View Full Version : Kingdom come questions(the comic)
Darksavage27
04/11/2004, 12:44
It is my favorite book, and one of DCs best. I have read it about 5 times, and still have some questions:
Who is the green lantern, Kyle, or Hal?
Is that lobo with the beer gut at that bar, with the "bite me fanboy" shirt on?
How old is Cap. Marvel in this story?
Thanks to all who can help me out here, and more questions may arise, as i contiunue to look thru the book.
Originally posted by Darksavage27
It is my favorite book, and one of DCs best. I have read it about 5 times, and still have some questions:
Who is the green lantern, Kyle, or Hal?
Is that lobo with the beer gut at that bar, with the "bite me fanboy" shirt on?
How old is Cap. Marvel in this story?
Thanks to all who can help me out here, and more questions may arise, as i contiunue to look thru the book.
Neither. It is Alan Scott (the Golden Age GL)
Might be, fanboy
Billy is 16 now, and KC is in "2020" or so, so Billy is in early 30's. Cap does not age when he is not in "our" world
Also, look for the Monkees, Fat Albert Gang, Village People, Wonder Twins
GL? Neither... it's Alan. In the follow up... The Kingdom ... when on board that giant floating fortress someone is yelled at for bringing a wooden toothpick aboard. Which being the weakness to Alan... could destroy the entire satellite.
Lobo = yes... great huh?
Cap. Marvel well, Billy Batson is approximately 12 or so in present and Kingdom Come is 15? 20? years in the possible future. So looking at the guy I would guess he's in his late twenties early thirties. I'm not a Shazam, Cap. Marvel expert like I am most of the other JLAers. Knowing the present day's Billy Batson's age is beyond me right now.
This book is crazy. So much was there and never talked about. So much was tossed in and almost hidden. This is what makes it amazing. Each read through can give you something different.
crookedtooth
04/11/2004, 12:58
ok, now I've got a question....who is the spector? is it HAL? :confused:
I haven't read the kingdom yet, is it any good?
GO TEAM BATS!:p
Darksavage27
04/11/2004, 13:00
it was amazing, and you should definetly buy it soon. It would also give you a better grasp on the KC figs.
Originally posted by crookedtooth
ok, now I've got a question....who is the spector? is it HAL? :confused:
I haven't read the kingdom yet, is it any good?
GO TEAM BATS!:p
Based on his hair colour and streak in the hair, it is Jason Blood, finally freed from Etrigan
Kingdom was a MAJOR let down
crookedtooth
04/11/2004, 13:09
Ok, I have been trying to figure out who the spector was in it for a while and nobody has ever really given me a good answer! :) Thanks!
I saw kingdom in the store once, and thought about getting it. It sort of looked good, but I felt it was a bunch of guys riding the coat tails of a great book. Since Unleashed came out I have been wanting to get more story regarding the characters of kingdom come. Thanks for the info.
GO TEAM BATS!
The two were, I believe, written by the same guy so if he wants to ride his own coat tails I say let him.
crookedtooth
04/11/2004, 13:32
Ouch! I didn't know that, hmmm, I take that statement back then. :p Was it any good?
NickFury15
04/11/2004, 14:15
Actually, in Kingdom Come, the Spectre isn't Jason Blood. It's Jim Corrigan, the original Spectre. I believe Kingdom Come was written before Hal became the Spectre.
The first three or so books of it were good, but it all started falling apart after the KC folks were sent to the past.
Paptimus
04/11/2004, 14:33
And since Hal is about to leave the Spectre's identity... KC is back in continuity!! (Hal's back as GL, yeah!!!!) Perhaps Jim Corrigan will come back (being conservative as I am, I hope so). The Jason Blood hypothesis is interesting, though... (though I haven't the comic now to see if it's possible)
I don't have the book right in front of me right now, but I'm pretty darn sure it's Corrigan. In fact, we even see his gravesite, don't we?
Cliff Stockton
04/11/2004, 14:56
Also, if you're picking out things in the background...
When we see the Bat Sentries for the first time, they are surrounding a group of black youths... The Cosby Kids.
Fat Albert and gang...NOT Theo, Vanessa and the rest.
I liked the Monkee Men in the background. Check out the big battle page when they first charge the Gulag. You'll see a few Avengers in the crowd too.
I really liked Alex Ross' uses for the Hall of Justice and the Legion of Doom's HQ from the old Superfriends cartoon. Sweet.
I always thought the Spectre was Jim Corrigan too. Although, I can see the reasoning behind why someone might think it's Jason Blood.
