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View Full Version : Overall Opinions of X-Plosion ( the good and bad ) and questions


Gorrack
03/03/2003, 18:46
Ok, I have looked over X Plosion alot lately. First off, it is neither a good nor bad set. It seems extremely balanced when played solely amongst itself, and if played with CT as well. The set itself is quite strong. It is Infinity Challenge that makes it hard to play alot of the stronger peices. The peices in that set are unusually strong ( Firelord and Ultron, etc etc etc ) and I do see that in order for the game to continue for a long time tournement wise, than something needs to be done, perhaps even cycling these peices out. Perhaps do something like Magic The Gathering and make a new " base set " where some figs are left out and only the balanced ones are let in. This may help balance the tournement scene. Of course in fun games and possibly some tournemnts all figs can be allowed. But in case for large scale competitions, I do see some change needing to be made. That is the ONLY issue I have with X Plosion in general, besides a few individual characters.

Onto the good things. Very nice character choices and most of them greatly represent the characters they do. The game seems INCREDIBLY good with just CT and XP sets, and if you throw in DC peices as well. Im thinking of using that as a format for alot of my games. I think those who play to win benefit off this set as well, as Perplex is VERY cheap. That can easily fit into alot of teams. It also helps the lower attack values that we are seeing. An 8 point medic with a still 7 attack value. BEAUTIFUL to see. 20 point Prob Control peice ( as well as a cool character :P ) MASTERFUL. Possibly the best peice in the set IMO. Mystique has the chance to see alot of play in my eyes, with the perfect combonation of powers to represent her. We see alot of solid taxis. Also, you have Psylocke to work with for EE teams and other nice cheesy stuff. SO those who want to play in tournements DO get their fix of beautiful little tricks to toy around with. Deathbird, Sauron, Green Goblin, Shadowcat, Doc Samson and a few others are also strong enough to see alot of play. I still claim Colossus can be used effectively as well ( Cheapest bruiser with Charge is a very nice thing, and hes X Men team so that opening click isnt as bad ) For those who play for fun games or to use your favorite character, just make sure your opponent is too, and you should be fine. I just dislike those who ##### about others using uber-cheese teams in tournements. I have no problem if someone wants to play the game for fun, or because they love comics. But when you play in a tournement, expect the best teams, and dont criticize those who play the game for competition. If you dont want to try and win by whatever means necissary, why arent you playing games with your friends or others who have the same goal? I dont mean that insultingly, I just mean that there are some of the players who view the game purely by numbers and play for the desire to see who can be strategically the best and I think they have a place in the game as well, so when players come into their aspect of the game ( Tournements ) and try and yell at them for trying to prove they are the best, thats about as low as busting out a Firelord Cheese team on someone in a friendly battle.

ANYWAYS, onto a few key figs t hat I see getting attention...

Iron Man- again, stats are getting lower and lower, and I bet if you play him in an only CT/XP game, youd see him quite effective. His powers seem EXTREMELY accurate as well. Very nice range too. A BIT pricy especially with most games at 300.

Colossus- I myself am a big fan of what they did with him. Lots of clicks is VERY good for the X Men. The starting off click could be worse as well. It also means if you Over Heal him with support you can get back to beefy quick. His attack and defense may be lower for a bruiser, but hes cheaper than most heavy ones and has Charge. I honestly say hes a solid match for Herc, despite the lower AV. solid 4 damage and charge and a few clix of Invuln for 79 points is nothing to laugh at. He is one of my favorite characters and I for one may not use him in tournements, but I do see him as a very viable peice to be used, and is close to being at that level.

