Soar this!! and elevated terrain/LOF

[admironheart]

Hey all,

We ran into a problem last night.

here are some points from the rule book and PAC and FAQ
{correct me if I am wrong}

In all situations A is the ranged attacker, B is the soaring/hovering unit and C is the target. B will always be directly in the LOF of A to C. and no other obstacles/terrain..so basically all 3 arrange in a straight line. "A...B...C"

A and C are grounded and B is soaring...so LOF is blocked.

A and C are both elevated and B is soaring so LOF in NOT blocked...as only elevated figs, terrain block elevated opponents.

A is grounded and C in elevated on an edge. B is hovering{counts as grounded} A CANNOT hit C...correct?

A is elevated on an edge and C is grounded B is hovering{counts as grounded}. A CAN hit C because 'grounded' figures do not block LOF from an elevated attacker.

Now a 'grounded' figure is a Non-flyer or a Hovering figure.

So here is the problem.

If A is Elevated on an edge and C is grounded and B is Soaring, then what??
The Soaring fig is not grounded per se...does he still block LOF??

What if A is grounded and C is elevated on an edge and B is soaring...Does he still block LOF just like between 2 grounded figures in the first example.

It seems they added the 'grounded figure' terminology for elevated terrain but left out anything to do with Soaring figs or elevated soaring figs.

One part of Soaring states that they can only affect other soaring figures...so does that mean grounded figs can Pass through a square with a Soaring figure?? As well as these LOF issuse... it seems quite vague.

thanks

wes

[CyberVenom]

A is grounded and C in elevated on an edge. B is hovering{counts as grounded} A CANNOT hit C...correct?

Correct.

If A is Elevated on an edge and C is grounded and B is Soaring, then what??
The Soaring fig is not grounded per se...does he still block LOF??

No. A can still hit C, unless I'm wrong.

What if A is grounded and C is elevated on an edge and B is soaring...Does he still block LOF just like between 2 grounded figures in the first example.

Yup.

One part of Soaring states that they can only affect other soaring figures...so does that mean grounded figs can Pass through a square with a Soaring figure?? As well as these LOF issuse... it seems quite vague

Nope. Even though a figure is soaring, the physical figure is still in that square.

[admironheart]

the problem I mostly have is the grounded attacker shooting through the soaring figure to hit the elevated target on the edge...and vice versa.


1st: we know that Soaring figures block LOF for grounded to grounded combats.

2nd: we know that hindering and "the important" grounded figures listed as non-flyers and hoverers DO NOT block LOF from the elevated attacker. Blocking terrain acts as normal.

There is Zero mention about Soaring in the 2nd case. So do we default to case #1?

Most of the time if the exception is not stated then the standard rules apply.

The FAQ address the 'grounded' figures...but no mention is made of Soaring figures...it is a void in the rules and faq!

I am of the opinion that soaring figs should block LOF in the 2nd case.

What really bugs me is that when elevated attackers shoot elevated targets...soaring figures DO NOT block LOF, but Elevated Soaring figures DO...WTF!!! that is just bizarre.

wes

[iam_emperor]

Any line of fire that crosses through a figure's base is considered blocked. There is no distinction on this. Elevated attackers can ignore figure bases when shooting grounded figures. With elevated shooting elevated, if you can manage to put a soaring figure (also on elevated) in the way, your line of fire would now contain a figure base and be blocked as well.

[admironheart]

Elevated attackers targeting 'grounded' targets ignore ONLY grounded characters and grounded hindering terrain.

grounded characters are listed as hovering or non-flyers.

you cannot jump to conclusions that grounded figures is a catch all and everything is lumped in there.

elevated attackers follow all normal LOF issues except where noted.

the 2 exceptions are 'grounded' figures and grounded hindering terrain.

wes

[admironheart]

I believe soaring figures can still take knockback damage from hitting the side of a building. We mostly think of buildings being a few stories tall, but since soarers do{am I correct?] take knockback damage from hitting a side of a building...then maybe the elevated building is a tall skys####er 100 stories high.

My point is this..soaring figures do not have to be considered higher than the elevated terrain.

AND soarers DO BLOCK LOF for grounded to grounded.


second bullered point from the faq which I just read under LOF:

1st bullet ..."unless otherwise specified...a square that is occupied by a figure always blocks line of fire"

I think the next specific wording of the 2nd bullet is very indicative of the intent of the rule.:
"For the purpose of line of fire, hovering characters should be considered grounded. Hovering characters do not block line of fire from an elevated attacker."

If soarers are supposed to be exempt: the main rules would have stated that ..."flyers and non-flyers" are grounded figures.
BUT instead it states..." figures that are hovering, or non-flyers" are grounded figures.

I would say that the 1st and 2nd bullets of the faq reinforce the idea that soarers are NOT one of the 2 specified exemptions for attackers from an elevated terrain.

Think about Bullseye on a 20 story building targeting hovering Magneto and Professor X on the ground and along comes soaring Rogue [10 stories high...for farts and giggles] to block his LOF from the elevated position.

In fact it does make sense and would seem to be a deliberate consideration of the rules.

peace

wes