Ther are so many things in these books you can find each time you look through them. Lots of cool stuff for the older fan, like me. ;)
NickFury15
04/11/2004, 15:01
Hey Cliff, I don't see any Avengers... Where are they? Which ones?
The Qwardian
04/11/2004, 15:50
The proof that GL is intead Alan Scott is on page 199 look at GL's ring. Its Alan Scotts ring, Not Hal or Kyle. The Spectre is Jim Corrigan, on page 122 Deadman tells the story of Spectre, saying he was once a "Normal Joe, A cop once."
Jim Corrigan was a police officer and wa killed on duty. He then later became the Spectre.
MoffProulx
04/11/2004, 16:07
I re-read the hardcover last night. What a great story. I always thought that GL was Hal, but I guess that would explain why Ollie's arrows penetrated GL's armor. In the back of the book there is an index to the covers and all it says for GL is that "he merged the lantern into himself, he is the most powerful champion of that name." I didn't find anything about the toothpick though. Can someone point that out?
Prof. Aragorn
04/11/2004, 16:27
I remember reading something about a toothpick in kingdom come, but I have one question:
Is the Magog character from unleashed supposed to be Magog from Kingdom Come or Gog in the current superman books?
eshuroger
04/11/2004, 16:47
Considering he has the KC Team Ability? Option #1.
Speaking of little inside jokes and stuff in the art, at the beginning when the narrator is walking through the streets, he walks by a store. In the window is a book titled "Under the Hood by Hollis Mason" which is a reference to Alan Moore's "Watchmen". A far superior book to KC, and most everything else.
Watchmen is fantastic, but I'll be the first to say that if there are any comics in the same league as it, it's Kingdom Come, so I have a hard time thinking watchmen is "far superior".
But that's just me. :devious:
Cliff Stockton
04/11/2004, 19:55
Originally posted by NickFury15
Hey Cliff, I don't see any Avengers... Where are they? Which ones?
OK, my bad... it's book 3. The next to last page at the top. It's the page facing Captain Marvel standing over Superman with his hands on his hips. The image is right above Superman flying headfirst with fists in front of him just before CM knocks him out of the sky.
Find the pair of silver legs dangling into the frame from the top and then over to the shadowy insect-like figure.
I see Spider-Man, Captain America, Thor and Doctor Strange.
At least that's who they look like to me.
:grin:
Cliff Stockton
04/11/2004, 19:57
And please, no one flame me about them all not being Avengers. I was going on memory and couldn't remember who exactly I had seen.
Darksavage27
04/11/2004, 21:02
Got another question:
What happened to magogs character? is he still in comics, and was this his first appearence?
Cliff your right about that I see Spider-Man, Cap and Thor standing there, I just wanna know where Swamp Thing is in this book?
NickFury15
04/11/2004, 21:27
It's his first, and last appearance. Since than, it's just been Gog, the Magog wannabe from The Kingdom.
Gargantua
04/11/2004, 21:41
I see Spider-Man, Captain America, Thor and Doctor Strange
Spider-man & Dr. Strange are open to debate, but I can definitely see Thor and Cap.
I'm glad people mentioned that GL was Alan Scott. I'd never considered that. It explains whe he looks so much older than, say, Bruce Wayne or Ollie Queen.
I found the Fat Albert reference. Probably wouldn't have picked it out if it hadn't been pointed out to me. It's subtle. How about the Monkees that people mentioned. Where would I find that?
Here this might help.
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Olympus/7160/kc2.html
NosMo
Well, if were gonna talk about the Monkees, what about Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band? Or am I the only one that noticed them? And another question for you all, which Flash is the Flash in KC? Jay, Barry or Wally? Truthfully, I lean more towards him being Jay, what with the helmet he's wearing and all.
JtHM_Dude
04/11/2004, 22:53
w o w
that person has no life
that is SO COOL
sundevil
04/11/2004, 22:58
When Superman comes out of retirement and hits the superhero nightclub for recruits, you can see Swamp Thing in a coat and hat and as well as Sherlock Holmes, the Village People, the Question, Solomon Grundy as a bouncer, the Shadow, Wonder Twin Jan (the boy) as a waiter and Watchmen's own Rorshach...not once but TWICE.
Search and enjoy. :)
JtHM_Dude
04/11/2004, 23:04
i like the C & D part of your sig sundevil
and if you pick through every thing on that site it si so cool
does anyone reccomend the kingdom
also, i heard magog is wonerwoman and supermans son, True?
