Mafia Team actions: submitted All-in-1 vs Separate

[DarqFeonix]

Yoinked from the Mortal Kombat game:

Maybe. Normally, the don sends in all actions.

I think I'm going to start making each mafia member send in their own action in my games, for three reasons.
1) It points out inactivity in the mafia.
2) It stops mafia members from coasting, thinking the don will do the thinking for them
3) It allows traitors to have an easier time and therefore provides more paranoia that there are traitors when there are not.

I am personally against this for various reasons, but I'd like to hear from the peanut gallery. For me, as a mod (yes, I actually used to run games!), I expect the Mafia teams actions to be the last ones submitted. Multiple areas of input require there to be hours between question amd answer, and by the time actions are finalized, chances are you are bumping up against sunrise, and Making each member separately could cause even participating members to miss the deadline. More importantly, many Mafia night strategies depend on multiple actions to work together.

That being said, this is why I always set up a Proboard for Mafia teams in advance. I can track their online times/posts on that board, and if I see a member is not pulling their weight, I will inform their team that if said player does not get online, they will have no action.

More thoughts?

[Ouchmaker]

I mainly agree with Darq, and for the reasons he pointed out.

However, if there is, for instance, a cult that can recruit from the Mafia (Darq), then individual actions should be mandatory from the start. Just so that when the one given the kill order (Me) decides to kill a mafia member that has acted suspiciously (Darq), the action does go through, instead of additional time being given, thus removing the doubt of a traitor. :tired:

Just saying. :nervous:

[Jackofhearts2005]

I expect the mafia's actions to always be last but there have been times (as both a player and a mod) that I've seen the mafia basically not talk all night and then several hours past the deadline, somebody be like "Oh, crap. We need actions!"

I think if each mafia member goes into the night thinking, as townies do, "Who am I going to target?" that it would cause the mafia to submit their actions faster.

[DarqFeonix]

I mainly agree with Darq, and for the reasons he pointed out.

However, if there is, for instance, a cult that can recruit from the Mafia (Darq), then individual actions should be mandatory from the start. Just so that when the one given the kill order (Me) decides to kill a mafia member that has acted suspiciously (Darq), the action does go through, instead of additional time being given, thus removing the doubt of a traitor. :tired:

Just saying. :nervous:

Heh

http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs20/i/2007/275/1/4/Zombie_Jessica_Rabbit_by_DoubleM.jpg

[Rokk_Krinn]

Well, I'm of mixed minds on the topic.

My proboard lack of activity verges on infamous...but I would like to believe my teammates feel I bring other values to the table, even if they had to submit for me or pass things along via PM.

On the other hand, a totally coasting and notably absent teammate is both unfair to the Mafia members who are trying and potentially threatening (as people note so-and-so isn't around but must be having his actions submitted).

[The BoyBlunder]

I see both sides. My solution is that during my games, actions all come in at once, but results go to the mafia member who owns that power. If the mafia isn't getting results from their reverse tracker, they are going to speak up right quick.

[sstralkowski]

I see both sides. My solution is that during my games, actions all come in at once, but results go to the mafia member who owns that power. If the mafia isn't getting results from their reverse tracker, they are going to speak up right quick.

This might actually be a good compromise. Way to be there, man.

[DarqFeonix]

I see both sides. My solution is that during my games, actions all come in at once, but results go to the mafia member who owns that power. If the mafia isn't getting results from their reverse tracker, they are going to speak up right quick.

...hmph, I like that. I personally know as a player, I hate waiting for my partner's results... But that's the hand you'll have to play.

So noted for future games.

[zyxba]

I feel like it would depend on the game. In any game where the mafia members might want some autonomy, it's a big benefit, as well as encouraging people to not go inactive.

But in any game where coordinating is key, or the don is in control of everything they do, it makes sense for the don to send in actions.

The worst thing I can see though? The don not getting online and sending in the actions. Imagine how frustrating that is for the rest of the mafia.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Funny thing is, when we first started playing on the Realms the Don submitted your actions not as a time saver but because he had final say in things. I remember being paranoid of my own Mafia in the very first game because the Don had switched me to being the killer and had chosen to not tell me.

(That's right - I was Eeeevil from the get-go).

[Silver Lantern]

Meh, just like in real life, there are those who will put in more work than others. There are slackers and there are go-getters. There are also times when individuals can participate more than other times, and times where we have stuff IRL and the mafia game is #37 on our list of priorities for the day. I still remember that one Stan game where I forgot to send in an action towards the end of the game and it cost me (I think it was the game with all the Madroxes).

My personal opinion is that mods need to be a little more lenient about actions and the fact that some people have spouses, and school, and jobs, and kids, and getting in our action by whenever that random ### 24 hour mark lands each phase, just isn't on the radar (and I realize I haven't modded any games so critize it if you will). What I am trying to say is that if the missed action or delay is inadvertant, then be understandable and reasonable about it. Most of us don't miss actions on purpose or to be d-bags.

