Do You Believe in Magic? [Archive]

WizKidsNECA

01/10/2011, 19:20

<img src="http://www.wizkidsgames.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Shadowpact-Front.jpg" width="250px" style="padding-right:5px" align="left">Hello HeroClix’ers!
Our latest installment in our series of DC 75th Anniversary Print and Play elements is none other than the Shadowpact ATA Throughout history, groups of mystics have banded together to champion seemingly “lost causes”, these magic-users have collectively been known as the “Shadowpact”.[...]

[Read More on WizKidsGames.com (http://www.wizkidsgames.com/2011/01/do-you-believe-in-magic/)]

DeGei

01/10/2011, 20:43

Ignore Mystics for 1 Point. INSANE!

Contingency Plan

01/10/2011, 20:46

That is insane. We will see a lot of Shadowpact teams played because of this.

fastcat99

01/10/2011, 20:49

Woo-hoo! That's pretty darn neat! Considering that some of the characters have mystics themselves. Double jeopardy for the other guy!

fox007

01/10/2011, 20:50

1 point for ignoring mystic feedback.... YES PLEASE!!!!!!!

fox007

01/10/2011, 20:54

I just realised this ATA makes Nightmaster the ultimate mystic killer for a mere 70 pts

MattPetersen

01/10/2011, 21:03

WOW!!
That's insane!!!

Superfly

01/10/2011, 21:06

Why does the actual card not show up at the WK site? Nice to see it on this forum, so at least I know what it is, but there is no picture like the one above at the WK site.

michiganj24

01/10/2011, 21:08

I hope this is not the end of the Atas C'mon Sinestro Corps and Secret Six

SLVRSR4

01/10/2011, 21:11

charlesdward

01/10/2011, 21:12

OmygodomygodOMYGOD!!

*runs around screaming like a 12 year old girl at a Bieber show*

Like I needed any more motivation to play Shadowpact teams. Man, I overplayed them even before DC75. At this point, I'm tempted to say I'll only play Shadowpact from here on in! Seriously, one freaking point per character??

I... I need a few minutes here...

2 Gun Kid

01/10/2011, 21:18

I called it....look it up, I called it.

Seriously...I cant wait to have Shadowpact take down Mystic Doom. Shame they couldnt ignore Quience also.

Grumpygoat

01/10/2011, 21:29

That is AWESOME. AND ONLY ONE POINT!!!! The biggest problem with it is that it is very situational for the Shadowpact characters and very abusable for those that can COPY alternate team abilities. I can see detective chimp on some crazy teams now....or...Nightshade.

Detective Chimp isn't a great wildcard choice, as he only brings the Alternate Team Ability to the table. Nightshade, however, is a great choice. Shadowpact on its own kind of sucks - you may or may not ever face Mystics at a tournament. But when your wildcards have a Mystic to copy from, paying one more point for completely ignoring Mystics if you run into them? Now that's pretty grand.

Wilx

01/10/2011, 21:34

Awesome and very accurate

Dask234

01/10/2011, 21:41

Perfectioness!

Pepsirox08

01/10/2011, 21:49

very abusable for those that can COPY alternate team abilities.

And who does this?? Did not know we can copy ATAs..

Grumpygoat

01/10/2011, 21:50

And who does this?? Did not know we can copy ATAs..

This was one of the rule changes around the Brave & the Bold.

Slade Wilson

01/10/2011, 21:53

So what about when they take on the suicide squad or the batman enemys teams? It does nothing for them. :)

Its cool and all I just dont think it's all that.

Pepsirox08

01/10/2011, 21:56

This was one of the rule changes around the Brave & the Bold.

oh my... so i can have Cosmic Spidey copy Bullseye's thunderbolted ATA to Mystics??

SLVRSR4

01/10/2011, 22:05

Yes, yes you can.