Darksavage27
04/11/2004, 23:24
no magog is not the son of supes and WW, their child is not born yet, even at the end of kingdom come. Magog cannot possibly be their child
NickFury15
04/12/2004, 00:44
I just saw Rorshach, very very cool, this coming from a Watchmen fan.
I also heard the rumor about Magog being Superman and WW's son, who traveled back in time. He actually does look a little like Supes...
Diggergig
04/12/2004, 01:27
That would make sense in a soap-opera kinda way.
How come they didn't opt for a KCGL this time around? Will there be any more KC figs in the next set you think? Sure hope so, as a CKGL would potentialy be an uber-powerhouse.
Hmm, anyone created a home-made KCGL base?
NickFury15
04/12/2004, 07:18
Have you noticed how freaking huge the GL base is? Each of those little dome things are holding skyscr-apers (hyphenated to protect my message from rediculous censoring)
skyounkin
04/12/2004, 07:37
I always thought the Flash in KC was Wally, BUT I am thinking of a scene where they show GL and Flash looking at each other smiling which could be them remembering their time in the JSA......
But I still think it is wally.
The woman patrolling the Gulag with an Eye patch is Big Barda, and Scott Free Mister Miracle is the "warden"
Plastic man is being stretched in the bar scene between patrons.....
And to my recolection the son of WW and Supes is not Magog, or Gog, but supposedly a care taker of "Hypertime" a nexus point inbetween the many realities of DC, one of the reasons The Kingdom wasn't good is they didn't get Alex Ross on board, second they tried desperatly to connect KC with current DC continuity, which lessened the impact of KC-Alex Ross wanted it to be like 10 years after KC where the big three are raising the son of Superman and Wonder woman, which to me would have been great....oh well.
Enjoy!
crookedtooth
04/12/2004, 07:57
man this is all great stuff! you guys have just given some new light to a book that i've read about 10 times and never gets old....One more question. Who is it that comes into the gulag when all the prisoners are watching the holographic message from superman?? ya know right before Von Bach gets tossed?? (actually the guy that tosses him)
Oh yeah, definately see thor, capt.! Spidey and Doc strange I see, but maybe cause I wanna (but why not the other two are so obvious) And fat albert and gang! thats good, anyone notice mushmouth (or whatever) with the hat over is head (its been a while);)
Thanks all, really enjoying this thread!!
GO TEAM BATS!!
I wanna say the image in the Gulag is Adam Strange, but I don't have my copy of KC to confirm it.
Crispy331
04/12/2004, 13:30
Also....have you guys noticed that Uncle Sam is sitting at the bar with Spec. and norman....hes to the right....
TheUltimates
04/19/2004, 01:42
Originally posted by Grinner
I don't have the book right in front of me right now, but I'm pretty darn sure it's Corrigan. In fact, we even see his gravesite, don't we?
"Once I wore the name James Corrigan and reveled in the deliverance of justice. That was lifetimes ago, and what humanity remains in my nature is inadequate. Now I must anchor myself to the soul of a mortal who seeks justice" Kingcom Come. Pg. 49.
Alan Scott is the GL.
The novel is really good. Get more of a background than the GN. But I haven't read the GN...yet. I want to pick it up.
TheUltimates
04/19/2004, 01:45
thats page 74
TheUltimates
04/19/2004, 01:55
Originally posted by skyounkin
I always thought the Flash in KC was Wally, BUT I am thinking of a scene where they show GL and Flash looking at each other smiling which could be them remembering their time in the JSA......
But I still think it is wally.
The woman patrolling the Gulag with an Eye patch is Big Barda, and Scott Free Mister Miracle is the "warden"
Plastic man is being stretched in the bar scene between patrons.....
And to my recolection the son of WW and Supes is not Magog, or Gog, but supposedly a care taker of "Hypertime" a nexus point inbetween the many realities of DC, one of the reasons The Kingdom wasn't good is they didn't get Alex Ross on board, second they tried desperatly to connect KC with current DC continuity, which lessened the impact of KC-Alex Ross wanted it to be like 10 years after KC where the big three are raising the son of Superman and Wonder woman, which to me would have been great....oh well.
Enjoy!
I am pretty sure that its also Wally. In the novel, during the bomb part, they say that the Flash's daughter was killed and I also think that they mentioned Wally in there.
DarthDoom
04/19/2004, 02:03
It has to be jay, look at the hat;)
skyounkin
04/19/2004, 02:08
Originally posted by DarthDoom
It has to be jay, look at the hat;)
I think it is Wally and the hat is to honor Jay the 1st Flash....
