Question about Justice League Comics

[Angelofhate]

Ok, I've been a Marvel reader since... I was like 5. I love marvel comics and will continue to read them. I stayed away from DC for one reason: Superman. He seemed like such a boring character to me, how can I identify with a hero that is nearly impossible to defeat (same reason I didnt enjoy Matrix: Reloaded).

However I just watched "Justice Saturday" on Cartoon Network and I have a few questions:

What is Darkseid's history... where did he come from, what kind of being is he?

Who is Brainiac? (An android from Krypton?)

Where is Martian Manhunter from, what kind of powers does he have and where did he get them?

Same question as above, only for Hawkgirl... who kicked some serious butt with that mace of hers!

This one evening of cartoons may actually have reading some DC...

Thanks guys!

Angel

[Cliff Stockton]

Hope this helps a little bit...

Darkseid is the all powerful ruler of the world Apokolips. It is in another dimension that is accessed through a "Boom Tube". It is the dark to the light that is New Genesis, home of the New Gods and Highfather Izaya.

Both planets have been at war since the beginning of whatever...

At one time Highfather and Darkseid called an uneasy truce by exchanging their sons with each other.

Darkseid's son, Orion, was raised as a New God on New Genesis by Highfather but he still retains his "dark side" and is ruthless in battle.

Highfather's son, Scott Free, was given to Darkseid and he gave him to Granny Goodness, head of the military school/orphanage on Apokolips. He was raised under the ruthless and unforgiving hand of Granny. However, she was never able to truly break his spirit and he one day escaped the orphanage and later became the New God Mister Miracle.

Brainiac I am a little unsure of since his origin has changed so much from what I used to know of him.

Martian Manhunter is the last survivor of the planet Mars. In the comics he is just about as powerful as Superman with many of the same or similar powers. Plus, he can change his shape, turn invisible and is a powerful telepath. He was toned down a little for the JL cartoon though. Only displaying a few of his powers that I've seen so far.

Hawkgirl is Shayera Hol, a policewoman from the planet Thanagar. ( Hawkman's wife if they ever show him. ) Her origins are rather complicated too as is the entire Hawkman storyline, according to the comics. They picked her for the JL to add another female to the group and also John Stewart to add some diversity and ethnicity to the team.

Hope this didn't confuse you too much. I may not have the exact events or history correct on some of these points but maybe it helped answer a few of your questions.

Cliff

[Angelofhate]

It helped a little, considering comic "backgrounds" are never too clear.

So Darkseid is an all-powerful entity? Interesting.

Granny Goodness? (Sorry about all the questions, but I'm getting interested in Darkseid's story... any trades people can recommend?)

[Spock]

Granny Goodness is an old woman who seems to be basically in charge of training Darkseid's military.

Which Brainiac? There are several. I don't think any of them are from Krypton, though.

[Spock]

I'm not sure about all-powerful, but he's close enough....the Omega beams that he shoots from his eyes can cross the universe to seek out thier target. I've never seen him beaten by anybody other than Doomsday (the guy who killed Superman)

[Angelofhate]

Another question...

Who is this Highfather? How is he related to Darkseid... are they just age old enemies, fighting since the dawn of time?

[Spock]

Oooh, I thought I'd missed it but I hadn't...the dark superman episode is on now (in Colorado) though the captioning is a little spotty.

According to the episode that was on an hour ago, there was originally one world, which became two. The world of goodness, light, and beauty, ruled by Highfather, and the world of evil, ruled by darkseid, who psychically feeds on the misery of others.

[Angelofhate]

I... see...

Any recommendations for trades concerning Darkseid and the Highfather, maybe a war between them or origins?

[Cliff Stockton]

Highfather is the ruler of New Genesis. I don't know much more about him than that. Apokolips and Darkseid are usually the focal point with most stories involving these characters. Usually...

Highfather and New Genesis are the representation of all that is good in this realm. New Genesis is a virtual Utopia with everyone living in harmony and peace.

Apokolips is all that is bad. The planet is one big industrial plant with huge furnaces and firepits that scar its surface. It is home to Darkseid and his minions. He is out to conquer and gain control of the universe by force.

Jack Kirby created these guys years ago. They had their own book back in the 70's I think...The New Gods. In a way the New Gods remind me of the Eternals in the Marvel Universe.

Maybe I'm just recalling images of each both done by Kirby.

I don't really know all the in's and out's of these characters and stories. Just mostly what I've picked up from reading DC for years and years.

[Cliff Stockton]

Now I remember something about the one world being split into two separate ones. I'd forgotten that until I read Spock's post.

I tried recording the JL marathon on Cartoon Network. Hope I got that episode he mentioned.

[eshuroger]

At the risk of confusing you further, I'd mention that the cartoon's version of Hawkgirl no longer exists as part of comic continuity.

According to current continuity (which is constantly being rewritten and revised) Shayera Thal called herself "Hawkwoman" and wore Thanagarian police body-armor and big metallic wings. She's also more prone to be armed with firearms than that shock-mace thing.

