Sentinels & Capturing

[benthicex]

In regards to capturing opposing characters:

Can a Sentinel capture an opponent who has battle fury?

Can a Sentinel capture an opponent who is on elevated terrain when he is on the ground?

Thanks in advance for your help!

[shin-goji]

Originally posted by benthicex
In regards to capturing opposing characters:

Can a Sentinel capture an opponent who has battle fury?

Yes, absolutely.

Can a Sentinel capture an opponent who is on elevated terrain when he is on the ground?

Thanks in advance for your help!

If he is base to base with the figure, then I BELIEVE so.

[metzgarob]

capture somone with BF?
im not sure but i dont think so but i could be wrong

capture someone on roof when sentinel is on ground?
yes you can as long as they are adjacent

[shin-goji]

You cannot carry someone with BF, but you can capture them.

[metzgarob]

but hey shin-goji is a judge and im not:D :D :D

[shin-goji]

I am far from an expert, but I think I use Sentinels more than anyone else in HCRealms, if not Clixdom. :)

[Tsannik]

Shin is correct....

A figure with Battle Fury can be captured (with a successful roll) by a Sentinel/Sinestro.

capture someone on roof when sentinel is on ground?


As everyone has said, the Sentinel and the opposing figure must be adjacent.

Since squares on Elevated terrain are not adjacent to squares on Grounded terrain. Then the figures are not adjacent. Therefore, a figure on the roof cannot be captured by a grounded Sentinel.

[shin-goji]

Tsannik, I thought Sentinels were considered soaring for movement, because of their large size. So the Sentinel would have to be on the same elevated terrain?

[Shibitz54321]

I also have some questions about capturing. Does it take the sentinal an action to pick some one up? To drop some one off.
Also I have heard that if you pick some one up, then put them down, he is your figure for the game? You dont keap him but you get to use him as if he was a friendly figure?
Heres an example

IE1 - My sentinal is 4 squares away from herculese. I make amove action and move ajacent to him, in the same action can i attempt to pick him up? If I can pick him up can i continue my move

IE2 - I have steel in sentinal's hand. I move the sentianl back to my starting possision. Can I drop steel and get the 2x points? or do i have to wait until next turn.

IE3 - I have superman in my hand, now I put him down, can I make him do an action or use him as if he were my own?

[metzgarob]

Originally posted by Shibitz54321
Does it take the sentinal an action to pick some one up? To drop some one off.
Also I have heard that if you pick some one up, then put them down, he is your figure for the game? You dont keap him but you get to use him as if he was a friendly figure?


1)it takes an action to capture AND an action to move back to your starting area, hence removing the charachter from the game

2)NO, NO. you do not gain control of a captured charachter ever once successfully captured the opposing charachter is removed from the game. the only way to control an opposing charachter is to mind control them wich sentinel/sinestro cant do

[Tsannik]

Ok... the Sentinel/Sinestro isn't Soaring. A Sentinel ignores terrain modifiers for movement, as if soaring.

So, basically... what that should've said is that the Sentinel is considered to be Hovering. For the Sentinel.Sinestro to capture a figuer on the roof, it would have to make a Close Combat attack. Close Combat attacks can only be made to adjacent squares. Etc. Etc.


Does it take the sentinal an action to pick some one up?
A Sentinel/Sinestro can carry one friendly figure as per the normal carrying rules (which do not require a token, per se). This figure must be dropped off at the end of the move (the move action does require a token)

My sentinal is 4 squares away from herculese. I make amove action and move ajacent to him, in the same action can i attempt to pick him up? If I can pick him up can i continue my move The Sentinel/Sinestro would be immediately stopped as soon as he comes adjacent to an opposing figure. Place a token and end its turn. On the next turn, the Sentinel/Sinestro can make the capture attack as normal.

So, no, you could not move and capture in the same turn. Capturing is a special Close Combat action.