And as for your previous point Grumpy, I admit, but having a figure like Nightshade that is providing two great team abilities for copying puposes is FANTASTIC and maybe a preferred choice, but it paints a HUGE target on her back which is not quite as durable as the high defense and traited super senses that the chimp has. Plus, he gets uber perplex for mystics later on...a proven tournament favorite.

mountaindood

01/10/2011, 22:34

If you use the ATA, doesn't the Mystics TA get ignored?

Grumpygoat

01/10/2011, 22:37

If you use the ATA, doesn't the Mystics TA get ignored?

The team ability on the Shadowpact member? No!

The7ofDiamonds

01/10/2011, 22:39

Can you say "copyable by wildcards"? For one point! F' yes.

gudda

01/10/2011, 22:45

I just realised this ATA makes Nightmaster the ultimate mystic killer for a mere 70 pts

Yeah and because of that , one of my Blades is going onto his dial. I cant wait to play my moded Nightstalkers team now. I should try and find shadow pact members to be all the characters from Nightstalkers now .. intead of Morbius for Hannible King , and Ben Daimio for Frank Drake.

dkrmguy

01/10/2011, 23:23

Excellent, this ATA is a no brainer. Thanks

Roderic_Cliche

01/10/2011, 23:39

Yeowza. Looks like the Arachnos members and the Crossgen folks are going to start seeing some more play. :)

Petros76

01/10/2011, 23:41

Very cool ATA. I can't wait to see the others.

Deathblossom

01/10/2011, 23:43

So what about when they take on the suicide squad or the batman enemys teams? It does nothing for them. :)

Its cool and all I just dont think it's all that.

If you're going to play a Shadowpact character anyway, how can you seriously consider not paying an extra point for this?

oh my... so i can have Cosmic Spidey copy Bullseye's thunderbolted ATA to Mystics??

Sure. I don't know if you'd make a lot of friends doing that, though.

spike1138

01/10/2011, 23:46

Sweeeeeeeeettttttt..... :devious:

gatharion

01/11/2011, 01:17

Boo-ya! I've been playing Shadow Pact teams since Collateral Damage and I was thrilled the roster finally got finished with DC75. This is just beautiful beautiful gravy.

One of my favorite teams I ever played was a B.P.R.D./Shadowpact cross-over teams. With this ATA that team just got all the better!

I hope this is not the end of the Atas C'mon Sinestro Corps and Secret Six

I'm still pulling for an Easy Company ATA myself!

That is AWESOME. AND ONLY ONE POINT!!!! The biggest problem with it is that it is very situational for the Shadowpact characters

It is indeed very situational, but for only 1 point per character that is A-Okay!

I just realised this ATA makes Nightmaster the ultimate mystic killer for a mere 70 pts

True enough. Yesterday I gave my new Shadowpact figures a test drive against a Teen Titans team. I distinctly recall getting a nice 5 on my blades roll with Nightmaster against his (Mystical-keyworded) Osiris.
:devious:

Pentarch

01/11/2011, 01:23

We don't play Golden Age often.
But this has made my love for Ghost Widow that much more.
Go go gadget Spy team.

elfholme

01/11/2011, 01:28

That is AWESOME. AND ONLY ONE POINT!!!! The biggest problem with it is that it is very situational for the Shadowpact characters and very abusable for those that can COPY alternate team abilities. I can see detective chimp on some crazy teams now....or...Nightshade.

Who can copy ATAs?

Edit - just saw the responses. Wow, that is a really good ruling for the Society members that were given the Calculator TA. It makes Cosmic Spidey even more sickening though.

ophyjgjhnfn

01/11/2011, 01:55

Very cool. This is my next team to play, against my earlier profession to play a team with the new SR Superman. And SC ATA? Dude, I'm so in for that one.

brevard321

01/11/2011, 02:36

Borken!!1@!

I'd much rather see some adjustment of actual proper Team Abilities and making sure they go on the right characters

(ie DC&% Aquaman with all kinds of JLA keywords, but no JLA TA),

than more very low-point Alternate Team Abilities which can be abused to no end.