The cartoon is borrowing liberally from Silver Age continuity, where, indeed, Shayera Thal was Hawkgirl (later Hawkwoman) and wore the costume as seen on the show. In none of her several versions, however, did she use that shock-mace, though the Silver Age version (who is now retconned into the Golden Age Hawkgirl, Shiera Saunders Hall) used a variety of archaic and more mundane melee and missile weapons.

The Hawkgirl that's more likely to be made for Heroclix is the current one, Kendra Saunders. You can see her in the pages of Hawkman and JSA .

[Ignatz_Mouse]

Regarding Darksied and his story:

He is in seach of the secret to the Source. His son is leading the battle against him. That, plus the helmet, and you can see where a little part of the inspiration for Star Wars came from.

[Ignatz_Mouse]

Double post.

[Spock]

hmm, looks like the Cartoon Network Brainiac does come from Krypton. Having trouble following 'cause the captioning is screwed up on this one, but it looks like he takes all the information he can from a planet and then destroys is.

[Angelofhate]

I'm so confused..

Maybe I'll just watch the Cartoon... do they have any episodes on DVD?

[weezer_10]

Originally posted by Cliff Stockton
Hawkgirl is Shayera Hol, a policewoman from the planet Thanagar...

Isn't Hawkgirl Kendra Saunders in the Justice League cartoons?

[Spock]

Dunno, you could try Amazon.

Or, depending on where you are, you could turn your TV to the cartoon network right now ;-)

[ohcysp]

For good reading on the History and a little background for Darkseid and his storylins try to find a copy of Cosmic Oddessy, DC circa 1988 and the more recent Superman: The Dark Side. If you just watch the STAS(Superman: the Animatied Series) where Supes was brainwashed by Darkseid. that episode is based on the Elseworld book Superman: The Dark Side. It's a great story, just don't think of the ending as true in the connon comics universe.

[Angelofhate]

I'll check those out, thanks....

And yeah, I did just watch that STAS episode... was interesting, but I'm wondering how Lex Luthor gets so much kryptonite... isnt it supposed to be RARE?

[Masada]

Originally posted by Angelofhate
I stayed away from DC for one reason: Superman. He seemed like such a boring character to me, how can I identify with a hero that is nearly impossible to defeat?

It is Clark's humanity despite the awesome power of Superman that makes for good stories.

[ohcysp]

Brainiac is a bit more difficult to explain. The current Brainiac that you'll se in the STAS, is based on Brainac 13 the latest Braniac in the Comics. Originally Brainiac was Milton Fine a Circus Mentalist who went bad. Then he was belived to be an alien who posseses him under the name of Vril Dox. A bald Green skinned Telepath powerfull enough to control computers and machines. He went nuts and died as they usually do in the comics, But part of him survived as a computer virus Brainiac 2.0 and eventually rebult himself a new body based on future technology, thus Brainiac 13. There is a lot of story I'm cutting so please bare with me.

[Spock]

And yeah, I did just watch that STAS episode... was interesting, but I'm wondering how Lex Luthor gets so much kryptonite... isnt it supposed to be RARE?

Hey, he's one of the richest and most power men on the planet...he probably buys or steals every bit of it that falls to earth (assuming the government doesn't get it first)

[ohcysp]

Originally posted by Angelofhate
I'll check those out, thanks....

And yeah, I did just watch that STAS episode... was interesting, but I'm wondering how Lex Luthor gets so much kryptonite... isnt it supposed to be RARE?


In all acuallity there are maybe 5-7 used fragments of Kryptonite in the comics. They just keep getting used over and over again. Luther is known for having a ring with a jewel carved fragment of Kryptonite to keep superman away. I know that Supes gave it to Batman for safe keeping and if anyone ever needed to stop Superman(that's trust) But recently when Luthor became President(I'm reading the President Lex TBP, great read) Luthor has the ring back in a box on his desk.

[clixhunter]

you've got most the info on darkseid now....other new gods...lightray, metron.....and there was this antlike guy who i really liked and cant for the life of me remember hsi name right now.....i'll wake up at 4 am shouting it out you watch.

others of darkseids minions are kalibak, the furies and a hitler knockoff who leads his armies, canto the assasssin, and some silver tongued guy godfrey...

there is a legion of superheroes series that had darkseid and evil replicas of some heroes....superman, wonder woman, metron, orion.... vs the lsh...excellant read.

brainiac in the cartoon is not the brainiac in the comics. brainiac in the comics is from colu. a planet that prides itself in "brains" . brainiac (is brainiac 1) the smartest man on the planet...who is exiled because he was evil...evil. later he lost his body and downloaded his brain and soul into the android body...now he is immortal. incidently brainiac 5 of the legion of superheroes is his decendant and is the only possessor of "12th level intellect"

martian manhunter is the only GREEN martian survivor. there are an abundance of White martians ...main dif between them is there outlook on life. greens valued goodness and peace. harmony. the whites valued control, dominance, strength. a civil war killed all the greens except jonn. and saw the whites trapped. jonn fled the lonliness and arrived on earth when John Jones, private detective was killed by crooks. Jonn Jon'zz took his identity and tracked the crooks down and brought them to justice........and so the name.

you've got as much info on hawkgirl that you should look for...that one gets really confusing.....the hawks are reincarnated again and again and again........

