Marvel/DC Battles: TEAM Tournament Of Champions: FINAL MATCH

[DTM]

And Here We Are, Ladies and Gentlemen, after the long road to victory we Finally have our two Teams that will battle it out for the title of Ultimate Winners.

One the one hand we have the Avengers, who have defeated the Hellfire Club, The Inhumans, Freedom Fighters and Young Justice to get here.

On the other hand you have the JSA, who have beaten such teams as the Frightful Four, Defenders, JLA #3 and the Titans to reach this point.

WHO will claim the title of Grand Champions of this Team Tournament.....that, as always, is up to YOU.


AVENGERS #1 VS. JSA


Avengers #1 – Captain America, Iron Man, Vision, Giant Man, Scarlet Witch

JSA – Flash I, Power Girl, Hawkman, Mr. Terrific, Starman (Jack), Atom Smasher


As always, same rules apply, no time to prepare, POOFed from where ever they were, with only what they routinely carry on them, to fight in a Large area til one stands and one falls. YOU decide Who.

Randomly Chosen Area:


Plains – Basic open area, a few trees and bushes, minor hills, plenty of grass, etc.


Thanks all, and enjoy.

And REMEMBER, if youre not sure who someone is here, ASK. Theres PLENTY of people here who can tell you most anything youd like to know. Thanks again.


TEAM TOURNAMENT OF CHAMPIONS


ROUND 1

Jusitce League #1 VS. Justice League #3: Justice League #3
(Steel, Metamorpho, Firestorm, Hawkgirl, Black Canary, Rocket Red)

Titans VS. JSA: JSA
(Flash I, Power Girl, Hawkman, Mr. Terrific, Starman (Jack), Atom Smasher)

Marauders VS. Hellfire Club: Hellfire Club
(Sebastian Shaw, Emma Frost, Harry Leland, Donald Pierce, Trevor Fitzroy, Shinobi Shaw, Frederick Von Roehm)

X-Men #1 VS. Legion Of Super-Heroes #1: X-Men #1
(Banshee, Colossus, Cyclops, Nightcrawler, Storm, Wolverine)

Alpha Flight VS. Avengers #2: Avengers #2
(Wonder Man, Warbird, Hawkeye, Wasp, Crystal, Spider-Man)

Defenders VS. Masters Of Evil #1: Defenders
(Dr. Strange, Namor, Beast, Black Knight, Valkyrie, Hellcat)

Fantastic Four VS. X-Force: Fantastic Four
(Mr. Fantastic, Invisible Woman, Human Torch, Thing, She Hulk)

Sinister Six VS. X-Men #2: X-Men #2
(Phoenix, Gambit, Rogue, Archangel (metal wings), Havok, Bishop, Iceman (Pre Emma Frost))

Frightful Four VS. The Brotherhood: Frightful Four
(Wizard, Klaw, Blastaar, Trapster, Absorbing Man)

Legion Of Super-Heroes #2 VS. New Warriors: Legion Of Super-Heroes #2
(Princess Projectra, Star Boy, Timber Wolf, Karate Kid, Tellus, Shrinking Violet, Lightning Lass)

Avengers #1 VS. Young Justice: Avengers #1
(Captain America, Iron Man, Vision, Giant Man, Scarlet Witch)

Freedom Fighters VS. Secret Society Of Super-Villians: Freedom Fighters
(Uncle Sam, Miss America, The Ray, Magno, Black Condor, The Human Bomb, “Iron” Monroe, Phantom Lady, Max Mercury)

Masters Of Evil #2 VS. Outsiders: Outsiders
(Geo-Force, Katana, Looker, Halo, Black Lightning, Atomic Knight, Arsenal, Terra II)

Justice League #2 VS. Excalibur: Justice League #2
(Batman, Plastic Man, Green Arrow, Aquaman, Wonder Woman, Huntress)

New Mutants VS. Exiles: Exiles
(Blink, Thunderbird (Non War Mode), Nocturne, The Mimic, Sunfire, Sasquatch, Magik, Morph)

Inhumans VS. Suicide Squad: Inhumans
(Gorgon, Black Bolt (No Voice Attacks), Karnak, Medusa, Triton, Lockjaw)


ROUND 2

Avengers #2 VS. Defenders: Defenders
(Dr. Strange, Namor, Beast, Black Knight, Valkyrie, Hellcat)

Inhumans VS. X-Men #2: Inhumans
(Gorgon, Black Bolt (No Voice Attacks), Karnak, Medusa, Triton, Lockjaw)

JSA VS. Justice League #3: JSA
(Flash I, Power Girl, Hawkman, Mr. Terrific, Starman (Jack), Atom Smasher)

Avengers #1 VS. Freedom Fighters: Avengers #1
(Captain America, Iron Man, Vision, Giant Man, Scarlet Witch)

X-Men #1 VS. Hellfire Club: Hellfire Club
(Sebastian Shaw, Emma Frost, Harry Leland, Donald Pierce, Trevor Fitzroy, Shinobi Shaw, Frederick Von Roehm)

Frightful Four VS. Exiles: Frightful Four
(Wizard, Klaw, Blastaar, Trapster, Absorbing Man)

Legion Of Super-Heroes #2 VS. Outsiders: Legion Of Super-Heroes #2
(Princess Projectra, Star Boy, Timber Wolf, Karate Kid, Tellus, Shrinking Violet, Lightning Lass)

Fantastic Four VS. Justice League #2: Fantastic Four
(Mr. Fantastic, Invisible Woman, Human Torch, Thing, She Hulk)


ROUND 3

Defenders VS. JSA: JSA
(Flash I, Power Girl, Hawkman, Mr. Terrific, Starman (Jack), Atom Smasher)

Fantastic Four VS. Frightful Four: Frightful Four
(Wizard, Klaw, Blastaar, Trapster, Absorbing Man)

Avengers #1 VS. Inhumans: Avengers #1
(Captain America, Iron Man, Vision, Giant Man, Scarlet Witch)

Legion Of Super-Heroes #2 VS. Hellfire Club: Hellfire Club
(Sebastian Shaw, Emma Frost, Harry Leland, Donald Pierce, Trevor Fitzroy, Shinobi Shaw)


ROUND 4

Frightful Four VS. JSA: JSA
(Flash I, Power Girl, Hawkman, Mr. Terrific, Starman (Jack), Atom Smasher)

Avengers #1 VS. Hellfire Club: Avengers #1
(Captain America, Iron Man, Vision, Giant Man, Scarlet Witch)


FINAL MATCH

Avengers #1 VS. JSA: ??????

[krone]

I am gonna go Avengers on this one. I think Iron mans sensors might be able to tag Flash. Cap beaths the tar out of Hawkman as soon as he charges down.

[Cryomancer]

this is about as even a fight as we're ever gonna get, but i give a slight edge to the JSA. JSA gets my vote.

[Laenan]

Avengers.

[thugit]

JSA

[Maniac_nmt]

a pretty even fight, the avengers just nudge out the win here.

A big moment in the fight could come when vision, seeing Staman absorb shots thanks to the staff, and doing other stuff with it phases it out of his hands (a trick he's pulled on firelord), effectively taking him out of the fight.

This is the best match of the tourney (wouldn't be the finalists if they weren't some of the top dogs).

[proditor]

Gotta go JSA. The team with more experience has been pulling it out time and again. Here's more or less how I see it going down.

The groups spot each other and explode into action.
Round One:
Flash shoots forward and KO's Scarlet Witch (Following his general "Where will I be most useful?" MO)
Power Girl ties up Iron Man. This one goes on for a bit.
Atom Smasher tackles Giant-Man. Same as above, no quick KO.
Starman tackles Vision and ties him up.
Mister Terrific and Hawkman jump Captain America.

Round Two:
Power Girl and Iron Man continue their dance.
Atom-Smasher and Giant-Man do as well.
Starman continues to hold off Vision.
Mister Terrific, Flash and Hawkman KO Captain America, but Hawkman falls as well.

Round Three:
Flash and Atom Smasher take down Giant-Man.
Power Girl and Mister Terrific tie-up Iron Man.
Vision takes down Starman

Round Four:
Flash and Atom Smasher double team vision and Flash's vibartions drop the Android and himself.
Iron Man drops Power Girl but is in lousy shape by now.

Round Five:
Atom Smasher and Mister Terrific take down a severely pummeled IM through raw strength and T-spheres. Atom-Smasher drops as well however, leaving Mister Terrific still standing.

Winner: JSA

[SumYungGai]

Holy crow! Now this is a fight!


Round One.
Starman and Mr. Terrific can handle Iron Man and Vision.
Atom Smasher and Giant man are a draw.
Scarlet Witch will stymie Power Girl and Hawkman.
Flash will try to KO Cap

Round Two:
Flash will give up on Cap to KO S.Witch.
PowerGirl will move on to assist A.Smasher with Giantman
Hawkman and Cap get to business.
Starman & Mr.T./Iron Man&Vision continues

Round Three:
Giantman goes down.
Cap will throw his sheild to KO the Flash. Hawkman presses the attack to keep Cap away from his shield. Cap now in a defensive battle.
Terrific's invisibility to electronics is pivotal in taking Iron Man down. Vision's intangilbility saves him for now.

Round Four:
Cap fights valiantly, but can't defend against Hawkman and Atom Smasher.
Vision's solar blasts can't get through Starman's Cosmic Rod. He resorts to turning diamond hard. The T-Spheres and Power Girl take him down.

Winner: JSA

[Grinner]

Okay, I'm going to have to think about this one a bit before I decide, but let's throw the fanboy votes and explanations out here now, so they don't all have to write them over and over :p :rolleyes: :laugh:

Pro-JSA: "Like, the Flash wil zum over and ko Skarlet Witch and Cap b4 they even kno their teleported. He'll also run up Giant Man & pants him. Atum Smashr gets sooooo much bigger than little GiANT man that he'll just squish him. Mr. Terriffik will figure out how to shut off Vision, leaving evryone elze to beat up the drunk in the tin can."

Pro-Avengers: "d00d, no-1 can evr beat Captain America. He beat the Red Skrull with a Comic Cube, he was gonna kill Odinforse Thor, he cant looz. He'z so much kooler than that stoopid Oober-Bat. And Wanda could hex the Jsa so they all loose there powers or sumthin. And nun ov them can hurt Vizion, so he could beet them all. And Iron Man is immune to all there powerz and his suit can hurt anyone and Giant Man wold kick that wannabee Atom Loser's @$$ so the Avengers will win in 10 sekunds without evr beeing hit."

[NickFury15]

I'm going with the JSA as well. Not just because they're my favorites, but power/experience wise they are superior.

This is one of the most even fights you'll see.

[CaptainMarvel]

WOW! What a tussle.

START!

Flash speeds toward the Avengers, IM picks him up on his sensors and Scarlet throws a quick hex in his Direction. Flash is down or at least he will be shortly. The rest of the JSA approaches, Powergirl lets it rip on IM and sends him flying however Vision is on her fast. Vision and Power girl tussle for a while.

Hawkman lays a thundered pounding on Cap as he fly’s by. Problem is, not knowing that Caps shield absorbed just about all of the blow Cap gets the jump on him next time around. I say Cap drops him in a long drawn out fight.

I see IM getting back in the fight quickly and taking down Power girl with the help of Vision however Powergirl takes Vision out before she falls.

Giantman and SW can hold up the rest of the JSA for a little while allowing IM to get back in the fray.

So you have SW, IM and Giantman vs. Starman, Atomsmasher, and Mr. terrific.

This is tough I don't really know how to stage the rest of this. Maybe some one can help me out. LMK how you think it will go and maybe we can get a conclusion.

Both teams have a chance at winning and deserve to as well
.

[DTM]

Have THIS team of the JSA really been around longer than Iron Man, Cap America and this team of Avengers? Many JSA voters here give them the edge in experience, but is that really so? When comparing this JSAs members with the Avengers members, in experience, arent they really closer to even or even in the Avengers favor?

[CaptainMarvel]

Giantman is an OG as well. DTM

[dj_sha]

The first is still the best. JSA wins it all. Close battle though. In my opinion it'll come down to whether Iron Man and SW KO Flash before he can cause a lot of damage (remember, this guy has been around for many years so would be wise to some target and shoot tricks).

[proditor]

Well, Hawkman has everyone in the contest beat in terms of experience. 3000+ years to draw from IIRC. Flash has been around at least as long as Cap and didn't spend 40 or so years in an iceberg. The others have been trained by the best and they work like a well oiled machine (As do the Avengers.) The difference here to me is that a lot depends on the "when" of the characters. I seem to recall it is the most recent incarnations unless otherwise stated. Based on that they have rough parity in team experience since the Avengers roster has fluctuated more. Cap is a tactical monster, but so is Hawkman. Flash is no slouch either. I give the edge to the JSA based on the senior membership and their experiences. Just because they worked together originally does not mean they will necessarily gel well. Something that was pointed out in the Avengers title when they had the most powerful individuals ever and still had team/co-ordination issues. (The Triune, the Thunderbolts, Whirlwind, etc. etc.)

[DareDevil_13]

I'm going to say that the Avengers will win.

Scarlet Witch will use her Hex powers to continually cause Flash to trip
Vision can become almost transparent too as durable as Adamantium.
Cap's an all around leader and a top notch combatant.

Hawkman is a great Combatant, but not on Cap's level.
Power Woman and Atom Smasher are heavy hitters, I'm sure they could take down Giant Man, at least.
Starman and Mr. Terrific would take on Iron Man, but I think that if Tony takes on Starman first, he'll have a better chance of winning. No offense to Mr. Terrific, but he's not on the same power level as Starman and Iron Man.

It'll be close, but I feel that the Avengers have a better mix of powers.

[Grinner]

Originally posted by DTM
Have THIS team of the JSA really been around longer than Iron Man, Cap America and this team of Avengers? Many JSA voters here give them the edge in experience, but is that really so? When comparing this JSAs members with the Avengers members, in experience, arent they really closer to even or even in the Avengers favor?

I'd call it pretty close overall.

Flash & Hawkman started this game before Steve Rogers was rated 4F and didn't have the big "I'm frozen in an iceberg" sabbatical. And that's not taking into account Hawkman's literal lifetimes of experience.

Power Girl & Vision are about equal. Atom Smasher would be around this level, but slightly below.

Hank, Wanda & Tony have more experience than the relatively (for this group of people) new Jack & Mr. Terrific.

I don't think either team has an aggregate experience advantage.

[DareDevil-fan]

JSA wins the title!

[Sundance_Kid]

I think that you guys are discounting Scarlet Witch a little to0 early. I mean these are two teams that don't really know each other because of the cross universe thing. So I am going to say that scarlet witch will get at least one hex off, before flash even thinks to try to take her out. I do not the these JSA member to well. Do they have a leader even close to par with Captain America? He is the glue that holds this team together. If they do not have info on each other, I think that the Avengers will get an advantage here. Captain America is the utlimate tactican. If you guys can give some background on the JSA members to help me out here. My first inclination is to vote Avengers.

[SumYungGai]

Hawkman and Flash trump everyone in raw experience. Hawkman for reasons Proditor already mentioned, and Flash's adventures predate World War 2, and his decades in "limbo" were spent fighting in Ragnarok, not floating in an iceberg.

Otherwise, these Avengers have a lot more experience than these JSAers. Atom Smasher might approach their experience level as a former member of Infinity Inc. and the Justice League. Power Girl is also no slouch in experience. I suppose Starman and Mr. Terrific are the relative newbs in this battle. However, they are pretty well distinguished considering their relatively short careers.

[proditor]

Heck, even the Bat thinks Mister Terrific is terrifyingly competant in the brains/tactics category...

[DreadDormammu]

I think the Avengers team is a little deeper, having four big threats. They actually have an experience edge too IMO. Only Flash and Hawkman are old school on this JSA lineup.

That being said, I still don't see anyone beating Flash and Power Girl. Power Girl is monstrously tough: too tough for this tourney IMO. And I don't see anyone touching Flash reliably.

Hard to pick. I will vote JSA since they have a numbers advantage and Power Girl (who can fight people like Superman and Captain Marvel).

[thugit]

I think Flash is too much for the Avengers to overcome. Once Cap goes down, they won't function as well.....(now for the part that makes people mad....)

I think Hawkman would beat Cap a fair majority of the time! He would beat Batman, too!

[bluebeetle]

THE JSA!!

[Rando]

I vote JSA

Flash zips over and ko's Wanda, Iron Man has to think to attack anyone, and Witch's hexes are slow getting started and since Flash can cross this arena before Tony can think to attack him it should be no problem for him to take out Scarlet Witch early. PowerGirl, Starman, and Hawkman engage Vision and Iron Man in an intense aerial battle. Atom Smasher and Giant Man go at it because, hey you know they have to. Mr.Terriffic and his t-Spheres engage Captain America. seeing the battle turn against Terriffic, Flash moves in and attacks Captain America, as Jay moves thousands of times faster than Cap even his perfect reflexes and incredible combat prowess fall to the combined might of T-sphere's, Mr.Terriffic, and speed force. The other battles continue, no clear winner yet in sight. Terriffic and Flash join Atom Smasher, in my opinion Atom Smasher can beat Giant Man in a direct brawl and Terriffic and Flash can nullify his other tricks, the three of them take Giant Man out of the equation Terrific a little worse for wear and Atom Smasher reasonably beat up, all of the aerial combatants are still at it, the tremendous combat taking its toll. Here is where the battle turns sour for the Avengers, with the ground crew dispatched Flash, Atom Smasher, and Terriffic can aid their team in the air. Terrific possess a true ranged attack in hsi T-sphere's and they can also provide distraction with holograms as well as do numerous other things, they (and Teriffic) himself are also machine invisible, Vision can't detect him or his stuff at all, and Tony is going to have to depend in his own ability alone, his sensory equipment won't work. Flash and Atom Smasher are relgated to throwing things, but even that can be useful so long as there are true flyers in the air as well to engage the opposition. Furthermore the JSA members now have the option of trying to drive the combat to the ground so that Atom Smasher and Flash can engage in the fight in ernest (this shouldn't be a problem for Power Girl,as she is the physically strongest person on the field, it will take a lot more finageling for Hawkman and Starman). When the battle is finally over I would expect Power Girl, Terriffic, and Flash to still be standing, although very shaken up, but the winners nonethless. The real lynchpin is that the JSA can dominate on the ground because of Flash, this is his victory more than anyones.

[Swiftspeedster]

yeah gotta go with the JSA, Mr. Terrific I would say is about up there in strtegy with CAp, and then you also have Hawkman and Flash. I don't see Wanda taking out Jay here with one hex, and once she does a hex then she's not going to be around for very much longer. The JSA I think just works together better than the Avengers (knowing eachother and becoming more like family) and they could eventually take out the Avengers not easily, but if anyone could do it they could.

[SpakSpang]

I am tentatively voting for JSA, but my question is what is the JSAs answer for phasing Vision?

I don't believe Iron Man's targeting computer can target accurately someone running faster than the speed of sound...and then being able to hit him is even more unlikely.

Iron Man will most likely be dealing with the flyers on the JSA anyway.

Hawkman and Captain America would be an interesting fight.

Giant Man vs Atom Smasher will also be interesting.

The two wildcards I am unsure of with this team is Scarlet Witch and Vision.

Captain America I think is the least threatening on the Avengers team. Flash could take Captain America down fairly easily.

[Maniac_nmt]

I could see flash zipping by to KO cap, tagging him thinking it's enough when it momentarily stuns Cap, only to see him stagger up a few seconds later (haggard but not out). In addition to the body armor he wears, Cap's superior human physique stave off what should have been a 'man to the mat' blow. Jay is shocked just long enough for Cap to fling his shield just off the mark, Jay thinks his blow has affected Cap worse then it did, and never sees the shield's return bounce to the back of the head. Leaving a worn and haggard Cap stumbling back into the fight.

Atom Smasher and Giant Man mix it up, but Hank is fighting a loosing battle, while he gives back well, he just knows he's loosing. Shock of shocks Pym suddenly dissapears as he shrinks as fast as he can to ant size. Some well applied Pym particles drop Atom Smasher, who unfortunately falls on hank KOing each in the process.

Power Girl and Iron Man lock horns and give as good as they get on both sides, neither seemingly able to gain the upper hand.

Vision squares off with Starman, seeing his laser blasts have no effect, and observing the staff's power, he phases and nabs the staff from Jack, and KO's him with a punch. Vision unfornately never sees Hawkman screaming in from behind, and is dropped by a mace to the back of the head.

Meanwhile Wanda is giving Mr. Terrific fits. She can't out mussle him, but he's weaponry just keeps malfunctioning, or he keeps misjudging the mark when he goes to attack her. A worn down Cap turns the tide though, and combined they do the improbable and take down Mr. T. Hawkman has circled back in and screams in for the kill against Wanda. Cap heroically jumps head first into the charging Carter, in an attempt to protect his teammate. It works, but the impact is to much even for Cap's amazing will power, and the collision takes him out of the fight along with hawkman.

Tony and Powergirl are still seemingly in a battle neither can win, but time is wearing on Tony. He just can't maintain the battle like this out to the same duration. He doesn't have to though, Wanda's nick of time hex's tip the balance of power, and the Avengers pull of a narrow victory over their toughest foes of the tourney. A worn out Wanda, and an Iron Man baddly in need of a mechanic.

of course, that's only one possible way. It's a 51/49 esque match for me.

[CaptainMarvel]

I entered this Avengers team, that's right it's my creation FINALY one of my nominees wasn't deemed too powerful for one of DTM's threads.:grin:

You know what kills the Avengers in this fight.....it's the JSA's extra member. Without Mr. Terrific I see this as almost an equal battle with the edge going to the Avengers. With Mr. Terrific I see the advantage going to the JSA.

I have to vote JSA they are just a better team in this form.

I'm not complaining that there are to many members on the JSA team because it's still pretty even. I'm just saying they have the edge in this battle.

I will say this and everyone seems to agree that it’s close. Congrats to the JSA I think they win but they will never face a team that fought as hard this Avenger team. Nor will they ever want too after this one is over.

[Maniac_nmt]

i would look at it this way

leadership - narrow fraction to avengers
experience - narrow fraction to JSA
team work - about even
power - about even
wild cards - about even.

[wolfwood13]

JSA > avengers

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by thugit
I think Hawkman would beat Cap a fair majority of the time! He would beat Batman, too! If we are doing the current incarnation of Hawkman, I have to disagree with you, Thugit. This Hawkman fights at about Green Arrow's level (as seen in the fight against Green Arrow in the Hawkman series). He would give Cap a good fight, but not beat him. Especially since Cap has a perfect answer to the type of weaponry Carter uses.

[supermangl1]

Important things to remember,
1.Mr. Terrific is invisble to machine detection. His T-Spheres and T mask are designed so.
2. Flash is much much faster then any speedster in Marvel.
3. Powergirl is very hard to knock out, she is no slouch.
4. Hawkman and Cap would fight for a long time.
5. Vision can go intangable.

Could Iron Man target Mr. Terrific or would he have to aim manually? Same going for Vision.

I say honestly that the JSA take this one in a very close much. All mainly to more people, and the fact Flash will knock out before any of the Avengers can move to stop him. That is a big lose for the Avengers. The Giant Man and Atom Smasher fight would be one for the ages, along with Hawkman and Terrific fighting Cap. Terrific is an outstanding hth fighter and Hawkman has well 3000 years of training. Look at the Black Reign storyline to see what Hawkman can do. I say Cap will lose to Terrific and Hawkman, and the Flash will move in too.
The giants tussle, Starman fight vision.
Ironman and Powergirl fight.
Starman loses to vision.
Cap loses to the three, and all are still standing, very tired but still in it.
Flash helps Atom Smasher to beat Giant Man.
Hawkman moves in on Vision.
Atom Smasher turns to Ironman along with the Flash.
Hawkman falls and so does Ironman.
Leaving Terrific, Atom Smasher, Flash, Power Girl to fight Vision. Vision loses.

my vote = JSA

But honestly this is one great match!

[Silver Lantern]

I am voting JSA for now just to PO Maniac NMT ;), but as soon as GA makes an appearance, I'll have to do my customary Marvel Zombie switch to the Avengers. ;)
MAYBE!
The arguments are pretty compelling on the part of the JSA. We will just have to wait and see.

[Silver Ghost]

Wow, excellent final match!

Very close match up, but in the end I have to vote for the....
























JSA!!!!:)

[Thanosied]

Holy #### I leave for a week and this ####ty JSA squad with the ####ty Flash somehow go through everyteam of alltime. What the hell is wrong with people?

AVENGERS
AVENGERS
AVENGERS

I say Vision and Iron Man alone beat this JSA squad and if they can't then this JSA squad could easily take down THANOS WITH THE GAUNTLET!!!!

The 3 key pieces are missing and people still think they could beat any team, am I the only one who sees this? The experience issue isn't an issue... Cap beats Hawkman in a heartbeat, IronMan kills the rest. The VISION, for gods sake should kill everyone out right but I guess the JSA - Sentinel, Dr.Fate and Shazam can beat the entire 7 man JLA, all the X-Men, The Avengers, The FF and Thanos with the gauntlet and still make it home for supper in time.. OH MY GOD.... /CRY. What is this world coming to?

[SumYungGai]

I had not considered the possibility of the Vision going intangible and taking the Cosmic Rod from Jack. Is this plausible? Can Vision move through forcefields of Starman's caliber?

On the flip side of the coin, could the Cosmic Rod #### all of the solar energy out the Vision?

[Prof. Aragorn]

It's a tough call, The Avengers do and will put up a tough front. The JSAers have that extra member that can double team and make the fights go faster. However the two teams provide the ultimately equals. Hawkman's combat skills and weapons block his shield, Iron Man and Vision may have difficulty spotting Mr. Terrific, Giant Man and Atom Smasher are near equals save for the superstrength of A.S.
If the witch can at least see Jay once, he's in some trouble with all the hexing, Powergirl is extremely strong and could easily tie up Tony for a bit. Vision's solar vision will have trouble with Jack's rod. Very close battles in a very close fight. I would have to go with the JSA due to that extra member.
Vote: JSA

[eltigrediablo]

Man, forget JLA/Avengers, *this* is the throwdown I'd most like to see!

I agree with the thinking that it'd be close, and that the JSA would win it in the end.

No comics writer would *ever* write it that way, but based on the abilities and skills everyone would bring to this fight, I think the JSA would almost certainly win.

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by CaptainMarvel
I entered this Avengers team, that's right it's my creation FINALY one of my nominees wasn't deemed too powerful for one of DTM's threads.:grin:

You know what kills the Avengers in this fight.....it's the JSA's extra member. Without Mr. Terrific I see this as almost an equal battle with the edge going to the Avengers. With Mr. Terrific I see the advantage going to the JSA.

I have to vote JSA they are just a better team in this form.

I'm not complaining that there are to many members on the JSA team because it's still pretty even. I'm just saying they have the edge in this battle.

I will say this and everyone seems to agree that it’s close. Congrats to the JSA I think they win but they will never face a team that fought as hard this Avenger team. Nor will they ever want too after this one is over.

That's as honest as you'll get in these biased tournaments.

And I agree. It's a dead-on even match until you factor in Mr. Terrific. He'll be the bane of both the Vision and Iron Man since he and his T-Spheres are invisible to the two. I see the Avengers vaunted teamwork taking a significant hit as Cap screams out field orders to Iron Man to "Take out Mr. Fair Play!!!" and Iron man responding with a "Mr. Who??? I don't see anyone, do you Vis?" "No, I concur, there is no one there. Perhaps one of out combatants is an illusionist..."

This fight should go to the Avengers but the JSA win due to numbers.

JSA

[Maniac_nmt]

I dunno, Vis has used this trick in the past though, going clean through firelord, and nabbing the staff

[CaptainMarvel]

Originally posted by GoldenAge
That's as honest as you'll get in these biased tournaments.

And I agree. It's a dead-on even match until you factor in Mr. Terrific. He'll be the bane of both the Vision and Iron Man since he and his T-Spheres are invisible to the two. I see the Avengers vaunted teamwork taking a significant hit as Cap screams out field orders to Iron Man to "Take out Mr. Fair Play!!!" and Iron man responding with a "Mr. Who??? I don't see anyone, do you Vis?" "No, I concur, there is no one there. Perhaps one of out combatants is an illusionist..."

This fight should go to the Avengers but the JSA win due to numbers.

JSA

Agreed.

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by Thanosied
I say Vision and Iron Man alone beat this JSA squad Sorry, dude. You have it backwards. Power Girl would have a shot at defeating this entire Avengers squad by herself. Check out the Stealing Thunder storyline in JSA where she is fighting Superman, Black Adam and a host of others all at once. They are possessed and not fighting well, but she can still take multiple hits from these guys and only be slowed down for a moment.
Originally posted by GoldenAge
And I agree. It's a dead-on even match until you factor in Mr. Terrific. He'll be the bane of both the Vision and Iron Man since he and his T-Spheres are invisible to the two.I think you are making a leap here. Mr. Terrific does not have a magic spell that makes him invisible to machines. He is, in fact, invisible to mechanical sensing devices which implies he has blockers against things like infrared and motion detectors. But he is not invisible within the visual spectrum and Iron Man and Vision both use their eyes as much as anyone else. Iron Man might not be able to use computer-aided targetting against Mr. T but will see him as clearly as anyone else would. Vision, as far as I know, doesn't use computerized targetting. He has a synthesized brain that mimics human functions. Vision would not be impaired in any way detecting Mr. T.

I voted for JSA too, but let's not exaggerate here...

[Maniac_nmt]

shrug, I'd agree with vis not being able to spot Mr. T, but certainly not on Iron Man, who can manually target (and tends to prefer to) and has the option to use normal vision to see things (they are eye holes you know, and have routinely been shown to be either sealed, or open depending on what tony needs them to be).

All though, come to think of it, did the vis ever come across the Xmen while they were still under that 'can't be seen by technology' spell? If so, what was the result?

[Silver Lantern]

Originally posted by GoldenAge

This fight should go to the Avengers but the JSA win due to numbers.


Yeah, numbers of raging DC fanboys :o :grin: ;) :p

[Thanosied]

Look I like Starman as much as the next guy but lets face it Iron Man makes him go POFF!! Supergirl is what a little less powerful then Namor? And IronMan beat the Submariner back in the 70's with his #### armour. Move 30 years in the future and add in all the science that is and the fact that none oof these JSA'ers have half the intellect of the Avengers squad.

Sure Ill give you that Helmet Head Flash is about as fast as current Quicksilver and could take out Cap but thats it folks.

The Flash is busy for 20-30 seconds or so with Scarlet Witch the only one else he can affect and does her while Cap beats the living #### out of Hawkman.

Lets talk fighting prowess and I see only Wonder tits as possibly being a better fighter then Cap.

Now the Flash is left with NO HAWKMAN!!! Sure Scarlet Witch and Cap are down but Giant Man and Atom Smasher will slug out longer then this fight will take.

Iron Man whipes the floor with Power slut, and it just goes downhill for the JSA after that. It would take Starman just long enough to tap Visions Power before the Vision goes intangeable and solidifies his arm throw Starman and kills him outright.

Mr. Terrific? Who cares... Invisible is still detectable by Ironman sensors you fools. The guy eats pieit like these pieces of #### like these JSA'ers for breakfast and he will have no problem beating any of thhem in less then 3 comic panels.

Oh no the Flash again? Oh well were fighting at a couple hundred meters above ground now and he is being bothersome and giving Atom some annoying assistance in taking down Giant Man. But oh wait Ironman Uni-beams Atom and he is done sensors go off and the Flash gets dead from another homing strike by Ironman.

I would honestly take just IronMan and Vision against this team and still think that the TeenTitans whole squad and The Batman team of JLA'ers should have easily wiped the floor with these bumbs. But, thats why there are voting things going on and its more what the people like and not the true outcome and I understand that.

I give my honest opinion on what Ive seen in the comics and the outcomes of team battles like who would win and such. I thought there were Avengers Fans out there but I guess they chose not to participate because they new the Avengers would win, Im not sure why else the JSA would win this fight other then the fan boy response.

But oh well I hope that Thanos is well prepared in his citadel with the gauntlet because he is next on the ####ty JSA's hit list.. Oh and after they defeat him with whatever people got, The ####ty JSA will be moving on to bigger and better things like Asgard and Galactus becuase hey what else is left for them to conquer? Thy have already beaten everyone's ### and there is nothing left for them to do.

I mean I could so see a scenario where the helmet headed one spins real fast travels a trillion light years away and gets the Ultimate Nullifier and tricks som person into using it on the Mighty one. LMAO, common seriously now

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by Maniac_nmt
All though, come to think of it, did the vis ever come across the Xmen while they were still under that 'can't be seen by technology' spell? If so, what was the result?I think Vision wouldn't have been able to see the X-Men because that was a magic spell. Mr. Terrific merely blocks common mechanical sensing areas. For example, he is nearly invisible to infrared. But he is not truly invisible, so he would appear on a camera (eg, JSA #38 shows Mr. Terrific in a picture that Jakeem Thunder keeps framed in his bedroom). Since Vision sees the normal spectrum, he would see Mr. Terrific. The real effect Mr. Terrific gets is avoiding all the kinds of stealth-foiling detection. So he can hide from Iron Man and Vision in ways a normal person can't. But he can't stand out in the open without being seen.

[MSU]

JSA

[thugit]

Anybody else get the impression that Thanosied hasn't read any JSA comics?

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
Sorry, dude. You have it backwards. Power Girl would have a shot at defeating this entire Avengers squad by herself. Check out the Stealing Thunder storyline in JSA where she is fighting Superman, Black Adam and a host of others all at once. They are possessed and not fighting well, but she can still take multiple hits from these guys and only be slowed down for a moment.
I think you are making a leap here. Mr. Terrific does not have a magic spell that makes him invisible to machines. He is, in fact, invisible to mechanical sensing devices which implies he has blockers against things like infrared and motion detectors. But he is not invisible within the visual spectrum and Iron Man and Vision both use their eyes as much as anyone else. Iron Man might not be able to use computer-aided targetting against Mr. T but will see him as clearly as anyone else would. Vision, as far as I know, doesn't use computerized targetting. He has a synthesized brain that mimics human functions. Vision would not be impaired in any way detecting Mr. T.

I voted for JSA too, but let's not exaggerate here...

I was under the impression that it was electronic devices period. Mr. T doesn't appear on electronic recording devices that record using the normal visual spectrum. And we know that even Batman was impressed by the electronic cloaking effect of T's.

You are right though. Iron Man CAN use normal sight. I guess I just always imagined that he used his sensors a great deal more than is averagely shown. However, I still contend that the Visions optical devices are no different than sophisticated cameras and, thus, he will be unable to see Mr. Terrific.

Regardless, I’d still give this fight to the JSA on numbers.

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by Thanosied
Supergirl is what a little less powerful then Namor?No. Supergirl is vastly more powerful than Namor. Or did you mean Power Girl? She is vastly more powerful than Namor as well.
Sure Ill give you that Helmet Head Flash is about as fast as current Quicksilver and could take out Cap but thats it folks.Flash is inconceivably faster than Quicksilver. Jay Garrick has broken the light barrier with a little help.
Giant Man and Atom Smasher will slug out longer then this fight will take.Giant Man wouldn't last that long against Atom Smasher. Read old Avengers: Hank Pym is a scientist not a fighter. That's why he didn't last as Giant Man. He sucked at fighting. He sucked a lot.
Iron Man whipes the floor with Power slut, and it just goes downhill for the JSA after that.It may not even be possible for Iron Man to hurt Power Girl.
Vision goes intangeable and solidifies his arm throw Starman and kills him outright.Vision wouldn't be killing anyone. Stop being stupid. :p
I give my honest opinion on what Ive seen in the comics and the outcomes of team battles like who would win and such.The things you are saying make it look like you have read very few Avengers comics and no JSA at all.

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by thugit
Anybody else get the impression that Thanosied hasn't read any JSA comics?I'd take that bet to Vegas, thugit. :grin:

[thugit]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
I'd take that bet to Vegas, thugit. :grin:

Yeah, but it wouldn't pay very well.

;)

[kamui]

Hero A1 vs Hero B1
Hero B2 vs Hero B2
Hero B3 vs Hero B4

Arghhhhhhh, why do we do this? I thought this was a team tournament? I thought everyone worked as a team, it's not Captain America vs Hawkman, Captain America can't fly and doesn't stand a chance against Hawkman. It's not going to be Vision vs Starman, I don't see it this way at all.

So in my opinion, as a team.

My vote: JSA

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
I'd take that bet to Vegas, thugit. :grin:

Oy vey. Sign me up for a fin-back.

[mick77]

JLA, they better has a team

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
It may not even be possible for Iron Man to hurt Power Girl.

No way. Give Tony his due. Iron Man's various attack devices and his inherent ability to think quickly gives him more than a slight chance.

However, I don't think Tony's met anyone on Power Girl's level before (besides Thor) and even the Iron Man armor has limits. A few of Power Gil's best shots could induce that trademarked energy bleed from the chest and hairline fissures that often appear after Iron Man takes massive damage.

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by mick77
JLA, they better has a team

:confused: :confused: :confused:

[SPLITSECOND]

The main problem the Avengers will face is Flash. I really think that they can take the other members of this JSA team. So, the question in my mind is can they take the Flash. I really think that with Wanda's Hex Power they could. So...I vote for the Avengers...but it's going to be a great fight.

[CaptainMarvel]

Originally posted by mick77
JLA, they better has a team

Yeah I'm with GA what with that? How can you vote when you don't even know who is fighting?

[Silver Lantern]

I think that JLA vote should be invalidated too.

[malger]

Originally posted by DTM
Have THIS team of the JSA really been around longer than Iron Man, Cap America and this team of Avengers? Many JSA voters here give them the edge in experience, but is that really so? When comparing this JSAs members with the Avengers members, in experience, arent they really closer to even or even in the Avengers favor?

I think the JSA has the advantage in experience, Hawkman has been reincarnated re[eatedly since ancient Egypt giving him THOUSANDS of years of experience and Flash has been around AND active since WWII. Just those 2 have more experience than the entire Avengers team combined. I jsut don't see the avengers winning this one. I see everyone KO'd except Hawkman and Captain America, but Hawkman takes him down.

[Thanosied]

Holy JSA fanboys. Oh my F'n god. Do you people even know what Ironman can do?

What I get out of the JSA fanboys is that all there versions in this fight are at there maxed out versions of there "BEST DAY IN COMICS"

Okay I take Iron Man in the Avengers/JLA. Or Dr.Strange at his max potential a few rounds back when he was cosmic lvl powered.

Don't be stupid you say it like Power slut woould beat Superman for gods sakes and that The Avengers would be super underpowered or something which is not the case.

Light speed Flash is still a shot away and Mr.T has to shoot sometime. And when he does there is technology that will sense his current location.

Oh look back on the past teams that the JSA has beaten and have a second look at what you FANBOYS are sayong and done..

You beat Firestorm because you put all your members at there most powerful state and them at there weekest.

You somehow beat Absorbing man and Blastaar which I thought not possible myself. And then I thought about if the JSA squad could have beaten the FF team and said HELL NO so maybe thats why you hijacked it do the FF would loose?

I ave no clue. This is a ######## scenario of all your best at the Avengers worst... I can't say anything otherwise to make the JSA readers think that they will loose and have them wonder why they did other then The Avengers don't loose.

Did the Avengers beat JLA #2 just so they could loose to this JSA squad? ####ing Batman, WW, Green Arrow, Plastic Man, Aquaman, Huntress? Could these beat this JSA team?

Well if not I would have all your heads checked by Dr.Phil for Labotomization for sure.

I could put in a scenario where Thor would be on the team and you would still have the JSA win becuase Thor would get blinded by some magical fairy dust power that someone has or something.

Im sorry Robin can beat Ironman and Jubilee beats the Vision and thats how it is.

Holy #### maybe Im wrong and The JSA are THE GREATEST ####ING TEAM OF ALLTIME!!! Maybe I shouldn't have read comics at all? Maybe The JSA could beat the Infinity Watch? Maybe The JSA vs. the Marvel Universe is a definite possibility?

Wow I guess the heralds of galactus vs. The JSA would be pretty close too? Man Mr. T can turn invisible he's got a great chance against the power cosmic and Hawkman has 3000 years of experience in battle so he would give Terrax a run for his money? And the flash runs faster then The Surfer's top flying speed and the Surfer would never hit him and would only see a blur and shoot himself and die.

Oh well Fanboys Im sorry Ive made a mistake here and Ill jump on THE COSMIC POWERED JSA (without there 3 best members).

I change my vote to the JSA for BAN WAGON PURPOSES. All HAIL THE Old man with bowl on head, Angel with a mace, Invisible man, Queer Smasher, Power puss, and Starman the more powerful Annihilus.

Oh I got it now 1 on 1 battle scenario.

Mr.T sucka's Dr.Strange
Flash gets too fast and Silfer Surfer gets dizzy nad falls
Power Girl defeats the SAVAGE HULK by trading blows
Hawkman with 1 million years of experience defeats Cap
Atom Smasher Smashes Thor and Thor doesn't smash back
Starman just has too much freaky deeky skills and makes Thanos diappear.

Marvel Universe is now gone and the JSA go home with party hats and kazooes.

HIP HIP HOORAY, HIP HIP HOORAY!!!!

[Thanosied]

Oh I made a few grammar errors so sue me. I tried to fix but the edit time is down to like 5 minutes. LOL

[New Warrior]

I say Avengers. Scarlett Witch is one of the most powerful. One curse and Flash is tripping. Iron man gets the easy hit on flash after that. Cap would break starmans staff with a shield throw. Mr. T would get an advantage on IM before Vision takes him out with a phasing heart punch. Giantman would beat on power girl but finds that this girl hits back. It would be a while watching Cap and Hawk fight giving the order not to interfere. While they fight it will be Vision Scarlet, and IM vs. Powergirl Atom Smasher and a powerless Starman. Vision will go untouchable as Atom tries to beat him. Powergirl will be getting hit from afar from IMs weapons, as he waits for Vision to get him. In stead A giant mace gets whipped at her head followed by a shield. Vision goes diamond hard and drops ontop of a stumbling powergirl. She falls right next to a fallen Hawkman.

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by Thanosied
Light speed Flash is still a shot away and Mr.T has to shoot sometime. And when he does there is technology that will sense his current location.

What the heck are you talking about????? Mr. Terrific doesn't shoot anything. Thanosied, you need to zip up your pants, your ignorance is hanging out.

In fact. Mr. Terrific has a GREAT chance of bypassing Tony's electrical defenses and remotely tampering with the armor. I realize that this is one of Tony's greatest fears (as it has happened before) and that he's spent a great deal of time and research developing electronic counter counter measures, but it's still a possibility with a guy like Mr.T. Especially if the armors suffered a couple of blows from Power Girl. In fact I'd go so far as to say with the use of his T-Spheres Mr. Terrific may be able to influence the Vision (though this is pretty far fetched).

