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bill4935
06/07/2011, 15:20
<img src="http://dl.dropbox.com/u/80851/HCRealms.com/201104/bill-review-logo-9.jpg" style="width:200px;padding-right:5px" align="left"><center>Blecch! A rat!!
FEATURING
Vermin</center>

Playing the HeroClix character known as Vermin just makes me want to take a shower. He's a weak, screechy little rat-man creature who works best when surrounded by filth and sewer muck. So what could the upside possibly be?
Read on to find out. Click Full Story below!

bill4935
06/07/2011, 15:20
ws036 E Vermin
Team: No Affiliation
Range: 0 :bolt:
Points: 43
Keywords: Animal, Monster
m-boota-fistd-shieldg-starburst910162910162891628815177152KOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKOKO:g-starburst: Rat Army: Vermin uses Battle Fury. At the beginning of your turn, you may deal 1 damage to each opposing character that occupies hindering terrain and is within 2 squares of Vermin.
<img src="http://dl.dropbox.com/u/80851/HCRealms.com/201104/vermin.jpg" style="width:175px;padding-right:5px" align="left" title="Vermin is a protege of the Kravinoff Modeling Agency. Hair and nails by Mad Hettie. Pants by Banner's House of Shreds.">Vermin has a pretty affordable point cost. But his dial is so short, he can't do a lot for you. Best to focus on the one thing he does best: cowering in fear.

Yes, it's not a pretty way to deal damage. But since Vermin's best click is his third click, and he's already halfway KOed at this point, you can't even let him get seen by the opponent. Stay behind a stronger ally who is adjacent to the enemy, and Vermin can start to deal out damage. My favourite kind of damage: automatic and retaliation-free.

It means ignoring Vermin's Charge or Blades. It means doing some maneuvering to get the right opposing character into hindering terrain. These tactics really won't put the HERO in HeroClix. But they are their own kind of fun. A sneaky, deceitful, nasty, ratty kind of fun. Add Vermin to Killer Croc, Man-Thing and Caliban for a slimy sewer-creature Halloween team, 300 points exactly! (Too bad Caliban doesn't have the Monster keyword).

Top tip: Map choice is all-important with sun-hating creeps like this. Find a map with corridors/tunnels, hindering terrain, and lots of walls. If you play at home - find some Horrorclix maps!

Have you got a great war story from using the Rat Army? Let us know by posting your comments in the HCRealms.com units review by following the link here (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?t=286518).

lancelot
06/07/2011, 15:44
I've played Vermin to perfection and took down Iron Man/War Machine who was tied down by a plasticity figure while he was wagging his tail 2 squares away. Armor Piercing helped, too ;)

Grategy
06/07/2011, 15:46
Yes! This figure is absolutely awesome! So much damage potential for 43 points hes ridiculous. 10 attack with blades claws and a 2 range poison for 43 points? Well ok!

SevenFeathers
06/07/2011, 15:49
i actually played this guy the other day, with Vapor and a few other Smoke Clouders' and i had blast with it!!! Armor Piercing was on Vermin. great fun and i actially won choosing the Prison Map. i think a couple Verming with Armor Piercing, a Jackal and someone to Heal and another to TK...potential funess

konasavage
06/07/2011, 16:13
Any time you can do damage without having to roll is golden, this guy is awesome.

Great review of an often overlooked piece from WoS!

Blue_Shield
06/07/2011, 17:03
Nice choice to review. I have used Vermin a couple of times, he's a fig a lot of people ignore, but are shocked when he brings the pain.

WestCoastAvengers
06/07/2011, 17:08
I do have Horrorclix maps. Are they legal for official games?

peasant
06/07/2011, 17:15
A nauseating topic well executed, Bill, but you've only scratched the surface, which is just asking for trouble in the sewers. There's some nice synergy to be found between Vermin and anyone that produces hindering terrain or immobilizes an opponent, especially those that do so as a side effect of some other action. He's also not the only figure that benefits from a little bit of hindering on the map by a long shot. This team could be fun and has all of the above.

Vermin (with AP) 53
Ice 47 - Roots foes in place as a side effect of Incapacitate.
Sandman 101 - Plasticity, poison of his own, and punishment for those who fail to break.
Floronic Man 47 - Smokecloud produces 8 squares of hindering, stronger in hindering.
Groot 152 - Carries either the rodent or the shrub, heals constantly in hindering, smashes.
400 even

Blue_Shield
06/07/2011, 17:24
Nice team peasant!

A nauseating topic well executed, Bill, but you've only scratched the surface, which is just asking for trouble in the sewers. There's some nice synergy to be found between Vermin and anyone that produces hindering terrain or immobilizes an opponent, especially those that do so as a side effect of some other action. He's also not the only figure that benefits from a little bit of hindering on the map by a long shot. This team could be fun and has all of the above.

Vermin (with AP) 53
Ice 47 - Roots foes in place as a side effect of Incapacitate.
Sandman 101 - Plasticity, poison of his own, and punishment for those who fail to break.
Floronic Man 47 - Smokecloud produces 8 squares of hindering, stronger in hindering.
Groot 152 - Carries either the roden or the shrub, heals constantly in hindering, smashes.
400 even

peasant
06/07/2011, 18:08
Thank you Blue_Shield. I like Vermin a lot, but I too often get caught up thinking he should... attack. After Bill's concise reminder of how he /should/ be played, I wanted to showcase him in a force full of easily overlooked powers where he could be annoying without painting a big, bold target on his head. Plus, it lets me put together five fun figures for whom I've never really found a good fit sticking strictly to theme. Pity they're not theme, because I think this team would have a lovely time on Krakoa.

anonym0use
06/07/2011, 20:11
Well done! I love articles that spotlight weirdos like this!

anonym0use
06/07/2011, 20:11
That last comment was supposed to be applied to the figure, not the author.

fastcat99
06/07/2011, 20:29
Great fun! Thanks for the review!

T. Paul Stiles
06/07/2011, 21:28
I've had Vermin sitting in my Hero`clix box for some time but never got around to playing him.

The7ofDiamonds
06/07/2011, 22:52
I've played Vermin to perfection and took down Iron Man/War Machine who was tied down by a plasticity figure while he was wagging his tail 2 squares away. Armor Piercing helped, too ;)

i actually played this guy the other day, with Vapor and a few other Smoke Clouders' and i had blast with it!!! Armor Piercing was on Vermin. great fun and i actially won choosing the Prison Map. i think a couple Verming with Armor Piercing, a Jackal and someone to Heal and another to TK...potential funess

Plasticity tie up figures, smoke cloud, and Vermin.... I either have something crazy to try at next weeks tournament, or something ridiculous to try in the next round of FTBC.

mysterice
06/08/2011, 01:20
I feel like mentioning the synergy between Nightshade and Vermin could be quite nice. Also Arkham Asylum Robin is a nice choice adding the free incap along with the clouds that you are planning to make.

Dragon_Rose
06/08/2011, 01:46
I like a Spidey themed team up with Mysterio!

konasavage
06/08/2011, 08:25
Well done! I love articles that spotlight weirdos like this!

That last comment was supposed to be applied to the figure, not the author.

:laugh: Hahahahaha! Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight....

PresidntVictor
06/08/2011, 10:08
I don't think that the Smoke Cloud/Vermin combo works the way some people think it does. Since "the [smoke cloud] terrain markers remain until the beginning of your next turn," the opposing figure would no longer be in any Smoke Cloud-produced hindering when Vermin's Rat Army SP would kick in. Yes/no?

Great Mazinga
06/08/2011, 10:13
I kind of agree with PresVics interpretation. Smoke clouds "remain until the beginning of your next turn". That sounds like they cease when your next turn begins, rather than persist through the beginning of the next turn.

peasant
06/08/2011, 10:13
The 'until' is not a functionally different term (in Heroclix jargon) from 'At the beginning of your turn'. Any activities that take place prior to your first tokenable action of the turn all take place simultaneously, with the order of operations chosen by the active player. There have even been rulings that you could take free actions such as Outwit prior to any of the 'beginning of turn' abilities.

lancelot
06/08/2011, 11:41
The 'until' is not a functionally different term (in Heroclix jargon) from 'At the beginning of your turn'. Any activities that take place prior to your first tokenable action of the turn all take place simultaneously, with the order of operations chosen by the active player. There have even been rulings that you could take free actions such as Outwit prior to any of the 'beginning of turn' abilities.

Correct. I could Poison and then take down the Smoke Cloud tokens.

Carbon Rod
06/08/2011, 11:47
I used Vermin on an "animal" theme team to great success. With a Man-Bat Assassin in front for tie up, Vermin took out HoT SR Loki by himself. Used the 2 away poison to get him down to his Invun clix, moved in to base and then two blades/claws/fangs rolls later Loki was face down in sewer water. A "must" on animal theme teams (along with WL Animal Man)

Amora's_best_friend
06/08/2011, 12:06
Even if he didn't have the special power, he's still pretty good for the points, as a harasser. Great as a Nightcrawler buster, actually, given that Battle Fury now ignores Shape Change.

PresidntVictor
06/08/2011, 13:14
The 'until' is not a functionally different term (in Heroclix jargon) from 'At the beginning of your turn'. Both Outwit and Perplex use the "until the beginning of your next turn", and, as far as I know, that translates to "it's over when it's your turn but before your turn actually begins".

Otherwise, presuming a pushed opposing character has Toughness and HSS, I could Outwit defense one turn, then, at the beginning of my next turn, apply Poison damage and then Outwit the HSS. ...unless I'm wrong and that situation is totally legit.

peasant
06/08/2011, 17:35
I recall lengthy discussions about the subtlety of the 'beginning of turn' wording prior to the ruling that Lancelot has affirmed. Perhaps it is apropos to take your question to the rules forum and catch the attention of an orange. Though I vaguely recall a situation like the one you describe being verboten, it seems plausible.

jmainse
06/09/2011, 14:46
I will never play this figure, my honor forbids it, but I do see why Bill would use him. I also saw what Vermin can do when used by a crafty opponent.

bill4935
06/10/2011, 13:43
I will never play this figure, my honor forbids it, but I do see why Bill would use him. I also saw what Vermin can do when used by a crafty opponent.

I wish your honor forbade you from playing Metron.

That's all I have to say about that.

jmainse
06/10/2011, 21:11
I wish your honor forbade you from playing Metron.

That's all I have to say about that.

I promise to never play Metron again, now that I have Magneto.

bill4935
06/10/2011, 21:20
I promise to never play Metron again, now that I have Magneto.


NOOOOOOOOO. (http://www.nooooooooooooooo.com/)

Do not want.

jmainse
06/11/2011, 20:10
Honestly, when I place my team on the board, I like the look on my opponents face when they see what I'm playing and they figure out exactly how I am going to beat them. Vermin is a much too subtle figure for me. Though it might be fun to team him with Nightshade and Floronic Man.:nervous:

Kilowog17
06/12/2011, 14:41
NOOOOOOOOO. (http://www.nooooooooooooooo.com/)

Do not want.

HAHAHA!

I have had great luck against Magneto in the past with oddly enough, (Common) Wolverine from GSX. Get in close, outwit his TK and attack-attack-attack.

PresidntVictor
06/27/2011, 14:36
I recall lengthy discussions about the subtlety of the 'beginning of turn' wording prior to the ruling that Lancelot has affirmed. Perhaps it is apropos to take your question to the rules forum and catch the attention of an orange. Though I vaguely recall a situation like the one you describe being verboten, it seems plausible.Okay, well I never did plop this over in the rules forum, but I just got back from reading the GSX vs WoS Healing Trait for Wolverine, and it was pointed out that:

"When a player begins his or her turn, first resolve and end all effects that last "until the beginning of your turn" or "until your next turn", then resolve all effects that occur "at the beginning of your turn". (Rulebook, p. 7)

So, I was wrong with the way I said it, but I was right in that the effect that you are trying to achieve (Poison followed by removing the Smoke Cloud tokens) is disallowed (has to be remove the Smoke Cloud tokens followed by Poison).