[ohcysp]

Is the Ant like guy you are refering to Orion?

[invisibo]

brainiac in the toons is a computer, who travels from planet to planet collecting all the knowledge from them and storing them...he then destroys the planet he is on. he is not from krypton, though destroyed krypton. he has all it's info, effectively making him from krypton.

[Cliff Stockton]

THe Hawkgirl in the JL animated series is Shayera Hol from Thanagar. I saw an episode once where she mentioned her homeworld.

The Hawks storyline is very confusing even to a longtime DC reader like me. Each version is a reincarnated life of an Egyptian Prince and his princess.

Although, there was actually a Katar and Shayera Hol from Thanagar that were separate beings than Carter and Sheira Hall. I am finding this out now in Hawkman's current monthly comic. Like I said.......VEEEEEEEEEERRRYYYY confusing.

[Cliff Stockton]

BTW, Cosmic Odyssey...very good story!

[clixhunter]

no...when the forever people were travelling around trying to locate the ? (forget how many people ) who had part of the "creation formula" (unsure about term) there were 4 new gods around to protect them...orion, lightray, metron and...???. anyone know dcs directory address then i could just go look it up.

and and aside....vril dox is brainiac 1 (and yes he did possess milton fine) querl dox (the legion of super heroes super scientist...who should have loads of outwit in his clix version) is brainiac 5 the robots are all loaded with vril dox's inteligence. now there are new and improved versions of the robot continuously throughtout time...and they mey # themselves (as does ultron)

[Ignatz_Mouse]

Forager is the ant-guy in the New Gods. I believe he was killed at some point and replaced with a female forager.

[Angelofhate]

Wow guys, Thanks a million... I may pick up Cosmic Odyssey after I get paid this week ;-)

[Frontman]

Originally posted by Angelofhate
I... see...

Any recommendations for trades concerning Darkseid and the Highfather, maybe a war between them or origins?

I'm not sure if its TPB or a hardcover (or if its even in print right now) but for all details concerning Darkseid, Highfather, New Gods; look no further than "Jack Kirby's New Gods." DC wanted to have Jack work for them, and in a move un-precedented at the time, gave him 4 titles to tell his magnum opus. It was an all-spanning war between those two worlds, with some incredible characters that still hold up well today. (Just look at the interest Darkseid's appearance on Cartoon Network generated.)

I just love in the 6 episodes that aired last night, the use of what is affectionately called "Kirby dots" was abundant. (Explosions or fire that are filled with dots. Jack Kirby used to do that in so many different forms of energy back when he drew.) That was cool to see.

And talk about celebrity used voices. Rene Aberjouois, Michael Ironside, Michael Dorn, Powers Boothe. Pretty good actors lending their voices to those episodes.

PEACE!!!

[Angelofhate]

Is this what you are talking about:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1563893851/qid=1057501976/sr=1-24/ref=sr_1_24/104-7442368-7592748?v=glance&s=books

?

If so... maybe I have to pick that one up too.

And the main reason I'm so interested in Darkseid... when superman beat the tar out of him and freed his people, his people picked him back up saying "let me help you master"... then darkseid looked at supes and said "I am many things, but here I am God."

Very cool scripting on the writers part :-D

[Frontman]

The high-concept dialogue from all the episodes was also very New Gods. And yep, that was another book that goes into detail about New Genesis, Darkseid, and of course, Orion.

Also look at the JLA TPBs that have Orion and Big Barda in them. They were sent to Earth by Highfather to help the JLA defeat Mageddon, which was a great storyline by Grant Morrison.

Overall, I was very impressed with the storytelling in those episodes. And the tension between Batman and Superman was absolutely awesome!

PEACE!!!

Tim

[Frontman]

A couple other TPBs to check out

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1563896184/qid=1057502755/sr=1-10/ref=sr_1_10/104-0705277-2554306?v=glance&s=books

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1563894165/qid=1057502824/sr=1-11/ref=sr_1_11/104-0705277-2554306?v=glance&s=books

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1401200214/qid=1057502755/sr=1-4/ref=sr_1_4/104-0705277-2554306?v=glance&s=books

The second one is "Rock of Ages" which features Darkseid, Orion, and The Black Racer. Also Amazo, Desaad, and the Injustice Gang.

PEACE!!!

Tim

[jovis219]

On the Superman cartoon, Brainiac was the AI to the Kryptonian Council. Jor-El tried to warn everyone the planet was dying and Brainiac assured them it wasn't. Turns out he knew all along and was busy downloading himself onto a satellite, thus preserving "Krypton." When the planet blew, he began traveling to planets, absorbing their information, and destroying them.

And while I'm thinking of Superman...The reason he is one of my favorite characters: he has all these powers and yet is so altruistic. If I was Superman, I'd be a hero, sure...But I'd also check out lotto tickets with my X-Ray vision, or exploit my powers so I don't need a day job...You know, so I have more world-saving time.
Only Clark Kent can be Superman. Batman would rule the Earth with an Iron Hand with Superman's powers. Heck, even Peter Parker cashes in on Spider-Man with the Bugle pics. How often does Clark Kent write about Superman?