[hawkeye2831]

I vote Avengers.

[Thanosied]

LOL, my ignorance knows no bounds. You all should know that by now my god. JEZZZ!!!

[SumYungGai]

Originally posted by Thanosied
Oh I made a few grammar errors so sue me. I tried to fix but the edit time is down to like 5 minutes. LOL

I'm glad you couldn't change it. That was seriously the best thing I have ever read on these forums. My fondest wish is that you can make such scintillating posts everyday. Now that the tournament is over, it can be replaced with Thanosied's rant of the day.

[KingBlackBolt]

avengers should have been out a while ago plus flash is too fast for the avengers to handle. This marvel fanboy is going to have to vote for the JSA.

[JayThor]

I gotta say, this would be a very close fight.

JSA gets the nudge. If Thor were there, this is easily Avengers. If Green Lantern or Captain Marvel were there, it would be clearly JSA.

Mr. Terrific and Cap are evenly matched. Hawkman throws the odds Mr. T's way.
Atom Smasher clobbers Giant Man
Flash KO's Scarlet Witch
Starman traps Vision (he can't phase through energy)
Iron Man barely beats Powergirl

Atom Smasher, Flash, Mr. Terrific, and Hawkman gang up on Iron Man, fight over.

[CapAmerica24]

Originally posted by thugit
I think Flash is too much for the Avengers to overcome. Once Cap goes down, they won't function as well.....(now for the part that makes people mad....)

I think Hawkman would beat Cap a fair majority of the time! He would beat Batman, too!

In total agreement...

I vote for the team that I entered into this contest, the JSA.

[GreatArelius1]

I dont think Flash will be a big factor, since its open and will be picked up on Iron man's sensors. Gives a chance to Iron to send a volley or Scarlet witch a hex. Giant will draw the attention of Power girl and one other, so no doubel vs. Avengers.

[Sgt.Hatch]

I feel that the avengers have the adavantage. This team has too many star players, and have worked together alot more than this jsa team.

vote = avengers

[Silver Lantern]

Thanoseid: ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!

That is classic DC fan interpretation. Hawkman has 1 million years of experience. :grin:
LMAO @ starman's freeky deeky skillz.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Heh, Powerpuff girl is SOOO Powerful she could smash Krona AND Galactus with the concussive force of her wink. :grin:

[GreatArelius1]

Originally posted by Maniac_nmt
I could see flash zipping by to KO cap, tagging him thinking it's enough when it momentarily stuns Cap, only to see him stagger up a few seconds later (haggard but not out). In addition to the body armor he wears, Cap's superior human physique stave off what should have been a 'man to the mat' blow. Jay is shocked just long enough for Cap to fling his shield just off the mark, Jay thinks his blow has affected Cap worse then it did, and never sees the shield's return bounce to the back of the head. Leaving a worn and haggard Cap stumbling back into the fight.

Atom Smasher and Giant Man mix it up, but Hank is fighting a loosing battle, while he gives back well, he just knows he's loosing. Shock of shocks Pym suddenly dissapears as he shrinks as fast as he can to ant size. Some well applied Pym particles drop Atom Smasher, who unfortunately falls on hank KOing each in the process.

Power Girl and Iron Man lock horns and give as good as they get on both sides, neither seemingly able to gain the upper hand.

Vision squares off with Starman, seeing his laser blasts have no effect, and observing the staff's power, he phases and nabs the staff from Jack, and KO's him with a punch. Vision unfornately never sees Hawkman screaming in from behind, and is dropped by a mace to the back of the head.

Meanwhile Wanda is giving Mr. Terrific fits. She can't out mussle him, but he's weaponry just keeps malfunctioning, or he keeps misjudging the mark when he goes to attack her. A worn down Cap turns the tide though, and combined they do the improbable and take down Mr. T. Hawkman has circled back in and screams in for the kill against Wanda. Cap heroically jumps head first into the charging Carter, in an attempt to protect his teammate. It works, but the impact is to much even for Cap's amazing will power, and the collision takes him out of the fight along with hawkman.

Tony and Powergirl are still seemingly in a battle neither can win, but time is wearing on Tony. He just can't maintain the battle like this out to the same duration. He doesn't have to though, Wanda's nick of time hex's tip the balance of power, and the Avengers pull of a narrow victory over their toughest foes of the tourney. A worn out Wanda, and an Iron Man baddly in need of a mechanic.

of course, that's only one possible way. It's a 51/49 esque match for me.

I can really see the battle going this way. Vote for Avengers.

[Nighthawk]

I say the Defenders beat the Justice League of Antarctica.
:)
oh, right, this is a different fight.

I don't know why everyone has Flash KO'ing Scarlet Witch first, she would not be the first threat he sees.

Cap and Witch have fought many speedsters. quicksilver, Whizzer, among others. Extensively trained with Quicksilver. They will have an idea how to fight Flash.

Obviously Atom Smasher and GiantMan fight, tying each other up for a while.

Vision and Iron Man will take to the air, and Power Girl and Hawkman and Starman will engage them. Power Girl fighting Iron Man. Hawkman will not have an idea of what Vision will do and Vision will drop him like a stone.

Mr. T. will watch.

AS takes out GM.
Power Girl and Iron Man take each other out. Tony, seeing he is losing, rigs the armor to sacrifice himself to ake PG out.
Captain America will hold out long enough for the Witch to take out the Flash. The Mr. T Takes her out.
Vision takes out Starman.

AS and Terrific fight Captain America and Vision.

Terrific could take Vision, but he ends up fighting Cap. Cap, thinking he can take AS, says to Vision "take him". Vision, not seeing Terrific, engages AS. Cap says, "No the other guy" Vision says "What other guy" and is stuck with AS. Cap then goes for T and the Avengers win.

O

[CapAmerica24]

Originally posted by Silver Lantern
Thanoseid: ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!

That is classic DC fan interpretation. Hawkman has 1 million years of experience. :grin:
LMAO @ starman's freeky deeky skillz.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Heh, Powerpuff girl is SOOO Powerful she could smash Krona AND Galactus with the concussive force of her wink. :grin:

Hawkman does have more battlefield experience than all of these combatants combined.

Starman is in control of the Cosmic Rod, which does grant him "freeky deeky skillz."

And no, Power Girl would not defeat Krona or Galactus...but she can hold her own for a while with Captain Marvel or Superman. She is far more powerful than anything this Avengers team throws at her.

I am a big Avengers fan as well (look at my screen name), but I also know what this JSA squad is capable of. And they are more than capable of beating this Avengers team.

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by SPLITSECOND
So, the question in my mind is can they take the Flash. I really think that with Wanda's Hex Power they could.I believe this is the most important matchup. Will the Avengers identify Flash before Flash identifies Scarlet Witch? Either can easily take out the other and cause a huge swing in the fight. It may be the deciding factor.

[KingBlackBolt]

Flash would take wanda before she would take him. Its the obvious target at first. I can hit either the huge giant guy the guy with the armored shield or the helpless girl. Pretty easy choice plus her powers dont always work.

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by malger
I see everyone KO'd except Hawkman and Captain America, but Hawkman takes him down. I really don't care how many times Hawkman has been reincarnated. I just finished reading all the JSA and Hawkman TPBs of the current series and Hawkman is not currently this tough. Green Arrow fought him to a standstill. Green Arrow < Captain America. All of Hawkman's weapons are very weak against Cap's shield. Cap would win this matchup.

[Q99]

At the very least, Mr. T will be blurry and hard to hit by Iron Man and Vision, even more so the latter.

Power Girl (and enough with the slurs, calling Power Girl a slut doesn't help your argument any more than calling Scarlet Witch and Captain America the same) is stronger and tougher than Iron Man. Iron Man, though, has other advantages. I see this fight lasting for awhile, and Iron Man is definitely going to take some damage.

I see Atom Smasher taking out Giant Man. He's more of a fighter and I think he has at least a tendancy to get bigger (what's Giant man's limit, anyway?).

Vision'll probably KO Starman after a bit of a fight (or at least disarm him, in which case he'd still be a help, if only a minor one).

Flash will not be easily taken out. Iron Man is going to be busy in his own fights, and he's likely to take someone out before being obviously the choice for a hex (personally, I think Wanda'd probably go after Starman, since he has a lot of power in an easily messed-up technological device). She's not really going to have time to throw a second one.

Hawkman's definitely going to have a chance to be a major help in either one of the above fights or just keeping Capt busy (and therefore freeing up Mr. Terrific).

I vote the JSA. It's fairly close in power, but I think the JSA are better fighters (not knocking Capt, Vis, or Tony, but Hank and Wanda aren't as much so, and most of the JSA are fighters by nature), and they have the numerical advantage as well.

The Flash is going to matter. Yes, Wanda can take him out with a hex. Is she before he has the chance to take someone out first? I don't think so.

[DTM]

Originally posted by GoldenAge
No way. Give Tony his due. Iron Man's various attack devices and his inherent ability to think quickly gives him more than a slight chance.

However, I don't think Tony's met anyone on Power Girl's level before (besides Thor) and even the Iron Man armor has limits. A few of Power Gil's best shots could induce that trademarked energy bleed from the chest and hairline fissures that often appear after Iron Man takes massive damage.

Im sure a combination of Tonys sonic attacks, which I believe he has, and Vision stunning Power Girls brain (which he has done even to Juggernaut) would be enough to take out PG. And with her down, the JSA are down a serious POWERHOUSE.......apparently more serious than I thought, since I believed her to be She Hulk level when calculating the JSA team here. :p

[DTM]

Originally posted by CapAmerica24
And no, Power Girl would not defeat Krona or Galactus...but she can hold her own for a while with Captain Marvel or Superman. She is far more powerful than anything this Avengers team throws at her.

Power Girl can hold her own, but not beat, Superman and Capt Marvel. OK, I get that. Iron Man can hold his own, but not beat, Thor and the Hulk.......Id say that makes them pretty even if you ask me. Plus Tonys MUCH smarter than PG and has more overall experience. I dont see why most people here are giving Kara the win over IM.

[Maniac_nmt]

look PG might hold up to supes/captain marvel types, does she beat them? no?

Tony holds up to Thor/supes types, does he beat them via strength? no, does he have other stuff at his disposal to let him contend? yes.

Repulsors hurt, unless your Thor with a full mad on, then they're not so tough, but they still hurt. Sonics, various field weapons, holographics (limited true), and everything else, including a mini fridge with evian water for this AA member (that was a joke by the way).

Look Thanoseid, the JSA are contenders, they wouldn't be here if they weren't. You're being as bad as Thugit saying Hawkman could take Captain America.

The JSA aren't chumps, or feebs, or any other name you can call them. They're proven heros, some of the best DC has to offer, and a crack team. Give credit where credit is due. At least many of the 'DC fanboys' know the Avengers, and this Avengers crew in particular, are some of the best. No single one of them will be an easy KO, just as no JSA member will be an easy KO. That's not saying X won't trump Y 9 times out of ten, but the accumulated experience and teamwork means it won't be poof, slaughter, champane, and medals in quick order.

Anyone who is completely honest knows this won't be a walk in the park for either team. It's a battle of battles, as it should be for the championship match.

[Thanosied]

/bow. thank you, thank you.

[DTM]

Originally posted by KingBlackBolt
Flash would take wanda before she would take him. Its the obvious target at first. I can hit either the huge giant guy the guy with the armored shield or the helpless girl. Pretty easy choice plus her powers dont always work.

An OLD school hero like Jay is going to hit the helpless girl at his first shot? Im having problems believing that. Not knowing Wanda ia a real threat, I really dont think hed pick her FIRST, especially just because shes a woman.

[Silver Lantern]

Great point about Jay & Wanda DTM. What's the count?

[thugit]

Originally posted by Maniac_nmt
You're being as bad as Thugit saying Hawkman could take Captain America.




Wow. That's offensive. I don't think I've ever said anything as innately stupid as the things he's posting. I think Hawkman would beat Cap. I'm not ranting like a lunatic like he is.

[NickFury15]

Anyone have the tally?

BTW, Mr. Terrific's T-spheres scan everything. They can tell the weakness of Iron Man's suit, ways to beat Vision, what Scarlet Witch is capable of. Mr. Terrific really is a deciding factor in this match.

[Thanosied]

The real deal scenario:

Thanosied style;

I have read about 3 comics since I last posted and I will admit to one thing.... Any Team with a Flash is too #### good.

The Flash takes out Cap, Scarlet Witch, and Vision if he ever goes tangleable during the fight(That means Diamond too folks).

So That leaves Iron Man and Giant Man vs. the lot. Giant Man being under classed gets rizzaped by Adam Smasher over time and if at anytime PowerGirl helps it is done in a heart beat.

Mr.T I still think is a none issue. No Blast attack and if he attempts to tinker with IM armor going through 5 layers of force fields to do it IM would just send a shock wave throw the armor to KO him.

IM finding himself very undermaned after the total elimination of his team he results in the cheapness of using a massive light attack to temporarily stun the JSA's entire squad.

Eventhough semi-successful IM then proceeds to get lock- on's on the JSA team and blast at the week points of all there bodies (ie the head or eyes).

IM is successful taking down Adam Smasher, Mr.T, Hawkman, and a staffless Starman after it was destroyed by the Vision's one saving grace of intangeableness.

This leaves The Flash who ran like a mofo away from the light attack and Powergirl slightly stunned.

Powergirl then starts laying the beats on IM and she is seemingly winning so then IM works in a massive Sonic's Blast to incapacitate her.

Very exhausted through a strenous and amazing fight IM forgets about a Flash who then starts heaving objects up his ### until IM goes down.

This is the best that the Avengers can do with The Flash around. Even with the light attack, Flash 1 maybe able to save a few key members from being stun thus enabling a greater victory. Possibly PowerGirl and Hawkman being left around aswell.

I do give the JSA the win only because a team with a Flash is the b-all and end all.

JSA

Thanosied has spoken :P

[petenliz9]

JSA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:)

[SteveRogers]

You guys are CERTAINLY NOT giving Captain America enough credit. Captain America DOESN'T DIE EASY!! Captain America is supposed to be Batman's counter part and Batman even expressed that Cap could beat Bats in the JLA/Avengers, but it would take awhile. POINT: Cap can beat Bats, Bats beats alot of people. So you are wrong saying that Cap goes down easy in the first fight.

Avengers WIN.

[DTM]

Current Voting Totals:

Avengers #1 - 12 votes
JSA - 28 votes

[EJS]

I give it to the Avengers

[Perfectstorm]

Avengers

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by DTM
An OLD school hero like Jay is going to hit the helpless girl at his first shot? Im having problems believing that. Not knowing Wanda ia a real threat, I really dont think hed pick her FIRST, especially just because shes a woman.

Yes, an old school hero like Jay WOULD take down Wanda ASAP. He's experienced enough to know that underestimating the young woman in the background could lead to disaster. He'll realize that each combatant is as dangerous as the other and given the opportunity, he'd do whatever needed to assure a JSA win. That's the benefit experience affords. Experience gives the Flash the edge.

Would he hit her? Heck no. Jay wouldn't simply run up to Wanda and pop her in the back of the head. But he would spin her into unconsciousness, or create a void around her eliminating her oxygen, or one on the dozens of other tactics he uses that are non-lethal.

Wanda would be at his mercy. She's never been effective when set upon.

[CapAmerica24]

Cap IS Batman's equal. But I don't think either Batman or Cap could beat Hawkman 1 on 1...sorry guys, just my opinion though.

[Numb Skrull]

Avengers...it doesnt look like they will win though.

[Nickel97]

JSA

[Gambit]

WOW!! Avnegers equals un-credited, out-numbered with the fans.

Still Giving it to Avnegers

[DreadDormammu]

I dunno. I think Jay would take out Wanda if he knew here powers. But he doesn't. I think Vision or Captain America are more likely to be his first targets.

The way I see it is that if Scarlet Witch uses her powers effectively on someone other than Flash, Flash will immediately go knock her out. But if she turns them on Flash as her first target, it is likely to eliminate him (say tripping at 10x the speed of sound or somesuch).

It's really a key matchup in this battle because Flash is almost impossible for anyone else to stop and Scarlet Witch has the potential to beat anyone.

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by CapAmerica24
Cap IS Batman's equal. But I don't think either Batman or Cap could beat Hawkman 1 on 1...sorry guys, just my opinion though.

I would agree. The Nth metal makes the difference.

[Thanosied]

I respect cap too Steve but he can't block the flash and well a couple hundred punches is just that.

[DTM]

Originally posted by GoldenAge
Yes, an old school hero like Jay WOULD take down Wanda ASAP. He's experienced enough to know that underestimating the young woman in the background could lead to disaster. He'll realize that each combatant is as dangerous as the other and given the opportunity, he'd do whatever needed to assure a JSA win. That's the benefit experience affords. Experience gives the Flash the edge.

Would he hit her? Heck no. Jay wouldn't simply run up to Wanda and pop her in the back of the head. But he would spin her into unconsciousness, or create a void around her eliminating her oxygen, or one on the dozens of other tactics he uses that are non-lethal.

Wanda would be at his mercy. She's never been effective when set upon.

Hmmmm, sounds like your stretching a bit there GA. Not knowing anyone here from anyone else, I dont see him picking Wanda simply because shes the woman. The spinning around trick and taking away the O2 would work on Cap, and even Giant Man, since he needs to breathe too, why would Jay just randomly pick the ONE PERSON on the Avengers with the best chance of taking him out at his FIRST shot?

[yoshi89]

Are some of you holding grudges since the Avengers defeated your favorite teams??:cheeky:

Avengers

[dj_sha]

I agree with most of the arguments made so far, but isn't Power Girl and the Flash (on the same team no less) a little strong for the tournament? Power Girl=Superman power level, and Superman was banned. I love the JSA and am glad their winning this, but the power level seems a little unbalanced.

[Gorrack]

I vote AVengers as well....I also feel Cap would lose to Hawkman more than likely. Just my opinion though.

[dj_sha]

Also, I've noticed so many posts are "the JSA/Avengers defeated so and so, so I don't like them." A good example would probably be Thanoseids post.

Not to mention, going back to power levels, 2 of the 3 teams I thought may be too powerful made it to the finals (the 3rd being the JLA team with Wonder Woman and Bats, but on second glance that team relied too much on WW and didn't have a second heavy hitter).

And finally, I've started to noticed a lot of uneducated votes. The JLA vote really showed this. This is why I didn't vote for many fights in this tourney, as I didn't know many of the teams. I just wish more people would have the same decency to note simply vote for the team they've heard of, but to vote on the fights where they know BOTH teams equally well.

[Thanosied]

But I personally think he would win against hawkman 1-1 but thats just me.

As far as this battle goes its all about when The Flash decides to take down Scarlet Witch. The Flash could attempt at least 5-10 punches on the whole Avenger team before they were able to react almost so I guess he tastes the field and then does in the weakest first.

Ill give the old school guys credit they don't make too many mistakes so thats why The Flash wins this fight.

Oh and Mr. T can sence weaknesses but does IM have any besides a bad heart? LOL or the booze?

I love the Avengers but we have to accept the Flash for what he is super f'n cheap and move on. He makes a huge difference in this one giving an advantage right off the bat which will turn the tide.

[DTM]

Originally posted by dj_sha
I agree with most of the arguments made so far, but isn't Power Girl and the Flash (on the same team no less) a little strong for the tournament? Power Girl=Superman power level, and Superman was banned. I love the JSA and am glad their winning this, but the power level seems a little unbalanced.

I got the impression that Power Girl was She Hulk leve, not Superman level, so it was THAT version of her I took into account when looking at the entire JSA team. Looks like I made a goof there. :confused:

[GoldenAge]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
I dunno. I think Jay would take out Wanda if he knew here powers. But he doesn't. I think Vision or Captain America are more likely to be his first targets.

The way I see it is that if Scarlet Witch uses her powers effectively on someone other than Flash, Flash will immediately go knock her out. But if she turns them on Flash as her first target, it is likely to eliminate him (say tripping at 10x the speed of sound or somesuch).

It's really a key matchup in this battle because Flash is almost impossible for anyone else to stop and Scarlet Witch has the potential to beat anyone.

Here's the problem with that argument...

1. If Flash attacks Wanda first it's over for the Scarlet Witch before she can even take a breath.

2. If Flash doesn't go after Wanda, due to their superior numbers, someone else on the JSA would. That JSA attacker would then become the Scarlet Witch's target for no other reason than self-preservation. One hex attack later (successful or otherwise - I've rarely seen Wanda take out a premiere villain/hero with one shot) and suddenly Flash is on her.

3. And more likely, and keeping within the parameters of Jay’s usual battle tactics, the Flash will target BOTH Cap and Wanda with high speed passing strikes and speed force manipulation. Cap survives to be engaged by another JSA member... Wanda probably won’t.

It would mean taking a large leap to think that Wanda would automatically target Flash since her hex powers could affect all combatants. But Flash is limited to land based Avengers. Since Atom Smasher is built to go against Giant Man that would leave 2 choices for Flash's first attack. Flash is also the JSA's best chance to reach someone like Wanda who's taken a protected position in the rear of the Avengers ranks.

The arguments for Flash targeting Wanda... and taking her down seem to be overwhelming.

[CapAmerica24]

Just be glad that you had the sense to make me remove Sentinel from the original roster DTM! :)

[UXMGambit]

Avengers

I feel they've overcome alot including Kang, MoE, countless and countless villains in the JLA/Avengers without Cap in battle. They have the edge here.

[Maniac_nmt]

Wow. That's offensive. I don't think I've ever said anything as innately stupid as the things he's posting. I think Hawkman would beat Cap. I'm not ranting like a lunatic like he is.

pax my friend, pax, I was just yanking your chain, sorry, should have put smiles on it.

[Gentlegamer]

JSA!

[UberDT]

JSA for the win.

[green_knight]

Originally posted by GoldenAge
Here's the problem with that argument...


It would mean taking a large leap to think that Wanda would automatically target Flash since her hex powers could affect all combatants. But Flash is limited to land based Avengers. Since Atom Smasher is built to go against Giant Man that would leave 2 choices for Flash's first attack. Flash is also the JSA's best chance to reach someone like Wanda who's taken a protected position in the rear of the Avengers ranks.




Couldn't have said it better.

I vote JSA.

[Gentlegamer]

I fergot tu say y JSA wud win. Hear is my reason:

Originally posted by Grinner
Pro-JSA: "Like, the Flash wil zum over and ko Skarlet Witch and Cap b4 they even kno their teleported. He'll also run up Giant Man & pants him. Atum Smashr gets sooooo much bigger than little GiANT man that he'll just squish him. Mr. Terriffik will figure out how to shut off Vision, leaving evryone elze to beat up the drunk in the tin can."

:grin: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :p

[Grinner]

Originally posted by Nighthawk
Cap and Witch have fought many speedsters. quicksilver, Whizzer, among others. Extensively trained with Quicksilver. They will have an idea how to fight Flash.

Yes, but it's a question of scale again. Say you are a trained bird-hunter. You hit a bird almost every time you shoot. Now say that the bird suddenly is flying over at the speed of a super-sonic jet. How likely are you to hit the bird on your first (and only) shot when you were expecting it to fly at bird speed?

And Gentlegamer - it's nice to see my efforts appreciated ;)

[Q99]

I got the impression that Power Girl was She Hulk leve, not Superman level, so it was THAT version of her I took into account when looking at the entire JSA team. Looks like I made a goof there.

She's not overall Superman level, though. As a whole package, Wonder Woman is definitely the more powerful warrior. PG's just strength, toughness, and flight.

And she has a regenerating costume, which shall prove to be the key to victory somehow (probably involving Scarlet Witch hexing her, causing it to not regenerate. Tony, now distracted, falls victim to a surprise assault by Starman and Hawkman because of it, thus sealing the win).

[Grinner]

Originally posted by Maniac_nmt
The JSA aren't chumps, or feebs, or any other name you can call them. They're proven heros, some of the best DC has to offer, and a crack team. Give credit where credit is due. At least many of the 'DC fanboys' know the Avengers, and this Avengers crew in particular, are some of the best. No single one of them will be an easy KO, just as no JSA member will be an easy KO. That's not saying X won't trump Y 9 times out of ten, but the accumulated experience and teamwork means it won't be poof, slaughter, champane, and medals in quick order.

Anyone who is completely honest knows this won't be a walk in the park for either team. It's a battle of battles, as it should be for the championship match.

Preach on, brutha!

After thinking it over for myself and reading everyone's arguments I, too, am casting my vote for the JSA. As said above, this won't be a walk in the park for either team, and either team could reasonably take it. Most of the "Avengers win" scenarios are just as feasible as the "JSA wins" scenarios. Neither team are chumps, and no one's going home unhurt. What it comes down to, in my book, is that I see Wanda going out early more often than I see Jay going out early. That's why I'm giving the JSA the 55-45 win ratio, which gets them my vote.

JSA wins.

[DTM]

True BUT, Wonder Woman didnt really have too much else on her team, powerwise at least.

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by GoldenAge
1. If Flash attacks Wanda first it's over for the Scarlet Witch before she can even take a breath.Obviously. I think I said this myself.
If Flash doesn't go after Wanda, due to their superior numbers, someone else on the JSA would.Eh. You are implying the JSA will leap to a lightning offensive. I think this is the JSA's one weakness in this fight: this JSA team is not as well-coordinated or well-led as the Avengers team. Bear in mind I still think the JSA would win. :p
And more likely, and keeping within the parameters of Jay’s usual battle tactics, the Flash will target BOTH Cap and Wanda with high speed passing strikes and speed force manipulation.I would say Jay's usual battle tactics are to wait for an order from the leader to act. I certainly don't think he would rush off and attack a bunch of people before anyone did anything.
It would mean taking a large leap to think that Wanda would automatically target Flash since her hex powers could affect all combatants.Again, I'm not sure what you're arguing. I didn't say she would or would not. I said if she did it would be pivotal and might well decide the match. Since I didn't vote for the Avengers clearly I don't think that is the most likely thing to happen...

[DreadDormammu]

For the RPG lovers out there (hi, DTM!), here is a comparison of some of the participants involved plus a few comparisons to show where Power Girl rests. If you don't like RPG stats, feel free to ignore them instead of flaming.

Captain America: Dex 10, Str 6, Body 6
Iron Man: Dex 6, Str 12, Body 12
Wonder Woman: Dex 13, Str 16, Body 13
Power Girl: Dex 10, Str 20, Body 15
Captain Marvel (DC): Dex 14, Str 20, Body 14
Superman: Dex 15, Str 25, Body 18

Power Girl is well in Captain Marvel's power range: a little slower but tougher. She is ~10-20x stronger than Wonder Woman and hundreds of times more physically powerful than Iron Man. If Power Girl attacked anyone on the Avengers team she would be likely to dispatch them with relative ease.

Is she too tough for this tournament? I think so and have said so in every JSA battle. Unfortunately there were many such participants so we just have to live with it (Wonder Woman, Blastaar, etc).

[Gentlegamer]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
For the RPG lovers out there (hi, DTM!), here is a comparison of some of the participants involved plus a few comparisons to show where Power Girl rests. If you don't like RPG stats, feel free to ignore them instead of flaming.

Captain America: Dex 10, Str 6, Body 6
Iron Man: Dex 6, Str 12, Body 12
Wonder Woman: Dex 13, Str 16, Body 13
Power Girl: Dex 10, Str 20, Body 15
Captain Marvel (DC): Dex 14, Str 20, Body 14
Superman: Dex 15, Str 25, Body 18

Power Girl is well in Captain Marvel's power range: a little slower but tougher. She is ~10-20x stronger than Wonder Woman and hundreds of times more physically powerful than Iron Man. If Power Girl attacked anyone on the Avengers team she would be likely to dispatch them with relative ease.

Is she too tough for this tournament? I think so and have said so in every JSA battle. Unfortunately there were many such participants so we just have to live with it (Wonder Woman, Blastaar, etc).

Those look like MEGS stats! Did you find them online? If so, could you PM me the link?

[weezer_10]

JSA for the win.

[DreadDormammu]

Those are MEGS stats. ;) I got Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel and Superman from the 3rd edition rulesbook and the 2nd edition JLA sourcebook; Power Girl was only in the JLA book. Captain America and Iron Man came from the DCH mailing list, which archives its writeups on writeups.org (but the site is currently down).

That version of Iron Man is the early 80s gold/red armor that Stark wore and later handed to Rhodes.

[shinigami0079]

if this fight really comes down to combat experience then i think your really underestimating members of both squads, there is literally no one with cap's fighting skill and leadership ability in this whole tournament. when flash runs up he will not recognize wanda as the biggest threat and go after someone he recognizes, maybe someone like cap or henry pym.


i vote the avengers for the win but this will likely end up as a how many dc/marvel fanboys get out vote because some people cant look at this match with a level playing field and give each individual character a fair shake with regards to what their capable of.

try to remember this is a poof all of a sudden your in some random location with likely no idea of who your enemy is and of their location

just my 2 cents

[rouge2]

Power Girl is below Superman/Cap Marvel level. True, in Stealing Thuinder, she tied up a *mind controled* group of Supes-level characters, but in Black Reign, Black Adam (who is Superman/Cap equivalent) defeats her and a group of other JSAers at the same time, very decisively. I would rank her between Wonder Woman and Supergirl.

That said, she' no slouch and I vote JSA. Mainly because of Mr. Terrific. The T-Spheres will analyse Vision and find a way to shut him down.

Atom Smasher v. Giant Man
Power girl v. Iron Man
Cap v. Hawkman

THese three match up well, with no early KOs. The problem is, that leaves the remaining Avengers outmatched, and momentum builds quickly for the JSA.

[DTM]

Current Voting Totals:

Avengers#1 - 20 votes
JSA - 35 votes

[DTM]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
For the RPG lovers out there (hi, DTM!), here is a comparison of some of the participants involved plus a few comparisons to show where Power Girl rests. If you don't like RPG stats, feel free to ignore them instead of flaming.

Captain America: Dex 10, Str 6, Body 6
Iron Man: Dex 6, Str 12, Body 12
Wonder Woman: Dex 13, Str 16, Body 13
Power Girl: Dex 10, Str 20, Body 15
Captain Marvel (DC): Dex 14, Str 20, Body 14
Superman: Dex 15, Str 25, Body 18

Power Girl is well in Captain Marvel's power range: a little slower but tougher. She is ~10-20x stronger than Wonder Woman and hundreds of times more physically powerful than Iron Man. If Power Girl attacked anyone on the Avengers team she would be likely to dispatch them with relative ease.

Is she too tough for this tournament? I think so and have said so in every JSA battle. Unfortunately there were many such participants so we just have to live with it (Wonder Woman, Blastaar, etc).

DD, you know me, and my love for RPGs too well. :)

Ouch, had I known Power Girl was THAT strong and durable, Id have definately limited the JSA team accordingly, since its not only their power, but their NUMBERS that is a huge factor in this Final Match Up.

[ultron police5]

Avengers its too easy?

[Manchine]

Ok since I have been sitting here quietly watching and reading all this, inbetween updating my homepage with CoH goodies. I guess I will vote.






JSA For the win!


Congrats JSA!

[VandalSavage]

I vote...JSA!!!


Mr. Savage

[The Charlatan]

JSA. I've tried to do a play-by-play version of events, but each time my computer auto-logs me out for taking too long.

$%^&%##.....

Really short version: Jay Garrick is the last man standing, and no, he didn't just KO everyone else at superspeed.

[DTM]

Current Voting Totals:

JSA - 38 votes
Avengers #1 - 21 votes

[hawkeye2831]

I vote Avengers.There look it's a bird it's a plane it's Hawkeye!

[DTM]

And lastly, though this thread and its votes are STILL OPEN, Id like to take a second out and THANK everyone here who has voted, argued, debated and in any way added their 2 cents to this and all my previous Tournaments in the past.

Its been about 4 months since the Heavy Weight Division made its debut, and weve been talking about Tournament after Tournament since then, with nothing but the support and contributions of YOU ALL making it possible.

Ive gotten a chance to really know a lot of you out there, members Id pretty much never been able to before this, and its been one heck of a series of Contests for me and I hope you all as well.

Im sure this will be the last one, since I dont really know what TOC one would do that hasnt been done already, so I do hope youve ALL had a great time posting and speaking your comic book minds about these little battles. Ive had a great time getting them all together.

So again, I thank you all for all that youve done here to help make these little Contests so successful and ALOT of fun as well.

Thanks guys and gals. :)


What the heck, Ill vote AVENGERS here.....gotta root for the underdog. 38 votes to 23, GO CAPTAIN AMERICA!! :laugh:

[oogie56]

You get big thumbs up from me DTM. I have gotten busy with some stuff(my own tourney fasioned after yours) and have missed a lot of battles, but i always tried to check in.
A great one to end it on. I'll take the JSA here. They are a great team, and deserve the win.
Its been a great ride. Way to go DTM!!

[GoldenAge]

And thanks to you DTM. It's a difficult task to herd the cats. Keeping so many crazies in line and on track throughout these tournaments was a huge undertaking.

Well done. ;)

[Maniac_nmt]

Yes, I would like to say thanks as well DTM. These have been a lot of fun. From the simple vs battles, to the heavies, and onwards, it's been a bumpy, but overall enjoyable ride.

[thugit]

In THAT case.....

Superman would beat Surfer, and the JLA would stomp the tar out of the Fantastic Four!

And Batman would beat Deathstroke!

[Jackygobang]

Well, I sure hope you aren't signing off, there are still tournies to be won and lost.


I don't remember if I voted, so i will.


You have to think that Jay probably won't know the Wanda is the anti-speedster, so, upstanding fellow he is, he'll tag Cap, stunning him, and let the bruisers do thier bidding.But old Tony Stark will lock on to this gaudy-dressed guy, and repulsor ray his behind. Atom Smasher and Giant Man obviously go after each other, because they are both...well, big.Cap, by now, has probably regained his footing, and leads the charge while the two biggies grapple above them. . Vision goes after the flying woman in the cape, and Tony does the dance with Starman. Cap and Mr. T eye each other, and Wanda disables the t-spheres, before being smacked in the face with a mace courtesy of Hawkman.

Mr T is definantly no slouch, but he ain't no Batman. and Batman ain't no Cap.Vision, realizing how powerful PG is, does his phasey punch thing, disabling her. Atom Smasher topples Giant Man, while Ironman lays the smack down on Starman.

You have Hawkman and Atom Smasher vs. Cap, a wounded Vision, and Iron Man. Cap and Vision take on Hawkman, and Iron Man, easily the most powerful member of either team, works on Atom Smasher before Vision and cap come and help.


I vote Avengers, but, then again, i'm a fanboy.
.

[DTM]

Originally posted by thugit
In THAT case.....

Superman would beat Surfer, and the JLA would stomp the tar out of the Fantastic Four!

And Batman would beat Deathstroke!

Its good to have gotten to know you too thugit.......

Batman beat Deathstroke??? BWAHAHAHAHA..... Hes had his chances, and got himself a 20% win record in the comics, one win out of five fights.....give it up man, just let it go.

[Rokk_Krinn]

So far I'm staying neutral on this battle (c'mon DTM: institute a "Tie" option :) ), but I do want to point out one thing: Mr. Terrific was picked up by Batman's visual equipment. Bruce admitted he was impressed because his lenses were having a horrific time picking out the hazy/indistinct Mr. Turner, but he could still see him. Oh, and before anyone says "uber-bat" this was in the JSA's own series and in an issue where the newer legacy members were busy impressing the Bat. :)

[Jackygobang]

MUST...NOT...STOP....TOURNAMENTS....


Have...no....life....besides...tournaments!

Great....Lake....Avengers...vs.....Justice....League....Antarctica..!

[malger]

Originally posted by The Charlatan
JSA. I've tried to do a play-by-play version of events, but each time my computer auto-logs me out for taking too long.

Really short version: Jay Garrick is the last man standing, and no, he didn't just KO everyone else at superspeed.
Try typing it offline and then cut & paste. I love reading the play by plays.

DTM: How about a comedy tournament of champions using some of the more humerous and offbeat characters like howard the Duck, Plastic Man, Joker, Slapstick, etc.

[SilverAgeFlash]

Avengers

[DTM]

Personally, if Vision can stun and KO the likes of Hulk and Juggernaut with his phase in and out of the body tricks, something hes MASTERED, Im sure he could do the same to Power Girl. And with PG gone, Iron Man and Vision could really do some unreal damage to the JSA from the air. Vision has the answer to defeat the uber durable PG, and its an attack he uses all the time. Initially my vote was near pity for the Avengers, but now I can really see it happening. Come on guys, only 15 or so votes difference, lets RALLY LIKE CAP and see if we cant GET THIS LEAD BACK!! AVENGERS ASSEMBLE!!!

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by DTM
Im sure this will be the last one, since I dont really know what TOC one would do that hasnt been done already,If we're all still here, you just have to start again one year after the original. ;)

[thugit]

Originally posted by DTM
Its good to have gotten to know you too thugit.......




Here it is, folks..... The biggest lie in the history of HCRealms!!!


;)

[DTM]

No, Batman beating Wolverine, with NO preperation and in an open area beats that out thugit. :)

[Jackygobang]

GO AVENGERS>S?S?S??S!!!?@?!

[Jackygobang]

Also, Batman could take Wolvie.

[thugit]

Beats him baaaaaaaaaaaaad, DTM, beats him BAD!

Don't get me started on how he'd beat down the Punisher!

:) ;)

[DTM]

Shhh Jacky, think Avengers now, Batman later. :p

[banshee12377]

JSA

[DTM]

No doubt, but Wolverine aint the Punisher.

With no prep time, and no place to hide or sneak around, plus to place to climb for a ranged advantage, Batman gets gutted in the end. NO DOUBT.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Originally posted by Q99
I see Atom Smasher taking out Giant Man. He's more of a fighter and I think he has at least a tendancy to get bigger (what's Giant man's limit, anyway?).


Hank's limit a few years back was 100' or so though that's when he's really needing to get excessive for some reason.

[mick77]

poof scenario, theres no way in hell that Batman can beat Wolverine. Given time to prepare, Batman has 50% of the chance, not more.

[Rokk_Krinn]

The Batman/Wolverine fight was months ago. Poor DTM will never get any rest if we start it again. :)

Honestly, being DTM won't allow us to just vote "tie", I'm going to vote JSA. It won't be the cakewalk it would've been had Dr. Mid-Nite been on the team (oh, c'mon, I have to let the fanboy out for just a second :) ), but I'm going to vote JSA. Honestly, it's a close fight - really close - but I think PG + Flash are major factors here that tip it towards the original super-hero team. Heck, maybe it's uber-fanboy'ish of me, but I think maybe this win is a nice nod to the JSA's comic legacy: they are the first, long before any other such team.

RE: Hawkman vs. Green Arrow - I don't know if that's really a good example of Carter's fighting skills as that was just a case of the two taking potshots at one another while trading insults. Neither one was exactly trying to severely thrash the other one. It's how they "play" with each other. :)

DTM: May not always agree with your votes, but I certainly respect the work you've put into making a fun arena for all of us comic nerds to battle. Let's be honest, this wasn't a Tournament of Champions so much as another version of "Beat the Geeks". :) Thank you again.

[skyounkin]

JSA!! JSA!!

Speed and Power
Flash and Power Girl.

Mr. Terrific might eek it out over Capt. A. using his T-Spheres, even if he did or didn't niether one would be in any shape to help out afterwards...

Atom Smasher totally womps on Giant Man, who can only beat on women.....

But that's my opinion....I see them winning 51% of the time...it could go either way of course...but it doesn't

JSA!!!

And thank you very much to DTM for putting on great match ups!!! It's been a joy!! and hopefully we will see some more in the future.:grin:

[proditor]

Thanks DTM for running these, it's been fun, frustrating and at times futile, but it's mostly always been fun! Man are you a sport for putting up with all of us ranting and raging over these fights.

Although...

A suggestion...

Great Lakes Avengers vs. The Legion of Substitute Heroes.

YOU KNOW YOU WANT TO!!! ;)

[Caelcor]

Avengers, mostly because I think Vision can handle Power Girl but also partly because I think the voting total should reflect just exactly how close a fight this would be.

DTM, it's been a pleasure, even if I haven't voted in half as many of these as I've read. And I'd be all for an off-beat character tournament.

[wolviefreak]

Avengers

Red & White & Blue saves the day

Wolviefreak

[chase_jyd]

This is a tough vote. I've followed both teams for ages, the Avengers through the 80's consistently, and the JSA from the old team-ups. Ultimately though I give it to the JSA.

Cap is the best leader on the field, but with Carter and Mr. Terrific out there, the JSA has two expert tacticians if anyone gets tied up or K.O.'ed. They also have a one person advantage, which becomes a lot bigger edge when considering they do have that tactical expertise out there.

With the Flash, they will also strike first. No guarantee of who they'll hit first, but they'll have that opportunity. Even if Jay takes no one down, the JSA get to take the offensive and put the Avengers on the defensive first.

Cap could take either Carter or Mr. Terrific. Both can compare, and in some circumstances I think Carter could handle him, but Cap's shield gives him a big advantage against Carter's usual style of going on the offensive. However, Carter can effectively tie him up for most of a fight. I'm not going to suggest any other 1 on 1 matches, but this one would happen. Both tend to gravitate in a fight towards the opposing tactician/leader figure. Cap wins, but by the time he does so, its too late.

Mr. Terrific's abilities can cause problems for both Vision and Iron Man, not just whether they detect him or not, but being able to direct opponents on the level of Power Girl and the Flash. Flash was also phasing, and using it as a weapon when Vision was spare parts. Combining the options he alone brings with the heavyweights in PG and Atom Smasher, I don't think the Avengers can match up.

If it were even numbers, it might be different. But when its this close, I think it ultimately comes down to that slight edge.

JSA in a tight battle.

[Dalandow]

Avengers

[Zephyr Dude]

I'll also have to go Avengers...

Very, Very close Though!

[odieses]

avengers

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by DTM
Personally, if Vision can stun and KO the likes of Hulk and Juggernaut with his phase in and out of the body tricks, something hes MASTERED, Im sure he could do the same to Power Girl.This power is not consistently portrayed. For example: it didn't hurt Blob even a little bit.
Originally posted by skyounkin
Speed and Power
Flash and Power Girl.

Mr. Terrific might eek it out over Capt. A. using his T-Spheres, even if he did or didn't niether one would be in any shape to help out afterwards...

Atom Smasher totally womps on Giant Man, who can only beat on women.....I totally agree... except regarding Cap vs Mr. T. I'm sorry, but Captain America would beat Mr. Terrific and he wouldn't be hurt much doing it. It wouldn't necessarily be quick, but Cap would have energy to spare for taking out Hawkman.

I'd lay big money on Captain America beating Hawkman in fact. No way that would go down differently. Especially since (and no Hawkman fans have even answered this one), Cap's shield is the perfect defense against the archaic weaponry of Hawkman.

P.S. Hawkman is cool. He's just not as physically strong nor as accomplished as Cap.