Mystique- I LOVE YOU JON!!! IF YOU WERE A WOMAN ID MARRY YOU!!!! Mystique is one of my ALL TIME favorite characters and I was prematurely crying on a nightly basis over seeing her dial floating in front of me with a deep blue square centered perfectly on her damage slot while Perplex Outwit and Leadership all better fit her. The stats and playability of this peice are very accurate to her, and my Brotherhood team is going to be coming along quite nicely. Stealth and Perplex is very strong, but it would be much better if Perplex didnt come so cheaply now. But she also has a decent range and enough AV and Defense to put up a mild fight for her cost. Id prefer her EE clicks to be at the start of the dial, but its no big deal. She can deal a hefty 3 damage with a high enough attack as a supporter ( let the main guys hit for 3-4 clix and than that 8 or so AV looks a whole lot more menacing ) Free move is also nice. for either 34, 43, or 51 points, I see all three being heavily used by me, even in tournement teams.

Destiny- jeeze. Broken if ya ask me. I love the brotherhood, so this is all fine by me. Perfect for my teams. Best Prob Controller yet for 12 points less than Black Cat. For 200 points I can fit Mystique, Destiny, Blob, Avalanche, Pyro and Toad for 200 in what IMO is a pretty nice Classic Botherhood configuration.

Apocalypse- *sigh* This is the big complaint I have. Apocalypse is also one of my favorite characters and I will be struggling to use him effectively I can see already. Jon, if you are reading this, can you please explain your choices on his powers ( Phasing!? ) and his stats which seem fairly low to me. I would have liked to see his Defense up a few points, or some extra Invuln, or at least give him Phasing in the first few clix over Leadership as I do not like that ability weighing down a 100+ point peice. Lastly, if the stats were like this, id have prefered at least a strong range of 8 or more. I see myself pulling off some wicked Phasing tricks in Indoor arenas, and he is nice to tie up peices with, but unless im having him taxi I Girl all over the place, I just dont see him worth the 133 points he costs. Again, id really like an explaination here.

Storm- very solid peice, especially vet, with nothing weighing her down. She very well could have deserved alot of versitile powers, but the way she is done she is the most playable.

Gambit- decent enough stuff here, kept cheap enough, no complaints.

Iceman- same here, nice to see choices for cheap X Men

Shadowcat- very interesting indeed. Gotta throw her with my colossus at all times :P

Doc Samson- WHO IS HE!?! HES A FRIGGIN MAN-BEAST!!! JEEZE!!!

Green Goblin- VERY nice. Always liked the goblin, and it looks to me that he will see a decent share of play. Nice point value and not overpowered, just very effecient.

Deathbird- Always liked her as well, and is possibly the fig I want to use most for an army, just like Moon Dragon from CT for me. Nice range abilities, with a high defense, and BCFs. Perfect set of abilities for only 70 points. WHy are the girls always getting the nice stats in the sets? :P

Sauron- also very nice if ya ask me. Another desirably Unique.

Hulk- best one yet, but does anyone expect to see him getting used much? Prolly not. I dont like figs that dont start out ready to fight much.

Elektra- seeing how this is one Jon pushed for alot himself, I am a BIT irritated by all the elektras, but this one is violently different and passes by me. She looks playable to me, and is something new. If they would have left her outta CT than it would be perfect. If i get her, ill give her a spin.

Overall, MAJOR props to Mystique for being so goddam perfect. Also props to Colossus and Destiny. MAJOR slops to Apocalypse.

Also...Jon, if you are reading this, can we get an explaination on Big A? And also...one person request for the next set. A new Magneto, preferably less Glass jawed and PLEASE ( this is just the tourney player inside of me that wants to see this happen btw :P ) let him have an 18 defense with Energy Shield Deflection as well :) I think if anyone deserves it naturally, a guy who can toss up magnetic forcefields with a flick is it. Hes the most powerful mutant for a reason,no? Basically, all im askin for is a suped up IC Mags for around 150+ points to truely represent his awesomeness. I know...not gonna happen. But wouldnt a helmetless Mags just be cool? :P

bizzaro
03/03/2003, 18:56
My question is how can you be so pysched with Mystique when she's missing shape change? At least the stats don't show her having it .....

Gorrack
03/03/2003, 18:58
Any peice without Shape CHange is a good one. Thats why. Its the weakest power and would take away any PLAYABLE power that could be given to her.

AruthaEvanstil
03/03/2003, 19:00
As far as I can see, I agree with you 100%!!!
Solid opinions on characters, and I also ( as well as many others) are hoping that when we have the Apoc on our teams we will find some way to successfully play him to make him the power house he should be. Great job on Xplosion JonL!!! I think that this set MAY hopefully balance the game some more, and we will find out soon.

bizzaro
03/03/2003, 19:06
Originally posted by Gorrack
Any peice without Shape CHange is a good one. Thats why. Its the weakest power and would take away any PLAYABLE power that could be given to her.

I understand the rationale of perplex and stealth being given to her ... but when you say "shape change" the first non-skrull I think of is Mystique. Give her a click at the end of her dial or something. It wouldn't have made her unplayable and kept her true to the character. I'm old school I guess ....

AshenFang
03/03/2003, 19:06
I personally like how Mystique was done as well.

So she doesn't have the power named 'shape change' ..but people need to stop looking at it like that. ..let's call 'shape change' Power #1.. ..and Perplex will be Power #2, Stealth of course becomes Power B (:D )

Power #1 makes it so that you have a one in six chance to not be attacked.

While having Power #2 and Power B makes it so you can't be attacked while moving through hindering terain, and you can pump up your damage/attack/movement/range...whichever.

Neither scenerio really displays Mystiques abilities to their full potential. The first one is rather weak. I'd much have the second. (Use Perplex to 'trick the enemy in letting their defences down' I.E. -1 to Defense.) All in all, I think she was done the best way possible, under the current rules and powers.

People put too much emphasis on the term, 'shape change'.

In the end, it needs to be let go.. heh.. that's her powers, like them or not. (I can't see how anyone that actually likes Mystique would want her to lose the two nice powers she did get, for a rather lame power like Shape change.)

In any case.. enjoy your gaming, ta.


[Edit, below.]

In responce to the post above. I too am an old Brotherhood fan, when it comes to the comics.

But having a one in six chance of slipping past the enemy? They in no way shows the extent of Mystique's ability.

The name fits, the ability that comes with the power doesn't.

Taibak
03/03/2003, 19:13
I have to agree with Gorrack on Mystique. Shape Change is, in my opinion, a bad power. Not only is it fairly weak (a 1 in 6 chance doesn't justify its existence), it's a poor representation of what a lot of shape shifters in the Marvel universe do. Mystique is a great example of this. As I understand the character, there really are two sides to her. There's the commando/assassin Mystique and there's the impersonator Mystique. The impersonator Mystique is the one where Shape Change makes the most sense *but* the problem is it's not something she generally does on the battlefield. That is, she tends to fight in her natural blue-skinned fight and doesn't tend to, say, start looking like Captain America just to stop Hawkeye from shooting at her. Would she do it to manipulate someone into working for her? Yes, but you can't really show that well in the game.

On the other hand, what she would do in her commando/assassin mode is use her powers more creatively. For instance, she would change shapes to help her sneak into position (Stealth - no reason to fire at the kid hiding in the bush). She would use her powers for misdirection and confusion (Perplex). More importantly, she would rely on her wits instead of her powers to get her through a fight (Perplex again - Outwit and Leadership would also have been justified). She's good enough in a fight that she doesn't need to use her shape shifting to get through it.

As for Apocalypse, yes, his numbers could have been a little beefier, but keep in mind, he's not that weak. As you point out, his Phasing, Plasticity, Super Strength, and Perplex make him *nasty* indoors.

Taibak

bizzaro
03/03/2003, 19:15
I hear ya.

I wouldn't want her to lose perplex/stealth (great combo) ... I was just saying it would have been cool if a click of shape change was snuck in there. Comes from reading too much x-men I suppose. I had the same type of gripe when the IC Spiderman didn't have supersenses.