I've seen mods come up with creative ways to hose players for this (TBB noted one, another is the famous "I will randomize your action, but you won't know who you targeted" lameness). I think everyone should be entitiled to one remainder PM if they are late and given at least a 4 hour grace period (if not more) to get in an action. Second time you hold up the game, then maybe you lose your action for the night. Third time, you get replaced. And being Mafia is hard IMO, I wouldn't take away any advantage those guys may have such as submitting actions for each other.

[The BoyBlunder]

Meh, just like in real life, there are those who will put in more work than others. There are slackers and there are go-getters. There are also times when individuals can participate more than other times, and times where we have stuff IRL and the mafia game is #37 on our list of priorities for the day. I still remember that one Stan game where I forgot to send in an action towards the end of the game and it cost me (I think it was the game with all the Madroxes).

My personal opinion is that mods need to be a little more lenient about actions and the fact that some people have spouses, and school, and jobs, and kids, and getting in our action by whenever that random ### 24 hour mark lands each phase, just isn't on the radar (and I realize I haven't modded any games so critize it if you will). What I am trying to say is that if the missed action or delay is inadvertant, then be understandable and reasonable about it. Most of us don't miss actions on purpose or to be d-bags.

I've seen mods come up with creative ways to hose players for this (TBB noted one, another is the famous "I will randomize your action, but you won't know who you targeted" lameness). I think everyone should be entitiled to one remainder PM if they are late and given at least a 4 hour grace period (if not more) to get in an action. Second time you hold up the game, then maybe you lose your action for the night. Third time, you get replaced. And being Mafia is hard IMO, I wouldn't take away any advantage those guys may have such as submitting actions for each other.

All those grace periods add up, and can seriously derail a game. Add to that that mods have just the same lives, and can't hold up the game on account of one person. I try to open as close to 24 hours as I can, but as long as I've gotten the action before I sit down to compile the night, I usually let it be.

[sstralkowski]

Funny thing is, when we first started playing on the Realms the Don submitted your actions not as a time saver but because he had final say in things. I remember being paranoid of my own Mafia in the very first game because the Don had switched me to being the killer and had chosen to not tell me.

(That's right - I was Eeeevil from the get-go).

Heh, Rinmaster, wasn't it? Still one of the most fun games I've played. If you have time, go back and read through it (linked in my realms blog). You'll laugh hysterically at how poorly we played. There's no way any of us would have gotten away with half the crap we did in that game. That's why i love it so much. We were all rookies and there was absolutely no meta at all.

All those grace periods add up, and can seriously derail a game. Add to that that mods have just the same lives, and can't hold up the game on account of one person. I try to open as close to 24 hours as I can, but as long as I've gotten the action before I sit down to compile the night, I usually let it be.

Although I try to hold up the 24hr "actions in" mark, I have to be lenient sometimes. basically, I run it the same way you said that if it's in before I sit down to write things up, it counts, even if it's past the 24hr mark. If I have to repatedly remind someone to send in an action, I get frustrated and usually replace them.

I try to stick to 24-36hrs to reopen on a normal phase. 48 on weekends. It doesn't seem to hurt participation in my games, but it certainly does help me balance life and mafia.

[K-ness]

In Chrono Trigger mafia (reopening the wound), Quebbster was able to send in his alternate plans to me. As the mafia traitor, he needed an outlet like that. It's what I would do in a case like that...

As for other members being able to submit actions for everyone... I like an active proboard when I run a mafia game. I love seeing their thoughts and reactions to various things. It helps me as a moderator understand what areas of the game I am doing well and what I am doing bad.

For instance, the complaints after Night 1's janitor kill in Mystic Quest showed me that I did that completely wrong. Just as an example. Another aspect of an active proboard that I like is it shows me that the players are trying and bringing forth a team aspect. I also take note when only one member is participating with the others MIA. I will step in and make replacements when needed, and I will also be leery about allowing repeat offenders to sign-up for more games.

Ultimately, I don't think I would ever require separate submissions of mafia actions. In the case of 1 player participating with all others being MIA, that 1 player is pretty much screwed because it's unlikely that his single action will get him anywhere in the game.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Heh, Rinmaster, wasn't it? Still one of the most fun games I've played. If you have time, go back and read through it (linked in my realms blog). You'll laugh hysterically at how poorly we played. There's no way any of us would have gotten away with half the crap we did in that game. That's why i love it so much. We were all rookies and there was absolutely no meta at all.


Len Snart was obviously telling the truth.

If someone else had been lynched, the town might have won.

Also, you should have blocked Dumas the skrull. :cheeky:

[sstralkowski]

Len Snart was obviously telling the truth.

If someone else had been lynched, the town might have won.

Also, you should have blocked Dumas the skrull. :cheeky:

Yeah, there's a whole lot that was poorly done back then. Really funny to look back on though.