BUT as I said I could be wrong.....;)
idonthavedsl
04/19/2004, 02:14
It's Barry, Alex Ross has said this many times......Flash looks the way he does because he's become so fast that he can't calm his molecules down.
Originally posted by sundevil
When Superman comes out of retirement and hits the superhero nightclub for recruits, you can see Swamp Thing in a coat and hat and as well as Sherlock Holmes, the Village People, the Question, Solomon Grundy as a bouncer, the Shadow, Wonder Twin Jan (the boy) as a waiter and Watchmen's own Rorshach...not once but TWICE.
Search and enjoy. :)
Best part of those scenes is an overweight Lobo looking a little too much like Beetlejuice and Marvin (Wendy and Marvin of the Superfriends) drinking and taunting Superman. :laugh:
My favorite part of Kingdom Come is an argument between Superman and Batman. Batman is giving Superman a speech and Superman disappears. Batman says "So that's what that feels like..." :laugh:
Kingdom Come and Marvels is filled with wonderful Alex Ross "easter eggs".
Mieir Link
04/19/2004, 02:48
i only have the first two issues of KC, is the fight (if you want to call it that) at the end of the second one the only time we see superman and Magog fight each other?
DarthDoom
04/19/2004, 03:16
Thats no fight, Magog falls on his hands and knees before superman lays a punch or even a heat vision. Magog is a joke If you want my Opinion.
impulse1121
04/19/2004, 03:16
good lord man....if you have any love or respect for Kingdom Come do not repeat do not read the Kingdom.....it was total #### instead find the audio book for Kingdom come its as close to a full length movie as we'll ever get, it has multiple actors playing the roles, its almost like the old Shadow radio dramas from back in the day, you can probably find it on ebay....its worth it youll love it....:) ;) ;)
Paptimus
04/19/2004, 06:16
Magog is a joke If you want my Opinion.
That's exactly what I think, and that's why I was highly surprised to see him as powerful as they made him in HC.
And for the Flash being Barry, it wouldn't surprise me, Ross being the Silver age fan that we know...
It would make sense that Magog and Superman look like they're related- they were based off the same model. Like Barda and Wonder Woman.
impulse1121
04/19/2004, 20:13
did any one catch ......believe it or not spiderman in the book
shiffy0295
04/19/2004, 20:44
ok im here to shed some of my vviews on this thread
1. in the bar scene, you can see the skeleton man (who tells norman about the spectre) in alot of scenes where norman is shown.
2. magog in some way is superman and wonder womans son as in the kingdom Gog steals supermans baby and says something about him being his magog.
3. the flash is wally. his two kids are named Barry and Iris, in honor of the previous flash and his wife.
hope the clears up some stuff
NickFury15
04/19/2004, 22:24
Magog isn't a joke. He didn't fight Superman because that's not what he wanted to go. I don't have the novel with me, but I believe he says something like, "Every day a million ghosts haunt me. Kill me, lock me up, I don't care. Just make the ghosts go away." He was crushed by what he did in Kansas. If Kansas hadn't happened, he'd have fought Superman. He had challenged him to a fight before. Of course, if Kansas didn't happen, Superman would have stayed away.
It's the little things in Kingdom Come that make you realize how truly powerful Magog is.
1.) The Bat Sentry's arm breaking off on him.
2.) The burn trail behind Superman after he was shot.
3.) The surprised look on Superman's face after he was shot. It looked like he was thinking, "That didn't kill me?" The others there were shocked at the power as well.
In the Kingdom, doesn't the same basic staff kill normal Superman's with only one shot?
NickFury15
04/19/2004, 22:27
I'd also say that Magog is the epidamy of Arch Enemies. He may have never really fought Superman, but I still think of him as more of an Arch Enemy than Batman and Joker, or Spiderman and Green Goblin.
Being an Arch Enemy isn't about fighting somebody a lot. It's about the affect they've had on your life. Magog completely ruined Superman's life.
Har!Bandit
04/19/2004, 22:35
Well, Superman obviously made his Impervious roll.
Howard d. duck
04/19/2004, 22:43
Did anybody notice when the press was interviewing the JLA how one of the photographers had an eyepatch (Marvels), and the picture of King Tut in planet Krypton. Also how the planning table at the Mankind Liberation front looked like the table in Doctor Strangelove.
Originally posted by NickFury15
Actually, in Kingdom Come, the Spectre isn't Jason Blood. It's Jim Corrigan, the original Spectre. I believe Kingdom Come was written before Hal became the Spectre.
D'OH!
Double checking proved you right!
I guess Jim takes back the horrific mantle (he was the best at it)
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