I did just see another thread where Jon L addressed a similiar post and gave a very similiar answer to yours. Regardless, looking forward to trying her out.

Billy Jack
03/03/2003, 19:18
Real solid post man, very well thought out. I agree with you on many of the points you made. I am still reserving judgement however untill all the pieces are on the warriors section. From what I have seen however I think the set is gold.

Manchine
03/03/2003, 19:18
LEts see X-plosion its good my complaint is 19 xmen related figs way to many. Of course thats my only complaint.

Elektra - is perfectly fine. Go ahead and play her thats 160 points more for me.

Apocalypse - looks perfect for a unique. Sorry but any old timers will tell ya Apocalypse was not that powerful in the 80's and early 90's. He was not the beast I guess you see now. 15 defense is perfect. How many times do you see Apocalypse dodge. Never!! At least not when I saw him. He'd make a shield out of his hand to protect himself and take the hits.

So he did a great job on every figure. There is no need for an explanation for Apocalypse

bizzaro
03/03/2003, 19:23
Originally posted by Taibak
The impersonator Mystique is the one where Shape Change makes the most sense *but* the problem is it's not something she generally does on the battlefield. That is, she tends to fight in her natural blue-skinned fight and doesn't tend to, say, start looking like Captain America just to stop Hawkeye from shooting at her.

Actually ... did did do exactly this is an Avengers Annual, with the exception that she took on the appearance of the Wasp.

:p

I do agree with your point though ... Shape Change as is, is not a good representation of her potential .....

Dormammu
03/03/2003, 19:25
Manchine, you Kiss-up you. :)

Gorrack
03/03/2003, 19:28
Manchine- problems with apocalypse are beyond just the low defense. Yes, he takes hits, but Defense doesnt mean if he can dodge or not. It means how hard it is to HURT him. Sure you may connect right on, but it can also mean you didnt hit solidly enough to hurt him. Or perhaps it could mean in his case that you managed to get a shot in before he transformed his shield. Juggernaut never dodges, yet his Vet has an 18 defense. I think that proves my point on his defense. He is immortal, yet has I believe 3 clicks of Invulnerability. Im not so sure about you, but I dont see him THAT much easier to hurt than even Juggernaut.

Also, he can polymorph his limbs and body...how can that NOT be enough to justify him being able to hit at a good range? Ive seen him do some pretty nifty things with that before. Super Strength is fine. I can even live with the 10 attack rating myself. Seeing how it doesnt drop at all basically. 3 damage...fine too I guess. Its the range and defense all around that bothers me the most. Also, Apocalypse has converted people as his Four Horsemen...how is this not enough to give him Mind Control? Id probably have given him + 2 defense to start off, a few extra clicks of Invuln, an 8 range and drop the opening clicks of Phasing in exchange for Mind Control and than Id have no beef with him. Perhaps even dropping Leadership for more opening slots of Perplex.

Dormammu
03/03/2003, 19:30
Sorry if anyone has already mentioned this elsewhere, but when I saw their would be a "conartist" I thought, "great, thugs in suits to go along with Kingpin," and not a prostitute. Otherwise, some useful figures to model for civilians to get in the way of the heros.

bizzaro
03/03/2003, 19:36
For an immortal who has an eternity to scheme and plan, I probably would have given Apocalypse a click of outwit somewhere. The defense is a bit lower than I expected ... the rest of him looks pretty good.

Its wierd ... if I compare him to vet magneto he seems about right ... but if I compare him to vet thor he does seem underpowered.

the itsy bit
03/03/2003, 19:37
stealth and perplex is good, but I'm still missing something (regeneration ?) more "changing" powers.
V costs +/- 50 points and I can't really see why I wouldn't play the Rookie over her !?