I don't understand this one at all.

happyoptimistic88

01/11/2011, 02:46

Why does the actual card not show up at the WK site? Nice to see it on this forum, so at least I know what it is, but there is no picture like the one above at the WK site.

The Wizkids site has had problem for the last 3-4 days or so, unfortunately. I guess the server is having serious problems or they could be getting ready for a major update; who knows.

bluesummers

01/11/2011, 03:36

That is insane. We will see a lot of Shadowpact teams played because of this.

Based on the ATA, I'd say you were correct.

Based on the figures, I'd bet you are wrong.
Hey, 4 modern figs to choose from! One of them can do more than 2 damage!

Agreed that we'll see this on wildcards.

Slayer_Xtreme

01/11/2011, 03:37

I love this ATA I have no problem spending the extra point a figure just in case I fight some mystic packing players. Priced perfectly.

T. Paul Stiles

01/11/2011, 03:45

This was one of the rule changes around the Brave & the Bold.

Just to clarity; My BPRD characters can wildcard not only the mystics TA, but also the Shadowpact ATA? Does that make my Hellboy, Dr Strange, Shadowpact team keyword theme team?

Captain Krueger

01/11/2011, 04:08

THe card is gone from the site. Does that mean that the first release was a mistake and that the actual card will change slightly in, for example, cost (or to add that widlcards cannot use it) ?
Cause 1 point for what it does seems a little underpriced. To me at least

gatharion

01/11/2011, 04:47

We don't play Golden Age often.
But this has made my love for Ghost Widow that much more.
Go go gadget Spy team.

Ghost Widow is freakin awesome (I FINALLY got one myself last month), buuuut, I'm not getting the correlation between this ATA and Ghost Widow.

Just to clarity; My BPRD characters can wildcard not only the mystics TA, but also the Shadowpact ATA? Does that make my Hellboy, Dr Strange, Shadowpact team keyword theme team?
Yes Hellboy can copy the Mystics TA AND the Shadowpact ATA, but you're only getting the theme bonus if you're getting a generic theme from the Mystical keyword. Wildcarding doesn't give you keywords.

BTW, I've been pushing to get more Hellboy/BPRD clix and have suggested a few times this exact thing as either a trait for Hellboy or an ATA for the BPRD.

Cause 1 point for what it does seems a little underpriced. To me at least
Seeing as how you get absolutely no benefit against the vast majority of figures, I disagree about it being undercosted. Odds are against you actually benefitting from this, the only reason to use it is because it is so cheap.
Based on the ATA, I'd say you were correct.

Based on the figures, I'd bet you are wrong.
Hey, 4 modern figs to choose from! One of them can do more than 2 damage!

Agreed that we'll see this on wildcards.

You, I agree with. I loves me the Shadowpact, but they are a hard team to play. Damage output is the least of my problems. The utter lack of move-and-attack and soft/low defenses have always been my downfall with them.

Okay, they're not COMPLETELY without move-attack, but Nightshade's whopping SEVEN attack value (while transporter attacking) hardly counts.

Detective Chimp is a pretty sweet figure all on his own and I expect to see him get a good amount of play, but he can't give wildcards that coveted Mystics TA as well. Nightshade however...

VanisherPunisher

01/11/2011, 05:13

There are only 45 characters with the Mystics team ability (21 in Modern Age), so this is very situational and as such, definately not undercosted.

Edit - just saw the responses. Wow, that is a really good ruling for the Society members that were given the Calculator TA. It makes Cosmic Spidey even more sickening though.

It really doesn't help Calculators at all, since The Society ATA can't be copied by wild cards.

Phoenix_Icewing

01/11/2011, 05:14

Ghost Widow is freakin awesome (I FINALLY got one myself last month), buuuut, I'm not getting the correlation between this ATA and Ghost Widow.

Arachnos TA works just like the Mystics TA- but ISN'T Mystics, so isn't ignored, is what i'm guessing

T. Paul Stiles

01/11/2011, 05:42

Yes Hellboy can copy the Mystics TA AND the Shadowpact ATA, but you're only getting the theme bonus if you're getting a generic theme from the Mystical keyword. Wildcarding doesn't give you keywords.

BTW, I've been pushing to get more Hellboy/BPRD clix and have suggested a few times this exact thing as either a trait for Hellboy or an ATA for the BPRD.

And I pay the 1 point per BPRD character wildcarding it too, yeah?

Quebbster

01/11/2011, 06:06

And I pay the 1 point per BPRD character wildcarding it too, yeah?

No. You only assign the ATA to figures with the actual keyword. Wildcards copy ATAs just like regular team abilities.

T. Paul Stiles

01/11/2011, 06:10

No. You only assign the ATA to figures with the actual keyword. Wildcards copy ATAs just like regular team abilities.

Thanks for that :)

tiguylerobot

01/11/2011, 08:14

can we get clarification about arachnos, we know is not mystic, but, just in case, can a judge can clarify this for everyone

Glen Quagmire

01/11/2011, 08:22

Just to clarity; My BPRD characters can wildcard not only the mystics TA, but also the Shadowpact ATA? Does that make my Hellboy, Dr Strange, Shadowpact team keyword theme team?

It might be a theme team. Keep in mind Nightshade does not have the mystical keyword. So you're theme with everyone except her.

reklawyad

01/11/2011, 08:24

Not a bad little card. It takes anyone with a shadowpact keyword and makes them just a tad bit more useful. Undercosted I say no to that as others have mentioned it's not as powerful for just those members, and for WC teams again if your opponent is not playing any mystics, you just used points that go no where, as well as eating up your one ATA slot.

I see this card being used with CSM teams that are not cosmic themed to avoid the mystics feedback, and other mystical teams just because they have a point or two and shadowpact seems to be the only ata they can use at the time.

gatharion

01/11/2011, 08:50

It might be a theme team. Keep in mind Nightshade does not have the mystical keyword. So you're theme with everyone except her.

Unless the Units section is mistaken, only the Hellboys from the Indy set (not the more recent action pack) have the Mystical keyword.

can we get clarification about arachnos, we know is not mystic, but, just in case, can a judge can clarify this for everyone

Well, I'm a judge, but I'm not a rules magistrate. Even so, I'm 99.99999999999999% sure that the Shadowpact ATA doesn't mean diddly when dealing with either Arachnos or Crossgen.

Quebbster

01/11/2011, 08:59

Well, I'm a judge, but I'm not a rules magistrate. Even so, I'm 99.99999999999999% sure that the Shadowpact ATA doesn't mean diddly when dealing with either Arachnos or Crossgen.
And you are correct, too.

Thrumble Funk

01/11/2011, 09:33

Wow! I dig it!

And for anyone who runs Mystics WC abuse teams...er...sorry?

Hero_guy

01/11/2011, 10:49

scottthoude

01/11/2011, 11:46

Now if only the team actually added up to a nice 100 point value

reklawyad

01/11/2011, 11:53

Unless the Units section is mistaken, only the Hellboys from the Indy set (not the more recent action pack) have the Mystical keyword.

Well, I'm a judge, but I'm not a rules magistrate. Even so, I'm 99.99999999999999% sure that the Shadowpact ATA doesn't mean diddly when dealing with either Arachnos or Crossgen.

it's that .0000000000001 that I'm not so sure about hehehehe Kidding of course!

spider_ham

01/11/2011, 11:55

One of the best ATAs out there.

Black Alice and Nightshade would be the most ideal Shadowpact characters to assign the ATA, imho. Detective Chimp is the third cheapest (after V Ragman), but not as versatile as NS or BA.

A Suicide Squad theme team (including wild cards) would be interesting:

Nightshade + Shadowpact ATA (51)
V Persuader (129)
JL Captain Boomerang (78)
Multiplex (30)

TOTAL: 288

or

Nightshade + Shadowpact ATA (51)
V Persuader (129)
E Captain Cold (68)
U Oracle (27) + ICWO x2 or Brilliant Tactician (47)

TOTAL: 295

gatharion

01/11/2011, 14:06

The down side of this ATA? You never really know if you will ever face a figure/team with Mystics TA.

The up side of this ATA? You're only spending 1pt per (applicable) character on your team as an insurance policy in case of Mystics.

Really nice.

Excellent summation.

Now if only the team actually added up to a nice 100 point value

True, I also wouldn't mind better versions of some of the characters; V Blue Devil has never performed well for me and ends up being a cool 100pts for my opponent.

An errated keyword for Zaurial would sure be nice too.

Phoenix_Icewing

01/11/2011, 15:56

Excellent summation.

True, I also wouldn't mind better versions of some of the characters; V Blue Devil has never performed well for me and ends up being a cool 100pts for my opponent.

An errated keyword for Zaurial would sure be nice too.

I agree 100% on V Blue Devil, he looks great on paper, but he just falls short in practice.
and what errata for Zaurial? he is a Mystical keyword. or was he also part of the Shadowpact- i've only read a little about them, sadly.
on that note, it'd be great if Nightshade had Mystical, too, but... haha.

Nightwing-fan

01/11/2011, 16:03

Anyone who can help the firewall impaired? Of the three ATAs shown so far the only one I have seen is Atlantis. Please.

Phoenix_Icewing

01/11/2011, 16:10

Anyone who can help the firewall impaired? Of the three ATAs shown so far the only one I have seen is Atlantis. Please.

theres a similarly named thread with the images up for the firewall impaired, actually- do a quick search (its near the top of the screen, under home-forum-units area, right below albums by about an inch. search for "shadowpact", and look for the thread titled "Do you beleive in magic... I do- Shadowpact ATA")

EDIT- yes i could just post the link, but the more people who know how to use the search feature, the less duplicate posts, less questions, etc. I believe in educlixin!

gatharion

01/11/2011, 16:34

I agree 100% on V Blue Devil, he looks great on paper, but he just falls short in practice.
and what errata for Zaurial? he is a Mystical keyword. or was he also part of the Shadowpact- i've only read a little about them, sadly.
on that note, it'd be great if Nightshade had Mystical, too, but... haha.

Towards the end of the series Blue Devil had to take a leave of absence from the team and Zaurial took his place.
Zaurial would provide some nice mobility and move/attack for the team.

As for Blue Devil, IMO, one is better off losing the theme bonus and using the experienced version than you are using the vet version.

thebigZZZZZ

01/11/2011, 18:05

no way....no way....wildcarders can use ATA without meeting the required keyword "Shadowpact"?? so the Legion of Super Heroes can fight those Mystics without getting retaliated?

I would prefer the ATA be restricted to only the keyword of anyone with Shadowpact...that makes thing much easier...same thing with what they did with thunderbolts ATA only restricted to anyone with "Thunderbolts" keyword.

Anyway, I like that Shadowpact ATA...and will only apply to the figures with Shadowpact (although Zauriel should have that keyword as he was the last member joining to replace Nightmaster...IIRC).

PsychoHippie

01/11/2011, 19:21

WakandaMan

01/11/2011, 19:54

Ugh...they showed up earlier, but now neither Shadowpact nor Atlantis are showing up for me. :devious:

gatharion

01/11/2011, 20:50

no way....no way....wildcarders can use ATA without meeting the required keyword "Shadowpact"?? so the Legion of Super Heroes can fight those Mystics without getting retaliated?

So long as they're teamed up with a member of the Shadowpact.

It makes sense to me. Why else would the Legion have traveled back in time to consult Detective Chimp if not so they could get his insight on how to avoid the defensive spells of Mordru?
BECAUSE the ATAs are keyword specific there is actually GREATER potential for "comic accuracy"* in wildcarding.

*"accuracy" may be the wrong term. Accuracy in spirit perhaps.

In any case, how does it make MORE sense for the LoSH to suddenly be able to dish out magical feedback damage ala traditional TA copying?

edit: nevermind re: Atlantis