Rogue's competitive value just got a boost...

[phonixinmi]

...with the release of Xplosion! :cool:

The reasoning is primarily due to the number of cheap perplexers that have been added to the mix (Mystique seems to be the best of the bunch).

All of a sudden, if you look at the Vet Rogue, her starting damage value can become a 4 or her AV an 11 with 1 perplexer on the table.

Imo, that has a high likelihood of adding a great deal to her playability in a tournament setting (probably for 300 or 300+ point games).

[Spidersense]

Not to mention having Shadowcat taxi her and letting Rogue charge.

[AZS]

Doesn't pretty much anybody's playability get better with perplex?
With the ironic exception of Firelord (and any other rce, or cce fig).

[Psylockeslover]

I think all the x-men, to some extent, got a boost from this set. As a team, they are all more playable now.

[shin-goji]

Kind of hard to improve on perfection, azs :)

[webhead817]

I think Perplex helps some more than it does others. As mentioned, it isn't always useful for character's with RCE/CCE.

Also, since it doesn't improve your teams defense, character's with higher defenses but lesser attacks tend to benefit more.

I also think one point of damage is more worthwhile than one point of attack value, so character's with decent attack value's but not so great damage will get a bigger boost.

So, if you follow that logic, charcter's like IC Spidey and Ultron will benefit most from Perplex, because it can go straight to damage boosting.

[Psylockeslover]

I also think one point of damage is more worthwhile than one point of attack value, so character's with decent attack value's but not so great damage will get a bigger boost.

Nightcrawler becomes a real threat with Perplex. With 2 Perplexes on damage, he's a monster. (of course, that could apply to anyone I guess)

[Badges2]

With X-Plosion, I think the major question when building teams is this: Do I upgrade my E to V or use the E and add a ConArtist? Sometimes the former, sometimes the latter. A lot of good figures won't see play anymore. Why use the Vet when a Rookie and 2 CAs are cheaper and more effective? On the other hand, alot of bad figures will see play. My Controller is coming out of the bag with a few CAs.

I personally think that every team will have a CA when they first come out. After a while the novelty will die down and people won't use them as much. For example, when I first started I realized that nearly every team benefits by having a medic; so I used to put a medic on every team untill I later figured out that I didn't need it and could use the points better elsewhere. If my team has 3 CAs and yours has 3 CAs, it's pretty much the same game as without, just alot less time consuming.

Con Artists are going to kill the strategy of the game just like Firelord did. People are going to make "cheap," cheesy" teams by using a ton of the little vixens. After a while, others are going to make new teams to with the potential to defeat the CA teams no matter what. Basically, I'm trying to say that the new Con Artists are the Firelords of X-Plosion. (here comes the flaming) Everyone will field them until they realize how much it hurts the spirit of the game. It's no longer any fun, nor is it in any way still competitive. If you have 9 CAs on your 200pt. team, you're pretty much going to win.

I'm not trying to bash or flame anyone or the figure. I think it is a really great piece and I will be fielding 1 or 2 when they first come out. I'm just saying that IMHO, CAs aren't going to be as much fun as everyone thinks they are going to be.

[phonixinmi]

...but don't you think you may be giving CAs just a little too much credit?

If the Warrior section is accurate, their weakness lies in the fact that they have to push to get to their perplex click. In doing so, this makes the overall team slower.

My vote for the perplex piece most likely to see play is rookie Mystique. This is because, like BP and IG before her, she has stealth on the 1st couple of clicks of her dial. Supporting pieces like these greatly benefit from stealth. She also has a range attack of 6 squares; and that's very high for her point cost and for a fig with stealth.

[Badges2]

phonixinmi - I don't think that I'm giving them too much credit. Look at all of the other figs that have to "Hulk Up" - Hawk, Dove, Hulk, etc. There are several figure that see alot of play, even though they have to push first.

I really don't care about fielding a few Con Artist. No one complains when you have a Harley Quinn and Doc Ock on your team. My complain is when people (and I know some that surely are going to) field over 4 - 5. Four is alot of perplexers and five is just too much. But I know that I'm going to eventually go up against 7 or 8 in a 300 pt game.

I like Firelord as character, but I will rarely (if ever) use him in any game because he is so very um... undercostly. Other people use him as a winning piece and that is wrong. I understand that every game's ultimate goal is to win. But bending the rules that much doesn't make it fun for anyone.

I guess I'm afraid. All of my unbeaten teams (I'm not bragging. I think nearly everyone has at least one team that is undefeated.) will be beaten by 8 CA's and a Changling.

[NateTG]

Another big weakness of the Con Artists is that they're pushovers. Sure, they're great on your turn, but your opponent can mow them down quickly and easily.

Consider that when you're fielding a R Con Artist, you're putting 11 points on the field, and then (probably) pushing the Con Artist to the second click. So you've got 13 defense, and 2 clicks untill he dies. Almost every character (including several of the medics) can kill that in one action.

Each Con Artist is essentially a guaranteed 22 point swing in your opponents favor.

In short (10 turn) games, that, combined with the push factor will limit their utility severely.