Destiny is great !BTW

Manchine
03/03/2003, 19:40
Well like I said this is a Unique. Cyclops has beaten him. In the 80's and Early 90's he was a push over. He didnt hit people unless they were really close. Even then he would mostly make a shield taking hits as he ran away. Or just got knocked back. Smashed into a wall and then he would pick himself up. He was far from invulnerable. At first it was hard to hurt him. But a few blasts from Cycke and down he was. Havok and Cycke literally pounded him unconsious on to many occassions. This is a unique and obvious from his 80's/early 90's run.

Now if this was a R/E/V I could see your arguement.

Sorry Defense is mostly about dodging. Now for people who are really invulnerable (Hulk on up, and no Colossus doesnt even fit that bill) defense also would be for how invulnerable they are.

bizzaro
03/03/2003, 19:41
This has probably already been asked ...but does anyone know if the spiderman and green goblin of this set have the same color as the spiderman and hobgoblin of IC?

Do we indeed have our first AE triangle?

I had heard that the daredevil and Hand bases weren't the brown of the Daredevil/Bullseye bases of IC.

bizzaro
03/03/2003, 19:46
I figured that defense was a combo of dodge and being hard to injure .... for example ... the hulk has a pretty good defense at 17 (with inv) and you certainly don't think of him as agile ....

Manchine
03/03/2003, 19:46
Nope different red for Spidey and GG had Hobs and SPidey.

Yep DD I have heard is the same color as bullseye.

Gorrack
03/03/2003, 19:46
Manchine- im seeing your point about it being a Unique, but unfortunately I do not see a R/E/V version of Apocalypse in the near future =*( Its still a shame to see a cool villain made so weakly. The Apocalypse of current times, and of the Tv show would obviously be incredibly powerful. And the comment made about how he should have outwit it is true that he has spent eternity making plots, so i think that would be a very viable ability.Im still waiting for both an Apocalypse and a Magneto that shows off their TRUE power ( being some of the marvel universes strongest villains ) as I KNOW either one of them can go head to head with Doc Doom any day.

Manchine
03/03/2003, 19:48
Oh gosh yes the Apocalypse of now would probable be close to 200 points. He is insanely powerful now.

Yep they could go Head to Head with Doom. Still lose. Everyone loses to DOOM. Unless its his robot. ;) ;) :p :D

Gorrack
03/03/2003, 19:51
I never really knew much of Apocalypse besides from the TV Show ( its what got me hooked on comics :P ) and from recently. I do have some pretty good knowledge of older x-plots from alot of the comics I have, but i was always associating Apocalypse as the god he is now. lol. SO if this is the older Apocalypse, than we are fine, and I still cant wait to bust him out in some Indoor maps either :P Phasings underrated as heck as it is. Ill give him a try and hope he isnt TOO bad. lol.

Manchine
03/03/2003, 19:55
I know on a Indoor map this Apocalypse is going to rule. Did you notice his attack never drops below 8?

Gambit
03/03/2003, 19:56
Vet. Gambit- for only 51 ponts w/perplex,RCE, and EE all is good. Also, you can perplex guys to do 4 clicks of damage, getting a character out of invulnerability, and then have Gambit in stealth and EE the guy and everyone around him!! Then if he is pused he can possibly do 4 clicks of damage w/RCE. My favorite character for a great price and great dial. Only if he had 4 KO's instead of 5 or 6. It's all good!!!

Gorrack
03/03/2003, 20:00
In Indoors, Apocalypse may be one of the best figures inthe game, even capable of winning tournements if played right. ( Those small rooms are PERFECT for a 4 range only when placed right :P ) ( as are building tops :P )

As for Gambit, You dont have both Perplex and RCE at the same time, and even if you did, he couldnt hit for 4 as RCE says the character cant be affected by any ability besides RCE so that shuts that down. Gambit is still a nice peice though, and despite only a 6 range, he is still good, as i know from experience Robin can be a beast. ( and he has 6 range )

The Beast is also a very effective peice IMO, and worth considering for alot of armies.