I have steel in sentinal's hand. I move the sentianl back to my starting possision. Can I drop steel and get the 2x points? or do i have to wait until next turn.

Ensure that the entire Sentinel's base is within the Starting area. 'Jailing' the captured figure does take an action by itself. So, if you move back to the starting area, your turn would end. Next turn, you would declare that you are 'jailing' the captured figure. This is an action and requires a token, also.

I have superman in my hand, now I put him down, can I make him do an action or use him as if he were my own?

Captured figures cannot be voluntarily released (except in the starting area to be 'jailed'). Besides, you're Capturing the figure, not Mind Controlling them.

So, no. You could not voluntarily put Superman down and make him do an action.

[shin-goji]

Thanks Tsannik!

[Xanth]

I hate to say this but Tsannik is incorrect. As outlined in the Sinestro/Sentinel rules, because of its size a grounded Sentinel can close combat an elevated and soaring figure.

From the Sentinels rule sheet

"Sentinels and characters on elevated terrain can fire on each other as if they were on the same terrain level. Soaring characters and characters on elevated terrain can make ranged or close combat attacks against a Sentinel per the standard rules. Soaring characters and Sentinels can use their full range to attack. "

The 2nd sentence is the important part and Chapeau clarified that it works both ways, against the Sent and for the Sent. A grounded Sent can attack and be attacked by an elevated fig using close attack if the two are in map-adjacent squares even if the figs are not game-adjacent. I wish they had used another term than adjacent.

[shin-goji]

Whew! I knew I wasn't high on gooberballs. Thanks Xanth!

[Tsannik]

Alrighty.... that's it again.....

Per that standard rules:
Close combat represents hand-to-hand and melee weapon attacks.
Your character must be adjacent to and on the same elevation level as a target to perform a close combat action.

I know that they can do all the ranged combat they want, but WTF... this is strike 2 today for chapeau in my book.

The quote for the Sentinel rules doesn't explicitly state.....

Well, good thing that was included in the most recent fricking FAQ!
I'm really not wanting to be the catalyst, but I want to be the new Rules Arbitrator.... like yesterday.
I wonder how I'd go about doing that. Maybe get all of HCRealms to start a petition?

[Xanth]

Here's the ruling by Chapeau dated Feb 7 and it was a response to a question entitled Sinestro,Sentinels and Soaring from yours truly.

"It works both ways, Xanth. Sentinels and Sinestros can use close/ranged combat attacks against both soaring and elevated characters.

Chapeau"

I know the text wasn't the greatest which is why I asked Chapeau-sama.

Hope this helps.

[Tsannik]

Great... basically another rule has been changed.

Wouldn't it have been simplier to keep Close Combat as per the rules in the rulebook? I understand the Sentinel/Sinestro is a special figure that gets special consideration, but to change the most basic of rules regard his play......

Like I said....

Good thing that was in the FAQ.

[Xanth]

I really don't have a problem with him being able to do this. I think the bigfigs need all the help they can get and giving a special type of fig special abilities is fine IMHO, in the same vein as certain powers override general game mechanics. I just wish they would write clearer.

[Tsannik]

This not only gives the BigFig some help, but also those regular figures on the Elevated terrain.... so now his help has been negated.

I used to understand that the Sentinel could attack an Elevated figure as if the Sentinel were elevated (no more needing the elevated figure to be on the edge).

I understand that the Elevated figure can make a Close Combat Action against the Sentinel. As per the rules, he can only make this attack if the Sentinel were adjacent and on the same elevation (which are essentially one and the same). To allow the elevated figure to make a Close Combat action across the blocking terrain to the Sentinel on grounded terrain......

Even Chapeau's quote there isn't very clear....

[shin-goji]

Where does the blocking terrain aspect come in?

[AbeNookie]

Yea, I dont follow the blocking terrain thing either! If the edge of a roof was blocking then you wouldnt be able to shoot from it.