[RavenProject]

Originally posted by NateTG
Another big weakness of the Con Artists is that they're pushovers. Sure, they're great on your turn, but your opponent can mow them down quickly and easily.

Consider that when you're fielding a R Con Artist, you're putting 11 points on the field, and then (probably) pushing the Con Artist to the second click. So you've got 13 defense, and 2 clicks untill he dies. Almost every character (including several of the medics) can kill that in one action.

Each Con Artist is essentially a guaranteed 22 point swing in your opponents favor.

In short (10 turn) games, that, combined with the push factor will limit their utility severely.

To hear everyone talk, they're not going to wait to push their Con Army. They'll be dusting off their Rookie Blizzard to Pulse Wave them into action.

-J

[webhead817]

Either way, they'll be easy to dispose of by the time they are useful.

Here's the thing, Con Artists might be great to back up a heavy hitter against certain teams, but what about a SHIELD or Skrulls swarm? So what if Ultron's damage is 20, he can only kill one SHIELD Trooper at a time anyway, and meanwhile his backup will get mowed down in a heart beat. There's only so much Perplex that's useful for any one fig, and when limited to 200 or 300 points, I don't forsee wanting to use 1/4 of my points on Con Artists and a Pulse Wave'er.

[deltharius]

And some of us will be dusting off E White Queen and a cheap taxi. Taxi Ms. Frost up, mind control Blizzard, pulse wave again and ... oops! all the perplex went away... so sad...

[Psylockeslover]

And some of us will be dusting off E White Queen and a cheap taxi. Taxi Ms. Frost up, mind control Blizzard, pulse wave again and ... oops! all the perplex went away... so sad...

My E Wt. Queen doesn't have any dust on her......

[deltharius]

My E Wt. Queen doesn't have any dust on her......

Yeah, well ... um, ok, neither does mine. She's just way to useful in general to get dust on her.

[algrim]

Another solid strategy against the army of Rookie Con Artists is anyone with 2-3 arrows. Rookie only keeps Perplex for one click. Boomerang is fairly cheap, has a good chance of hitting, and has three arrows. Now you have three Con Artists who are useless... and don't place them next to each other... Energy Explosion is already a very used and useful power...

As someone else mentioned earlier, just use Pulse Wave... either with his fig or with a Tough Taxi (Booster comes to mind)...

Are they useful? Yes.
Will they be over-used? Yes.
Am I afraid? Not even in the slightest...

[Psylockeslover]

Will they be over-used? Yes.

I think they wiil be over-used a lot at first, but after a few weeks, the over-use will come down. It will still be a useful piece.

[algrim]

You're right... every cheap strategy wanes with time... In our group only one guy really takes Firelord, Invisible Girl isn't used all that often anymore, everything kinda levels off eventually... that's why I don't really sweat it.

[IJIT]

The biggest reason Rogues play value as a figure went up is because she is not the X-mens only flyer now. Now she can do what she was meant to do, bash the enemy. Instead of having to taxi other figures she can hang out in soaring mode. Then she can charge out of soaring mode when she is ready to attack.

[NateTG]

Originally posted by RavenProject


To hear everyone talk, they're not going to wait to push their Con Army. They'll be dusting off their Rookie Blizzard to Pulse Wave them into action.

-J
The tactic certainly appeals to me, but:
In addition to Mind Control issues, the cheapest Pulse Wave character is V Avelanche for 32 points.
Keep in mind that with his 8 attack he isn't exactly guaranteed to hit the Con Artists.
Now, R Harley Quinn costs 27, so 2 R Harley Quinns cost 54 points, and 2 R Con Artists + V Avelanche costs 54 points. Of course, the Harleys are more durable.
So in order to have pulse wave make sense, you'd have to commit 65 points and get at least three perplexers.
Once you get more than 4 perplexers, you start running into Energy Explosion vulnerability problems because you have to pack them in tightly to get the pulse wave to work.

That's a rather sizable commitment considering that for the same number of points you can get
an outwitter (Black Panther), a Probability Controller (Destiny) and a (Para)Medic.

[phonixinmi]

that's an excellent point. Her flexibility has therefore been improved. She can be a hovering taxi or a soaring, charging beatstick!

[the itsy bit]

Originally posted by NateTG
Another big weakness of the Con Artists is that they're pushovers. Sure, they're great on your turn, but your opponent can mow them down quickly and easily.

Consider that when you're fielding a R Con Artist, you're putting 11 points on the field, and then (probably) pushing the Con Artist to the second click. So you've got 13 defense, and 2 clicks untill he dies. Almost every character (including several of the medics) can kill that in one action.



But, the Rookie hookers cost a whopping 11 points !
So ,hmmm yes she can be killed after taking 2 damage all the while your "ignoring" Thor who is standing next to her ?
If you do that you have already lost !
EE can be usefull against them, but I will keep them apart and when you take the bait, I will totally destroy that 1 fig !
let's see: I lose 11 points, you loose at least much much more points !

aboot the action disadvantage: after I push her to perplex, I will never ever have to give her another action !!
(perplex is FREE) and since it has a "range " of 10 they will be out of harms way Unless you use a taxi to get there !!

nope, you will all curse the day the CA's enter the Fire Lord battle field !(well at least FL has EE)