entirely thrilled about Indy clix yet...but the potential it opens up, that I DO find interesting. Though I do have a weakness for the gratuitous cheesecake of Danger Girl....

And again, I don't think many people were sitting around waiting for a Man-Bat and TO Morrow, or a Typhoid Mary and Mr. Hyde...so marginal characters (with their small contingent of rabid fans) have been made to the overall joy of the community. Think it's only fair to give some Indy fans a shot at some miniatures fun.

bizarrome

03/10/2003, 15:05

I agree with your view and support it as well. There are a few figs from the big 2 that I didn't purchase from nothing more than lack of interest. I too have seen people educated on the histories of several of the lesser knowns here at the realm. So keep making your point, because I agree and even if I don't like very many independents, there are those that don't like very many Marvel or DC.

P.S. I was actually hoping for a Man-Bat when I heard DC was going to do a set, so your point is doubley made....

capsshield

03/10/2003, 15:07

It doesn't matter what the big corporates say or think. us fans will mix and match the figures as we see fit. I love comic books. when i first heard about heroclix i thought this might be neat to collect. since then i've found i love the game as well, and i think most comic book fans have found out the same things i did. heroclix works on a lot of levels. For those of you that think you will be forced to buy indy clix dont, but if you really love heroclix this is a bonus. I read a few indys and would rather see more marvel and dc but marvel and dc only make up 70% of the market and indy clix will fill a big void.if a set of indy clix brings into the game another group of comic fans, it works to everyones advantage. you might find you really enjoy playing with a certain indy fig but have never read the characters stories and find a whole new world or two to explore. something i learned many years ago, collect what you love and love what you collect

Jadehorde

03/10/2003, 21:53

Originally posted by bizarrome
I agree with your view and support it as well. There are a few figs from the big 2 that I didn't purchase from nothing more than lack of interest. I too have seen people educated on the histories of several of the lesser knowns here at the realm. So keep making your point, because I agree and even if I don't like very many independents, there are those that don't like very many Marvel or DC.

P.S. I was actually hoping for a Man-Bat when I heard DC was going to do a set, so your point is doubley made....

Well, then I'm dang glad they made him for you!!!

I hope you're rewarded again in the next DC expansion.

Though I wonder if all my thinking and writing is wasted...since everyone remaining on this thread seems to agree...the original Indy clix detractors seem to have moved on. Ah well, good luck in any new figures that come out...waiting for the JLA...though if the Avengers is any indication it'll be an expansion or two down the line before we get the full big gun crew.

CyberVenom

03/10/2003, 21:57

Honestly, I've been reading the whole thread (which is a very good thread, by the way! :) ). The only reason I haven't posted again was because I realize that both sides aren't going to back down at all, making us both right, and both wrong. It's interesting, but I've got other threads to look at. :)

Jadehorde

03/11/2003, 15:46

Originally posted by CyberVenom
Honestly, I've been reading the whole thread (which is a very good thread, by the way! :) ). The only reason I haven't posted again was because I realize that both sides aren't going to back down at all, making us both right, and both wrong. It's interesting, but I've got other threads to look at. :)

Hey coolness...someone is still around...

and hey everyone is entitled to their opinions...just presenting it on a board almost requires it be commented on, one way or another...hopefully, I've finally stripped away the carp and misunderstanding of my poor words to at least raise an eyebrow from the opposition.

If I can get one person to maybe come at this with an open mind...then my work is done and I'm going back to bed.

Kurgan2001

03/11/2003, 19:39

I would have to dis agree that Marvel and DC are the "Higest sellers" I think that is a completly byast opinion. I have been collecting comics for years and one thing I noticed is that for one MArvel is doing exceptionly poorly not too many years ago they filed for bankrupcy especially after Jim Lee left X-men the comic went down hill with story lines. And if you actually went to a comic stor a few yers ago they always had DC and Marvel comics in stock but it was rare that you could get a copy of Gen 13 (Unless you reserved it or was really lucky that day) Or Chastity, Lady Death just to name a few. Not to be mean but I think you should research a little before you sau something like that.

Kurgan2001

bizarrome

03/12/2003, 00:18

Speaking only for my area, I would have to say that this was true. But when I asked the store owner about it, he said he ordered 25 to 35 copies of most Marvel and DC titles each month, and only about 12 to 15 copies of the more popular independents and only about 8 copies of most the other independent comics.

But what does it matter?? I for one one like to see a varity of figs so that everyone could have their favorites so they could play with them. And who knows, if it sparks an interest in a particular character or team in the process that is great. After all, we need new blood in this hobby badly! The comic market has been declining overall for several years, and most of the young people would rather watch a video, play video games, or play on the computer. So anything to boost interest in a failing market is greatly needed.