Also:

The Sentinel/Sinestro would be immediately stopped as soon as he comes adjacent to an opposing figure.

Is this correct or can the sentinel ignore grounded players as if he were soaring. (I know in that example he wanted to attack the mentioned opposing figure, but under other circumstances, does he have to stop?)

Thanks :)

[Fuzzy]

The rules for making a ranged attack from elevated terrain to grounded terrain specify that the only square of blocking terrain the LOF can pass through is the square the attacker occupies. So yes, the edge of the roof is blocking terrain.

[Tsannik]

alrighty... if the Elevated fig is on the edge of the roof

and the Sentinel is on the ground in a square next to the elevated figure....

He could make a Ranged attack no problem...

The Blocking terrain comes in the fact the the Sentinel and the Elevated fig are on different elevations....

Supposed to be that a Close Combat Action can only be made if the figures are 1) Adjacent and 2) on the same elevation.

The ruling here basically creates a new rule for this situation.

The Sentinel/Sinestro would be immediately stopped as soon as he comes adjacent to an opposing figure
As per the rules...
A Sentinel moves per the standard rules. The player chooses any square adjacent to the Sentinel to begin counting for movement. A Sentinel ignores terrain modifiers for movement, as if soaring.
I cannot find anything specific for opposing figures, so by the standard rules, he would be stopped.

[Badges2]

Can my Sentinel capture your Sinestro?

[shin-goji]

Until the FAQ says otherwise, yes.

[Tsannik]

Shin is correct.....

By the rules.... a Sentinel can capture a Sinestro and vice versa.

No true clarification has been made yet, but don't be surprised when they are no longer able to do this.

As no big fig is supposed to be able to be captured.

[shin-goji]

Originally posted by Tsannik

I cannot find anything specific for opposing figures, so by the standard rules, he would be stopped.

Sorry Tsannik. Sentinels and Sinestro Constructs do not have to make breakaway rolls, it's one of their many immunities. If they move as though they were soaring they would ignore grounded or hovering characters anyway, right?

[Tsannik]

You're right...they don't have to make breakaway... it's automatic

But there is nothing there that says they can ignore the effects of other figures when moving...

It only specifically states that they will ignore terrain modifiers for movement... not opposing figures.

They should still be stopped when coming adjacent to an opposing figure.

[Badges2]

Off subject, but...

I want to applaud Tsannik and Shin-Goji for their conduct. I have never ever seen them saying "You're wrong, stupid" like some other posters do. They always try to discuss the problem out and come to a mutual understanding. They always appoligize when correcting the other and end their replys with "right?" You two are the prime examples of what everyone should be like here at HCRealms.

This is, after all, a discussion board. It is meant for people to come and reasonably discuss topics. I have seen far too many replies saying that "Your team sucks" or "Quit whining, you scummy loser". I just wish that all of us could debate as calmly and friendly as you two. :)

[Spidersense]

Its called respect, which these two have for each other. It goes a long way.

[Tsannik]

Actually...we PM obscenities to each other....I want to be able to have a read receipt so I *know* he got them....


:p

j/k

[shin-goji]

Respect? I thought it was God-given fear of Tsannik, who's Post-Per-Day rate I am trying to beat :)

On topic: Doesn't a soaring figure ignore figure bases. If so would not that or the Sentinel's immunity to breakaway be a precident for not needing to stop at figure bases?

[Tsannik]

Well, yeah...

But from what I can glean... a Sentinel is not soaring.

It is a Hovering figure that can ignore terrain effects.

[Spidersense]

Originally posted by shin-goji
Respect? I thought it was God-given fear of Tsannik, who's Post-Per-Day rate I am trying to beat :)



Keep going and you can get your very own Tsannik LE.

[shin-goji]

Hey, I'm up to 5.34 posts per day :)

[AbeNookie]

Going to repost this as a seperate question since it has nothing to do with capturing :rolleyes: