Marvel/DC Battles: TEAM Tournament Of Champions Part 2: Round 1, Match 3

[DTM]

Even with the MIGHT of SHAZAM on their side, it seems Team Captain Marvel ultimately fell to Team Doom....er....Flash in the end, and their Incredibly Potent variety of powers and abilities.

Our next battle of this MIXED Universe Team Tournament is as follows:


TEAM THOR: Blue Beetle, Whizzer, Colossus, Thor

VS.

TEAM DOOMSDAY: Catwoman, Captain America, Solomon Grundy, Doomsday


As always, same rules apply, no time to prepare, POOFed from where ever they were, with only what they routinely carry on them, to fight in a Large area til one stands and one falls. YOU decide Who.

Randomly Chosen Area:


Jungle - Pretty dense foliage, damp and hot, with maybe a very small creak or stream, etc. (small sized stream, occasional large puddles caused by rain)


Thanks all, and enjoy.

And REMEMBER, if youre not sure who someone is here, ASK. Theres PLENTY of people here who can tell you most anything youd like to know. Thanks again.


TEAM TOURNAMENT OF CHAMPIONS


ROUND 1

Team Superman VS. Team Amazo: Team Superman

Team Flash (Wally) VS. Team Captain Marvel (DC): Team Flash (Wally)

Team Thor VS. Team Doomsday: ??????

[SilverAgeFlash]

Wirch DD is this? Is it the mindless one or the smart one?

[Caelcor]

Yeesh. This one's pretty rough. And you HAVE to feel for Cap in this situation. He's probably the best tactician in this tournament, and two of his team mates will refuse to follow (or understand) any orders. That's tough.

Tentatively Team Thor, until I get a handle on just what we're letting Doomsday pull off here.

[supermangl1]

Holy Carp! Look at the line up on Team CapDay. But Team Thor is decieving strong too.

First question is this Hunter/Prey Doomsday?

[DTM]

Yes, just as with the Heavy Weight Division, this is not the smart, I can think therefore I can be afraid, Doomsday. This is the Hunter/Prey Savage Doomsday, and the same will be said about the Hulk when he fights.

[dj_sha]

I'd say, hesitantly, team Doomsday. They seem to overpower team Thor, but I'm still not sure.


Also DTM, could you go back to the old format with listing all the team members? Having the teams listed as just "Team Thor" and such doesn't let you know who the other members of the team were that won or lost, since many of the lower level fighters could be pivotal in the outcomes. Just a thought.

[SilverAgeFlash]

Right now i am goin with team Thor because of their very well balanced team.

[Rokk_Krinn]

'Course this may be one of our first "defection" events: anyone else having trouble seeing Cap just watch while Doomsday tries killing (not stunning/KO'ing but _killing_) Thor? :confused:

[supermangl1]

If this is Hunter/Prey Doomsday, Team Thor is done for.
I see no teamwork on Team CapDay, Grundy and Doomsday won't listen to anyone. Grundy might, but I doubt it.

Cap and Catwoman make short work of Beetle and Whizzer. Grundy and Colossus fight for a long long time.
Thor and Doomsday fight for a long time too. With the poison claws that he can shoot out, Thor doesn't know whats he's in for. Beetle may start screaming warnings at Thor, but I see him saying something like, "Yon villian shall fall before the might of Mjnoir, verily."

Then realizes a head on assualt on Doomsday was the wrost idea. (While many hate DD, I'm not fond of him either. But going toe to toe is a bad idea here.)

Colossus beats Grundy, but gets destroyed by Doomsday in the end as Cap and Catwoman get out of the way.

my vote = Team Doomsday

[DTM]

Originally posted by dj_sha
I'd say, hesitantly, team Doomsday. They seem to overpower team Thor, but I'm still not sure.


Also DTM, could you go back to the old format with listing all the team members? Having the teams listed as just "Team Thor" and such doesn't let you know who the other members of the team were that won or lost, since many of the lower level fighters could be pivotal in the outcomes. Just a thought.

The team members are listed dj, up top in the main area of the first post.

[Caelcor]

Can I get a bit more info on Whizzer? I believe he's Sqaudron Supreme, but that's as much as I know--aside from a strong hunch that he's a super-speedster, based on his name. Either that, or he had too much iced tea for lunch...

[DTM]

Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
'Course this may be one of our first "defection" events: anyone else having trouble seeing Cap just watch while Doomsday tries killing (not stunning/KO'ing but _killing_) Thor? :confused:

EXCELLENT, I knew this would come up. Each team MUST fight to the BEST of their abilities to win each match. Their will be NO DEFECTIONS ALLOWED.

[supermangl1]

It is truly a disfunctionally group for Team CatCapGrunDay, but I can't see Cap controlling Doomsday at all, and getting him mad well only get Cap killed too. Doomsday may be the only one left standing at the end of the day.

[DTM]

Originally posted by Caelcor
Can I get a bit more info on Whizzer? I believe he's Sqaudron Supreme, but that's as much as I know--aside from a strong hunch that he's a super-speedster, based on his name. Either that, or he had too much iced tea for lunch...

Hes a super speedster, around Quicksilver level I would bet from the description his nominator gave me.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Originally posted by DTM
EXCELLENT, I knew this would come up. Each team MUST fight to the BEST of their abilities to win each match. Their will be NO DEFECTIONS ALLOWED.

Yep, it had come up previously and while I realize that everyone has to fight to the best of their abilities, I wasn't sure if Cap could still try to "tone down" Doomsday or shield Thor from a lethal blow. After all, in Match 2 we're hearing lots of arguements about how Wally wouldn't help Doom (based on personality I guess, though, geez, Wally listens to Bats who's possibly even ruder :) ).

[Manchine]

Originally posted by DTM
Hes a super speedster, around Quicksilver level I would bet from the description his nominator gave me.

I thought he was before speed force flash's speed. Not quite able to break the light speed barrier!

[DTM]

The description I got was that Whizzer could run around the 100 MPH mark. Which is why he was placed in the MW category.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Originally posted by Manchine
I thought he was before speed force flash's speed. Not quite able to break the light speed barrier!

_Maybe_ the Alabama Blur (the Elseworld'ish type Whizzer over in "Supreme Powers") is that fast, but Whizzer - even in Gruenwald's fabulous maxi-series - never struck me anywhere near Flash's speed. Possibly a bit faster than Quicksilver (Northstar level, maybe?) but not Flash level.

Wish we'd known "alternate world" characters (Squadron Supreme) were allowed so we could've loaded up with KC characters. *jk* :)

[DarthDoom]

DOOM sees Cap getting bothered by his team not working as a team which will be what will wins battles. Doomsday may not just attack the opposing teams but also his own. For this DOOM will vote for team Thor. Grundy is powerful on his own and would take Colossus, Beatle takes catwoman and Doomsday will take everyone else but Cap and thor who will have to team up to stop DOOM day and win. After the smoke clears Thor will smite cap with thine hammer and game over. Winner-----Team Thor

[DTM]

NO DD. Cap is on Team Doomsday, and will NOT team up with Thor to battle his own teammate. Against the Rules, sorry.

[thugit]

Team Doomsday. Grundy can run interference with Colossus for just long enough, possibly beating him. Catwoman can beat Beetle, and Cap can help everyone out.


Thor loses to Doomsday. Let's all be honest here: Thor tried to slug it out with Superman, and came up just a bit short. Now he'll try and slug it out with a being that's just as savage as the Hulk, (possibly more savage) and stronger than Superman. Add in the fact that Doomsday can move at superspeed, and Thor is going to be on the short end of the stick.

[SilverAgeFlash]

Which Doomsday is this ?

[Rando]

Right now I vote for team Thor

I feel bad for Cap, noone on his team is going to do anything he says except for maybe Catwoman (who would get wrecked by Blue Beetle). In fact I can see Cap turning against his team once Grundy and Doomsday start using lethal force.

Anyway enough of that, I vote team Thor because of Thor's weather powers and Blue Beetle's know how. Whizzer can do reconissance pretty easily, so long as he doesn't get into the thick of Cap's team then he should be fine, Thor's team also has someone that is familair with everyone on Cap's team (and vice versa) so no suprise stuff. I'm sure Blue Beetle isn't too keen on taking another beating like he did in the "Death of Superman" so he will do everything in his power to get as much information about his team that he can and devise strategies to prevent a head long confrontaion with Doomsday. Fortunantly for Ted there is an available tactic that can hold Doomsday up for extended periods: a windstorm generated by Thor. Doomsday is grounded if Thor were to summon a windstorm under neath him the wind could hold Doomsday aloft essentialy indefiently (or at least for as long as the windstorm persists which, and I suspect Thor can just leave it going unattended for hours on end). Whether Thor would go for this is something if a question, on the one hand Thor is a warrior, he is going to want to test his mettle against such an abomination, on the other Thor is an experienced super-hero, he knows that he has limits and sometimes there are others that surpass them. At the end of the day I can see the windstorm plan coming into effect more often than not, Thor may not use it right off the bat, but when Doomsday begins to overpower him I can't imagine Thor not saving himself with a plan that he already has "in the bank" as it were. In addition to the windstrom team Thor has another anti-Doomsday plan:the Whizzer. Doomsday will always try and kill the closest thing to him if Whizzer runs up close (but out of striking distance) of Doomsday he can get DD to chase him all over the arena while the rest of team Thor rumbles on Cap's crew. doomsday is super fast, but i just can't imagine him being able to outrun the Whizzer, I didn't think Doomsday was portrayed as being able to move unberably fast, normal people were still able to visually track his movements and react, Whizzer can go fast enough that normal people wouldn't be able to do the same to him. Using either plan team Thor should be able to tackle the rest of Cap's crew basically like a domino, Thor fights Solomon, Colossus or Colossus and Whizzer fight Cap, and Blue Beetle fights Catwoman, all of those are pretty clear wins for team Thor. After that they go back and hose down Doomsday, Doomsday can't fly, so thor can attack him practically forever from the sky with thrown hammers and lightning, in addition Blue Beetle will warn Thor of Doomsday's speed and tell him that Doomsday is too stupid to track his target with ranged attacks so Thor can keep from being hit by Doomsday, and once Thor engages Doomsday in this fashion it will hold DD's attention till the conclusion of the battle. Doomsday is extremely tough, but much too one dimensional, even a little creative use of utility and indirect power can be used against him to great effect.

[thugit]

Originally posted by Rando
Right now I vote for team Thor

I feel bad for Cap, noone on his team is going to do anything he says except for maybe Catwoman (who would get wrecked by Blue Beetle).



That's just absolutely not true. Catwoman is a superb martial artist, and has a pretty good mean streak. She would beat Beetle in a hand to hand fight pretty handlily.

Whizzer is going to outrun Doomsday? A being who can fight at speeds comparable to Superman? Not in a million years. Thor would put up a good fight, but Doomsday would overpower him. Saying otherwise is just being dishonest.

[Manchine]

I would say Cap wouldnt even fight in this battle. He would see that his team mates arent fighting for what is right.

He knows the rules and cant join the other team. So he would just sit down. Same thing if Superman was teamed up with say Joker, Bullseye, and Loki!

[supermangl1]

Doomsday can move at an accelerated rate, which mean very he's very fast. I think he can move fast enough that the magic wind storm won't effect slow him down too much. Some, but since it's the Hunter/Prey Doomsday lightning won't bring this big guy down.
Oh and Blue Beetle doesn't know about this form of Doomsday, he fought the earlier one. This one has evolved past what he was. Faster,stronger, more savage. Blue Beetle may get Thor seriously hurt giving the 'limits' of Doomsday.

[Nickel97]

Man, I want to find a way to vote for Team Thor (so that carptain america will lose), but Doomsday is just too much.

Reluctant vote for Team Doomsday

[thugit]

I suggest that all votes that even SUGGEST that a team member will switch sides, or "sit down" be not counted.

Otherwise, it will set a precedent, and people will start voting that way.

[DTM]

Originally posted by Manchine
I would say Cap wouldnt even fight in this battle. He would see that his team mates arent fighting for what is right.

He knows the rules and cant join the other team. So he would just sit down. Same thing if Superman was teamed up with say Joker, Bullseye, and Loki!

Guys, each team member MUST FIGHT. We cant have people refusing to battle just because they happen to be teamed up with Darkseid, or Thanos or Doomsday. Each team member fights, nobody quits or switches sides.

[supermangl1]

I agree with Thugit, they may not work will together, but they can't quit. Otherwise, Flash would have sat down and not fought against Captain Marvel and Red Tornado. He does know them well, and even had thankgiving diner with Cap. Marvel last Thanksgving.

[Rokk_Krinn]

I think I'm just going to abstain (or maybe play devil's advocate :) ) on this one (unless someone voices some spectacular arguements). While I know Cap has to fight, I just can't see him supporting a team that is going to use lethal force against one of his staunchest allies.

[Manchine]

Originally posted by thugit
I suggest that all votes that even SUGGEST that a team member will switch sides, or "sit down" be not counted.

Otherwise, it will set a precedent, and people will start voting that way.

Thing is I didnt vote and even if Cap didnt fight. Doomsday and Friends still win.


If you dont want to count my vote go ahead. I dont think it will make much difference. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[Manchine]

Originally posted by thugit
I suggest that all votes that even SUGGEST that a team member will switch sides, or "sit down" be not counted.

Otherwise, it will set a precedent, and people will start voting that way.

Thing is I didnt vote and even if Cap didnt fight. Doomsday and Friends still win.


If you dont want to count my vote go ahead. I dont think it will make much difference. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[thugit]

Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
I think I'm just going to abstain (or maybe play devil's advocate :) ) on this one (unless someone voices some spectacular arguements). While I know Cap has to fight, I just can't see him supporting a team that is going to use lethal force against one of his staunchest allies.



Then we might as well call the whole thing off right now.


It's going to be like this in every single match up. If Cap thought that Thor had to be killed to save the universe, he'd do it. Same with Batman and Superman. If he thought it HAD to be done, that's going to be it.

Suggesting that someone isn't going to fight, or that they'll pull thier punches because of the opponent is going to ruin this tournament.

[Manchine]

Originally posted by DTM
Guys, each team member MUST FIGHT. We cant have people refusing to battle just because they happen to be teamed up with Darkseid, or Thanos or Doomsday. Each team member fights, nobody quits or switches sides.

But then that goes against your own rules. Becuase thats not how Captain America Acts. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[DTM]

So peoploe here arent voting based on characters on one team wouldnt fight characters on another? Guys, this is what this is all about, cross universe battles.

Would it help if we set up a NO KILLING clause, and if a character is KOed they INSTANTLY are POOFed away from the battle to save their lives? Is this a beter solution and actually get Cap fighting, since he now knows that while Thor might be BEAT, he WONT DIE?

[Manchine]

Originally posted by thugit
Then we might as well call the whole thing off right now.


It's going to be like this in every single match up. If Cap thought that Thor had to be killed to save the universe, he'd do it. Same with Batman and Superman. If he thought it HAD to be done, that's going to be it.

Suggesting that someone isn't going to fight, or that they'll pull thier punches because of the opponent is going to ruin this tournament.

But this isnt to the Death and Cap knows it. Thats what Doomsday will try and do. Even if Cap doesnt know it at the start here. Cap will learn what his team is like by the end of this battle. The next battle there is no way Cap would take part in that.

[Rando]

I don't think your giving Ted enough credit, he is also a superb martial artist, in Crisis, he pounded about half a dozen people barehanded, and he has numerous superscience gadgets as well, as compared to Catwoman's whip. Regardless, this contest will not be won by these two so there isn't much need to debate too much about it.

Doomsday's strength and speed won't help him against the windstorm. Maybe I was unclear but the idea was that Thor picks Doomsday up with the wind and holds him in midair, in that situation neither Doomsday speed or strength will be of any use to him, the only thing that would matter is his weight.

While Beetle did fight an earlier version of DD, the basic principles are still the same, the power magnitude is what is different. Beetle's plans are devised to combat Doomsday by avoiding confronting his strength, not by surpassing it, so not knowing that Doomsday is stronger would not significantly alter them. Also Blue Beetle was still around for Hunter/Prey and thereafter, it was a pretty big event in teh DC universe, and Blue Beetle is still sort of in the loop about superhero stuff, so he is not relegated to just his first hand experieces.

That Thor would lose to Doomsday is a direct confrontation is not really the point. Thor's team has the know how, tools, and knowledge to avoid having this head on collision take place, so long as they take care to use them the fact that Doomsday is much stronger than Thor (and that is a fact) is essentially moot, since the two need not battle directly.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Originally posted by thugit
Then we might as well call the whole thing off right now.


It's going to be like this in every single match up. If Cap thought that Thor had to be killed to save the universe, he'd do it. Same with Batman and Superman. If he thought it HAD to be done, that's going to be it.

Suggesting that someone isn't going to fight, or that they'll pull thier punches because of the opponent is going to ruin this tournament.

Thugit, that is why I _didn't_ vote: so I wouldn't screw up the tally or give some stupid arguement like "Cap switches sides". I know Cap has to fight "to the best of his ability". Unfortunately, I also know Cap has to act "in-character" and just can't rectify the two clauses together. Rather than try to argue a side in which I can't support or back a team I don't think could win, I just chose: abstain.

Trust me, there'll be plenty of people that vote so there's no need to say, "call the whole thing off". One abstain isn't going to foul up the game. :)

[DTM]

Originally posted by thugit
Then we might as well call the whole thing off right now.


It's going to be like this in every single match up. If Cap thought that Thor had to be killed to save the universe, he'd do it. Same with Batman and Superman. If he thought it HAD to be done, that's going to be it.

Suggesting that someone isn't going to fight, or that they'll pull thier punches because of the opponent is going to ruin this tournament.

I agree with thugit 100%............did I just say that?

OK, no one can DIE, and they will be instantly BAMFed away, out of the fight, if they are to be killed. Better?

[Rokk_Krinn]

Originally posted by DTM
So peoploe here arent voting based on characters on one team wouldnt fight characters on another? Guys, this is what this is all about, cross universe battles.

Would it help if we set up a NO KILLING clause, and if a character is KOed they INSTANTLY are POOFed away from the battle to save their lives? Is this a beter solution and actually get Cap fighting, since he now knows that while Thor might be BEAT, he WONT DIE?

Well, actually, yeah. :) It helps us see the characters more "in-character" that way and doesn't set up any conflicting arguements.

[Nickel97]

Yeah, if we're going to let there be infighting among teams, or abstaining from fighting opponents that were once friends, I want to modify my vote.

Carptain America sits out because he and Thor have a special little thing. Then Doomsday tears everyone up into little tiny pieces everyone, including carptain america.

Team just Doomsday wins.

[Manchine]

Originally posted by Nickel97
Yeah, if we're going to let there be infighting among teams, or abstaining from fighting opponents that were once friends, I want to modify my vote.

Carptain America sits out because he and Thor have a special little thing. Then Doomsday tears everyone up into little tiny pieces everyone, including carptain america.

Team just Doomsday wins.

Thats the same thing I was thinking LOL.

Of course Rando does give a good counter arguement.

[Rando]

I'm against the no death thing, that also produces problems:
If Superman, or Silver Surfer (for example) know that their foes cannot die they will fight much more savagly than they normaly would (Superman versus a robot is a lot more dangerous than Superman versus a person), which violates the weaknesses some character's personalities impose upon them. I suggest that we put in place a rule that "if any member of a team will not fight or fights against his own team, then both teams are destroyed", that way Cap can't sacrfice himself, or fight against his team, since doing so would cause Thor's death anyway, and he can't sit the fight out fort he same reason, plus non-death chracters are still held in normal parameters by their code of conduct.

[DTM]

IF Thor can lift Doomsday in the air, what then? He still has to be KOed.

[Rando]

correct DTM, and I think that Thor can ko him after throwing his hammer at him repetedly for several hours, if not days.

[coad14]

team doomsday

[dj_sha]

Originally posted by DTM
The team members are listed dj, up top in the main area of the first post.


Yes, but I was referring to the listings of the previous battles as well.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Couldn't Doomsday do one of those infamous "clapping hands shockwaves" to disrupt whatever air currents Thor is using to keep Doomsday aloft? Mind you, I can't think of when Thor has ever created such a situation (and then went on to ignore it on top of everything) but I admit I'm not the most avid of Thor readers (maybe less than twenty post-Simonson-era Thor comics at my disposal).

[Rando]

Doomsday could, if Doomsday were sctually capable of coherent thought. When Maxima read his "mind" she said he was only an urge to destroy nothing more, that means Doosday is dumber than even wild animals, he probably cannot even comprenehnd what is keeping him in the air, much less determine how to counteract such a thing, this is why distracting him with the Whizzer and just moving around in air will also work against him. Doomsday literally cannot analyze his situation, he is just a destructive mechanism anything beyond "destroy closest perceived entity" is beyond his reasoning ability.

[DTM]

Yeah, I strongly disagree with Thor, the ULTIMATE TEST YOUR METTLE WARRIOR, taking such a long winded tactic which i dont think would even work to begin with. Thors NOT stupid, but he IS a Warrior of the highest caliber. Seeing Doomsday will only make him want to get up close and personal in their combat.

[supermangl1]

Can Thor keep up and the storm for days? I too have not read too many Thor books, but it seems like that would be really hard on him.

One more question, does Thor need his hammer to do weather tricks? Basically does it come out of him the ability or is it inherent of Mjonir?

[Rando]

I agree that the windstorm is kind of around the bend for Thor, personally I prefer having Whizzer provide a distraction (which I think will work almost as well). I don't think he would use such a maneuver right away, but if he is getting killed then i can see him resorting to it to survive especiaslly when it had been outlined for him before hand, and was essentially guranteed to work.

[Q99]

Doomsday's strength and speed won't help him against the windstorm. Maybe I was unclear but the idea was that Thor picks Doomsday up with the wind and holds him in midair, in that situation neither Doomsday speed or strength will be of any use to him, the only thing that would matter is his weight.

He does still, however, have ranged combat ability (shooting spikes) and can get knocked clear of the storm by a hammer hit or grab onto it. Also, he weights a ton. He is, really, a solid mass of Bone and Muscles, that's where a lot of his toughness comes from- he has no vital organs or squishy parts, just thick muscle and bone. Come to think of it, he probably weights a lot more than a ton.


Capt's sheild could be used to mess up Thor's concentration with a surprise throw, too. Capt's strategy isn't useless, it consists of 'keep people from doing overly elaborate plots against Doomsday'. Grundy's easily manipulated, that'd help, and CW is good at surprises. Although it's a good attempt by Thor, I vote for Team Doomsday (and there is a reason why I recommended him, Darksied, and Thanos be left out of the tournament; there's almost nothing else here that can stand up to them).

[supermangl1]

Hang on, Doomsday of Hunter/Prey does have some form of thought. He is not the super smart of even average smart. But he knows whats going on and who he needs to hurt. He remembers people, and all his past deaths. He won't stop till he stops Thor. He can shot his spikes on his knuckles a good distance much went through Superman, and is very poisonious, enough it effected Superman.
I just don't think Thor can lift Doomsday long enough to to hammer him down.

PLus a shield shot (ala Cap) on Thor may just do the trick to get Doomsday free. ;)

[SilverAgeFlash]

After many people have been sayign that this is Hunter/prey Doomsday i am gona switch my vote to team Doomsday. Thor will charge in and cap knows it. Cap probally wouldnt have to give orders seeing just how fricken scary Doomsday is. Cap just says to Solomen " you take care of shiny man"

Thor charges Doomsday opens up a can like non other and Thor is the last person to fall. Cap is astonished that DD beat him and thinks that maybe he does have a good team after all

[supermangl1]

This Doomsday won't be stopped by a physical assult. Thats just the honest truth. Why is he in this tourny then some will ask. A magic user could stop Doomsday, say Strange or Fate. But no way can Thor pummel Doomsday out, no way.
Doomsday took the Omega Effect, full force, and just walking toward Darkseid and then kneed him in the face.

[Q99]

Doomsday could, if Doomsday were sctually capable of coherent thought. When Maxima read his "mind" she said he was only an urge to destroy nothing more, that means Doosday is dumber than even wild animals, he probably cannot even comprenehnd what is keeping him in the air, much less determine how to counteract such a thing, this is why distracting him with the Whizzer and just moving around in air will also work against him. Doomsday literally cannot analyze his situation, he is just a destructive mechanism anything beyond "destroy closest perceived entity" is beyond his reasoning ability.


No, he's not just a mechanism, he does have a cunning to him, just no higher thought. Against Blue Beetle, he even slammed his head in a car door (pointless in the extreme, but dramatic). Although his methods are straitforward, stuff like shockwave attacks are easily within his realm of thought.

[Swiftspeedster]

Team Doomsday, the Whizzer idea would only end up getting him killed, when he fought superman one of the JLA onlookers mentioned that Doomsday was as fast as the Flash the entire fight was in superspeed. Whizzer wouldn't be able to take two steps before he was just a smear on the sidewalk, frankly, this team doesn't need anything Other than Doomsday, all the rest is just overkill.

[green_knight]

If anyone has read the latest issue of Ultimates, it has a great example of Cap pushing Hulk's buttons to control him. Being the expert tactician that he is, I'm sure he'll find a way to manipulate Grundy and Doomsday at least in the general direction he wants. Knowing that they can only be guided to a limited extent will still be enough for Cap. They don't have a great variety of powers, so its not like telling Scarlett Witch to increase the chance of Iron Man firing a beam that will randomly turn into a form of radiation that can hurt Ultron.

He just has to have them either tie up or beat up whoever he wants while he figures a way around anything else they might have. And with his Shield and acrobatic ability, he'll be able to buy that much time.

I vote for America. And by default, team Doomsday.

[KingBlackBolt]

Gotta go with team thor here. He could bring doomsday to his knees.

[Rando]

I think Thor's weather powers are derived from his hammer, he needs to have it to create and control them, but just throwing it should not disrupt that, as he can throw his hamemr and still remain aloft, and his flight is definently derived from the hammer. Given that Thor is a storm god I would be suprised if he couldn't keep weather effects in place for very extended periods, especially an open environment like this one.

I disagree that Doomsday is capable of truly coherent thought, he may have some simple programs in place that allow him to occasioanlly use tools (like a car door for instance) but I don't think he has ever really exhibited problem solving skills and again his mind is described as a mechanism by someone reading it, he travels around in straight lines with no apparent concern for the world around him beyond what he directly perceives, and he is infact a device, he is a destruction machine created on krypton. That he rembers things is not necessarily a sign of intelligence, my computer "remembers things" but it is not intelligent. This leads me to beleive that leading a target and shockwaves are beyond him.

I expect Doomsday weights between 1-2 tons, he is no larger than a very large man and strength an weight do not correlate in comics (Superman doesn't weigh more than a normal person his size for example) that is well within the lifting ability of a strong enough windstorm, tornados can pick up entire houses, which weigh like 20 tons if not more.

I doubt Doomsday's bones will ever hit Thor througha windstorm, or of Thor is moving, Doomsday is too stupid to account for wind interference or movement, he will always aim right where his target is currently satnding not where his target is moving too (just like a rookie Quake player). Furthermore Cap's shield would not be able to penetrate a windstorm strong enough to hold Doomsday up, Cap is still a man after all.

Once produced the windstorm should be able to sustain itself without Thor's concetnration, there is nothing in this environment that would hinder it were it to have formed naturally.

And finally all this is only concerning one of the two scenarios I concocted, Beetle could proabaly think of many more with the tools available to him, he is literlally a mechanical genius, and this is effectively a mechanical problem.

[SteveRogers]

I have to go with team CapDay, it's got alot of power and a sneaky supporter in Catwoman.

[Laenan]

Doomsday is roughly equal to, or slightly, overall, more powerful than superman. Superman beat Thor. Therefore, Doomsday beat Thor. After Thor falls, Colossus will(as he has to close to fight). After that? Blue Beetle? Whizzer? I don't think so.

And unfortunately, even if DD falls, Thor will too(Like Supes did), and I don't see Cap, CW, and SG losing to the others.
Cap would beat Whizzer. CW and Beetle stalemate, as do Grundy and Colossus. Cap assissts, and in the end, his tteam will win.

[Rando]

I was typing that larger response before i read Swifspeedsters input on the Whizzer idea, and if Doomsday is really that close to being as fast as the Flash then I concur that the Whizzer idea in not feasible, but not that the windstorm or anything else Ted Kord could come up with isn't.

[Maniac_nmt]

Captain America and Catwoman will make very, very short work of the Whizzer and Blue Beetle. In fact, I'd go so far as to say it's a complete and total cake walk done quicker then it takes batman to put his costume on.

However, It's all downhill from there.

This Doomsday can be beaten through purely physical force, and Thor brings that in spades. Pepper him with mystic blasts, beat the hell out of him with a few tosses of Mjolnir, or slap him down in cc.

Unfortunately for Cap, he has no team to work with other then Catwoman. Who would follow his lead quite well, irregardless. Cap can inspire anyone, and get them to follow his lead. It's just not enough when the other two are basically mindless.

If Cap had some heavies he could work with, this is a defeinate Cap win, but he doesn't. Cap is down and out, what a shame. With something to work with his team could have been the team to beat, saddly it isn't so.

[proditor]

Again, it's the 10 minute rule that does it for me. As I understand it, you get 10 minutes with your new buddies to come up with a plan to counter the known group you are about to face. This is the whole dynamic for me.

Over in Pen 1: Doomsady seethes while Cap outlines a salient 4 pronged round-robin attack scenario that mixes agility with raw power. Catwoman nods and pays close attention, even suggesting a minor tweak or two. Grundy nods but then asks "Why little flag-man use big words?"

Over in Pen 2: Team Thor sits down and starts to hash things out. Ted Kord takes one look at the picture (or holo, or what have you) of Doomsday and starts to turn white as a sheet. "Verily my stalwart insect comrade, the color hath drained from thy face! Doth something in yon dossier trouble thee?" Beetle nods mutely and explains Doomsday. He explains this guy killed Superman. Thor frowns deeply. "Though I had no thought to bear my gauntlets Iarn Greiper or my Belt Megingarder, this foe you describe sounds like one that doth deserve the full measure of my power." Dramatic pause. "Though it shall scourge the skin from my own bones, I shall unleash the unfettered might upon this enemy most dire." Explanations follow, plans are laid amongst 4 of the best support members of any superteam ever. After all, that's what these 4 all do to some degree or another all the time, they make plans work. Whether it is the Whizzer's speed, Colossus' strength, Blue Beetle's ingenuity or the raw might of Thor, these 4 are used to making a plan work.

With little to no combat flair from the big guys on Team Doomsday, they split it up as follows.

Blue Beetle knows he isn't going to be doing much to Doomsday or Grundy for that matter. Instead, he makes a supreme annoyance or himself. Blasting Selina with the strobe, Cap with the compressed air, and moving like a maniac. Colossus has one job, keep Grundy occupied. And now it's down to Whizzer and Doomsday. Yes, Doomsday fights fast, but he never did Flash level moving. So Whizzer scoops up an armload of rocks and gets DD's attention by rapid fire pelting him with stones. Drawing the killing machine to a clear area, he then just gets out of dodge as the hammer laden hammer of uru annihilates a good tenth of the arena. Thor barely hangs on after the attack and is able to aid Colossus in taking out Grundy. Whizzer and Beetle both fall to Cap/Selina, but Selina drops as well. We now have Cap vs. Thor and Colossus. With the ability to tie him up using his flagging strength (Specifically by making the weather too inclement for cap but not for him or Colossus) Team Thor barely, barely pulls out the win.

My vote: Team Thor.

[SteveRogers]

Ya know what, sorry DTM, but I have to change my vote to Thor. His team is balanced and the others of Cap's team won't listen. As much as I like Captain America, I just can't see his team winning if they won't take orders, and they won't. Without Cap leading the charge, it's all mayhem and Cap can't control this force.

[Maniac_nmt]

Exactly, Cap will end up the last one falling I think in his team. All the rest will be down and out before Cap goes down. Simply cause he's Cap.

In the end though, it's not so much a contest. Doomsday has never faced anything like Mjolnir. It is exactly the the thing needed to bring down such a beast. After all, he's not the destroyer (who would have made a good SHW, except for his atomize the planet trick, and the fact he must have a controlling influence), and can be hurt and damaged.

Supes beat him once the kid gloves came off, and the kid gloves will be off Thor from the start. If supes had fought it that way he'd have won, and gone home for coffee. Thor won't suffer from a boy scout attitude.

Won't be the easiet fight he's had, but it will be one he wins hands down. Colossus is no slouch either, and can tackle Grundy quite well.

Whizzer and Beetle just delay the innevitable. They won't beat Cap and Catwoman (who will end up finding steve a whole lot sexier then the Bat, but Cap will never realise it. It's a amazing how many woman go for clueless steve rogers, while he's oblivious to it). Not here, not to today.

[DreadDormammu]

I'm going to throw down a tentative vote for Team Thor simply because Thor can fly and attack from range against Doomsday.

I may change my mind though.

[ex0dus]

all the lower people could be pretty even but i would give doomsday the win over thor so team doomsday wins

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by Laenan
Doomsday is roughly equal to, or slightly, overall, more powerful than superman.This is true, but Superman had a disadvantage in that fight: he had to come to Doomsday. Doomsday is grounded and a flying enemy can take advantage of that. But in the Superman/Doomsday battle, leaving Doomsday alone on the ground meant Doomsday would start destroying innocent people and their property. Superman was forced to confront Doomsday on Doomsday's terms. Thor will not have that disadvantage here and can let loose with hammer throws and divine lightning strokes.

[Q99]

but I don't think he has ever really exhibited problem solving skills and again his mind is described as a mechanism by someone reading it,

But in this situation, he doesn't really need to.

I expect Doomsday weights between 1-2 tons, he is no larger than a very large man and strength an weight do not correlate in comics (Superman doesn't weigh more than a normal person his size for example) that is well within the lifting ability of a strong enough windstorm, tornados can pick up entire houses, which weigh like 20 tons if not more.

Superman's a large man. Doomsday's like 13 feet tall.

And a house has a lot more surface area than DD. It's not just mass, it's density.

I doubt Doomsday's bones will ever hit Thor througha windstorm, or of Thor is moving, Doomsday is too stupid to account for wind interference or movement, he will always aim right where his target is currently satnding not where his target is moving too (just like a rookie Quake player).

He was designed for fighting, he had no trouble hitting Superman (and I don't think Wind Resistance is going to matter much to projectiles that fast (fast enough to pierce Superman's skin) and aerodynamic). He's pure combat instinct, he'll never think of aiming right for someone who's a moving target. If he had problems like that, even with his superspeed and insane strength, Superman would've never had a problem with him.

Post #64 of 69

Doomsday is roughly equal to, or slightly, overall, more powerful than superman. Superman beat Thor. Therefore, Doomsday beat Thor. After Thor falls, Colossus will(as he has to close to fight). After that? Blue Beetle? Whizzer? I don't think so.



Actually, H/P Doomsday is half again as strong as Superman, perhaps more, at the least.

This Doomsday can be beaten through purely physical force, and Thor brings that in spades.

True, against a normal foe, Thor has more than enough. He's on par with Supes.

This Doomsday beat Superman, Orion and Martian Manhunter together.

Thor, really, does not have enough physical force to beat Doomsday. Not even close.

[gladiator1518]

This is a huge mismatch. Team DOOMSDAY wins easily.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Everyone's missing the best way for Cap to direct Grundy: all he has to do is point out that the other team has some really nifty pair of pants. ;)

I would have to disagree that Doomsday is mindless. He's more like a focused machine. Is he intelligent in the traditional sense? Not at all, but he does know how to kill. Much like an insect he's a very specialized beast but that also means he very well may know how to keep after his foe, even if it means doing something with animal cunning - so long as he gets to close in for a kill.

Does Thor have access to the gauntlets and belt here as I thought he normally doesn't carry them?

Doomsday's speed is being overrated. Part of the reason for this is because of the usage of the name "Flash" without putting it into context - Wally was pre-"Return of Barry Allen" speeds at the time, which is _far_ slower than what we normally think of the Flash being. Also Doomsday maybe reactes and swings at superhuman speeds but he doesn't seem to dash around in a super-sonic sprint. I'd also hesitate to believe that Doomsday was even as fast as Wally was at that point if only because when you're getting slaughtered by some new creature, it's easy to exaggerate. :)

Mind you, I'm not sure which team I support - just voicing a few remarks about previous posts.

[Q99]

This is true, but Superman had a disadvantage in that fight: he had to come to Doomsday. Doomsday is grounded and a flying enemy can take advantage of that.
---
Thor will not have that disadvantage here and can let loose with hammer throws and divine lightning strokes.

Actually, Superman tried that to get breathing room in their first fight. DD jumped and intercepted him in the air, clobbering Kal for the attempt. Flying is not a defense against Doomsday, he leaps sufficiently well that it might as well be flight in taking on airborn enemies.

[DTM]

Originally posted by Maniac_nmt
Exactly, Cap will end up the last one falling I think in his team. All the rest will be down and out before Cap goes down. Simply cause he's Cap.

In the end though, it's not so much a contest. Doomsday has never faced anything like Mjolnir. It is exactly the the thing needed to bring down such a beast. After all, he's not the destroyer (who would have made a good SHW, except for his atomize the planet trick, and the fact he must have a controlling influence), and can be hurt and damaged.

Supes beat him once the kid gloves came off, and the kid gloves will be off Thor from the start. If supes had fought it that way he'd have won, and gone home for coffee. Thor won't suffer from a boy scout attitude.

Won't be the easiet fight he's had, but it will be one he wins hands down. Colossus is no slouch either, and can tackle Grundy quite well.

Whizzer and Beetle just delay the innevitable. They won't beat Cap and Catwoman (who will end up finding steve a whole lot sexier then the Bat, but Cap will never realise it. It's a amazing how many woman go for clueless steve rogers, while he's oblivious to it). Not here, not to today.


This Doomsday is NOT the one Superman beat, its an updated and more powerful form. I dont see Thor coming out Magical blasts a blazing. hell come out BRUTE FORCE swinging and fighting like theres no tomorrow. Doomsday might not have every faced Mjolnir, but I dont think Thor has EVER faced an opponent like Doomsday. Not Hulk, not Ulik, not even the Destroyer.

Now that being said, Thor DOES have a way to defeat Doomsday, and thats powerful magical attacks.....BUT, as mentioned above, he doesnt routinely start a battle with such forms. Even with BBs warning, I can see the WARRIOR in Thor wanting to test himself on Doomsday, and that will be his downfall. Thor cannot beat Doomsday hand to hand, PERIOD.

[proditor]

Originally posted by Q99
This Doomsday beat Superman, Orion and Martian Manhunter together.

Thor, really, does not have enough physical force to beat Doomsday. Not even close. I think if Thor whipped out Unfettered Might, you have one potentially dead, but definitely out cold Doomsday. And while it is not the norm for him to pull that sucker out, he'd know (in general) about Doomsday from Beetle. After Thor fought Big Blue and knowing how hard it was to even stun him, he is not going to handle Doomsday with anything less than full and potentially lethal force.

[DTM]

Current Voting Totals:

Team Doomsday - 13 votes
Team Thor - 8 votes

[gladiator1518]

Originally posted by KingBlackBolt
Gotta go with team thor here. He could bring doomsday to his knees. LOL. :laugh: :laugh: laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :p :p :p :p :p

[SilverAgeFlash]

i dont think you guys are keepign in mind just how powerful this DD is. IF/when Thor Charges DD he wont get out, DD will eat him alive. There are few people in the tounry that can stop this guy, Doc Strange Doc Fate

[DTM]

And THOR. If Thor atacked only with Magic and powerful blasts at that, I think he COULD KO Doomsday. BUT, Thor doesnt fight like that, and I dont think Blue Beetle is going to convince him that DD is a MONSTER. Thor is going to get into the thick of the battle, and hes going to get EVENTUALLY beat. Thor is UNREAL, I love him, but this opponent is simply too much for Thors physical might to handle.

[proditor]

I dunno DTM, Thor can be brash, but if Blue Beetle says "Yeah, that guy killed Superman and beat up the Justice League all by himself" Thor is not going to think "Woo-hoo! A challenge!" He's going to try and figure out how to take this guy down. Once you get Thor out of the Avengers, he seems to gain +10 INT or +2 ranks of Reason depending on your preferred gaming system. ;) Take a look at how Thor beat the Midgaurd Serpent as an example. He didn't charge in and got as much preliminary info as possible before engaging in what was eventually a fight to the death. And honestly, if Unfettered Might can kill a serpent that is as long as the planet is round, that could crush the planet by squeezing it's coils too hard...well, Doomsday just ain't that big in the grand scheme.

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by Q99
And a house has a lot more surface area than DD. It's not just mass, it's density.Regardless, even a small tornado could easily lift something of Doomsday's mass. Easily

(and I don't think Wind Resistance is going to matter much to projectiles that fast (fast enough to pierce Superman's skin) and aerodynamic)Again, a full tornado level storm is more than just wind resistance. I think the question is, would Thor be using a storm at that level? Even if he can (which varies based on writer), it would destroy his teammates (except perhaps Colossus).

Thor, really, does not have enough physical force to beat Doomsday. Not even close.If that is true, Doomsday can't be beaten in this tournament. I will go ahead and assume that the (arguably) mightiest weapon in the Marvel Universe can hurt and eventually defeat Doomsday. :p It may not get the chance to defeat him, but arguing it is not possible to defeat him is rather dumb.

[TheUltimates]

If DD were to get pissed at Cap could he kill him? I mean, is that possible. If not, then we could use the Hulk tactic.

Just piss him off and release him.

[DTM]

He CAN be beat by magical and mental attacks of a strong enough nature. He hasnt evolved past those, and is still suseptible to them damaging and KOing him. Even the Power Cosmic, being a new form to DD, would cause him serious harm if powerful enough.

Also, keep in mind, these battles take place as if NONE of the DC/Marvel crossovers have ever occured, always have. So if BB tells him Superman fell to DD, their mightiest warrior, Thor wouldnt know a thing about Superman or his power level. I still see the Warrior in Thor going in and battling DD physically, which he will lose.

Doomsday is tough, but with Dr. Strange, Dr Fate, Despero, Phoenix, Silver Surfer, Thanos and possibly even Hulk, Juggernaut or Kurse (who is TWICE the physical power Thor is) I think DD could possibly be taken. Thor is TOUGH, I grant you, but there are tougher and stronger.

[pangea]

why isn't the doomsday in this tournament from when he fought superman? That doomsday seems powerful enough to be shw to me. While the improved Doomsday seems out of the shw category

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by DTM
Juggernaut or Kurse (who is TWICE the physical power Thor is)He ain't no twice Mjolnir though. Neither of these two can lay out as much damage as Thor can do.

[Rokk_Krinn]

Originally posted by TheUltimates
If DD were to get pissed at Cap could he kill him? I mean, is that possible. If not, then we could use the Hulk tactic.

Just piss him off and release him.

According to DTM, teammembers will be playing fairly with each other, so I guess Doomsday wouldn't go after Cap.

The Hulk brings up an interesting point: why hasn't Thor used the wind updraft and "staying away with lightning strikes" tactic against the Jade Goliath? Instead almost everytime they square off, Thor decides he needs to get in there and mix it up physically.

Like DD points out, for Thor to create such a massive tornado (and then expect it to just stand in one spot the whole time) would put Thor's teammates at risk as well. That would include Colossus (as Riptide essentially used the "tornado wind velocity" technique to impale Piotr - I'm guessing an F5 tornado might hurl something nasty debris; heck, with Piotr's luck it would be Cap's shield after Thor clobbered the Star-Spangled Avenger).

Beetle telling Thor, "Doomsday killed Superman" will mean squat to the Odinson because we've done these tournaments with the basic understanding that the "company crossovers" aren't canon - i.e.: Thor doesn't know or care about this so-called Superman. He just sees the halfbreed spawn of giants and trolls, a creature that should be darkening the tunnels of Nefelheim, not standing proudly on the battlefields. What does Thor traditionally do to monsters: displace them from the field of battle or mix it up mano-e-mano?

[DreadDormammu]

Originally posted by pangea
why isn't the doomsday in this tournament from when he fought superman? That doomsday seems powerful enough to be shw to me. While the improved Doomsday seems out of the shw category No kidding. I guess we have to wait until Doomsday faces Doctor Doom for a real battle. :laugh:

[TheUltimates]

Why is DoomsDay in this tourney if everyone is talking about how Über he is? If the strongest (Not talking about Thor, but there have been reports of him taking 3 or 4 SWH at a time and still winning) in the tourney can't beat him, isn't he to powerful?

I just think that the information provided, that he needs to be brought down a level that he can compete against.

Just a thought, and for that reason, and the other 6 pages of reason, DD team for me.

But if within that 10 minutes BB can tell thor, and he listens, I think thor can do it.

But until other wise, DD.

[Maniac_nmt]

actually DTM Thor does fight exactly like that, against foes exactly like this.

If he knows cracking him in the head is of little use, he is highly likely to whip the magic out, and then it's crunchy-fied DD.

As to it being Hunter/Prey DD, everyone I had read (and I only read through about a page and a half) said this was the same DD that fought Supes.

Hell, Mjolnir itself is magic, so getting slapped with it, is different then slapped with another big hammer.

I don't see Thor charging recklessly in.

[bluebeetle]

team thor

[Maniac_nmt]

oh, and thor does often displace monsters he can't beat in the open setting.

I don't know that Thor has ever claimed to be the mightest ever, simply the mightiest of the Avengers, and he is.

[Q99]

Regardless, even a small tornado could easily lift something of Doomsday's mass. Easily

A small something? No. Wind resistance is a major factor- a house in a tornado is actually absorbing well over a hundred times as much force as a person, even Doomsday, is. DD doesn't catch nearly as much wind, so the power exerted on him is greatly reduced.

You can make a 5-pound compressed weight with minimized surface area that wouldn't be budged by a tornado and a 100-ton sail that'd be ripped from the ground in a second. It's mass per surface area that matters, in this case.

There's a good chance that Doomsday's ultra-dense bones and flesh is simply too massive for the amount of air he catches to come close to lifting him up.

If that is true, Doomsday can't be beaten in this tournament.

I've been arguing that myself. This Doomsday has barely been slowed by multiple warriors in Thor's league fighting at the same time, he trashed Darksied and Superman working in co-ordination.

Odin-powered Thor could probably do so, but even that would be a battle. Doomsday is overwhelimg physical might.

[DTM]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
He ain't no twice Mjolnir though. Neither of these two can lay out as much damage as Thor can do.

Possibly, but in a battle of Kurse vs Thor, Im picking Kurse 9 out of 10 times. He crushed Thor when they fought, and only thru his Belt of Strength did Thor manage to turn the tides some.

[Q99]

Also, have we forgotten to mention that Doomsday has superspeed recently? He's, in addition to being tougher and stronger, far faster than the warrior guard.

And to make it worse, he has 3 people covering for him! So Thor has to beat Doomsday with distractions, including Capt (who can be quite good at providing distractions).

Might Mjolner hurt Doomsday? Yes, with sufficient pounding. Will Thor beat Doomsday? No, since he's not going to get near enough time for sufficient pounding. Superman literally fighting himself to death with Superspeed on his side made a simple draw against a weaker Doomsday than this. Thor'd need help from quite a few other heroes in his league in order to beat DD.

[DTM]

Characters that can possibly beat Doomsday, THIS Doomsday:

Any powerful magic using characters (since he hasnt developed an immunity to magic as yet)

Loki, Dr. Strange, Dr Fate, Thor (IF he uses his magical blasts before he gets wrecked, which I dont see him doing over a straight up brawl)

Any Mentalist characters (again, since DD hasnt developed an immunity to mental attacks)

Phoenix, Despero, White Queen, Martian Manhunter

Any Power Cosmic characters (since DD hasnt fought a Marvel character before, and the Power Cosmic really only exists in Marvel, he wouldnt be immune to its effects)

Thanos, Silver Surfer

There are about 9 to 10 different characters that can possibly take THIS Doomsday. Not to mention any help they might get from their teammates, (remember, this isnt a one on one battle here)

Not to mention Hulk, who POSSIBLY could reach strengths enough to defeat DD. Kurse, who is twice as powerful as Thor is. Juggernaut, who many here say he cannot be harmed physically. ETC.

THIS Doomsday is TOUGH, YES, but there are people here who have a 50/50 chance to defeat him.

Heck, Dr Doom can defeat several of the HWs here at once, should he beat raised to the SHWs because of it?

[GreatArelius1]

Doomsday team

[DTM]

I believe the reason DD can survive Darkseids Omega Beams is that they fought previously to Hunter/Prey and he did evolve beyond that attack in Hunter/Prey. Cant use the same attack, at the same power level, twice, which is why it didnt work.

Also, DD didnt fight Superman and Darkseid at ONCE, he beat Darkseid and soon after fought Superman. It wasnt a team assault on DD from those two.

[SilverAgeFlash]

So DTM are you ruling that Dooms magic isnt good enough to hurt Doomsday, should the need arise

[DTM]

Well, Dooms very nice with the magics, but hes no Dr Strange, Fate or Loki with them. Magic wise ALONE, I dont think Doom has the power to take DD. With FLash and his teammates....well, I dont know. Thats up to us all to decide when and if the time comes.

Yes, this Doomsday is powerful, but so is Thanos, Darkseid, Despero and Kurse, who have ALL handled multiple SHWs in combat.

[Prof. Aragorn]

Thor's gonna get whacked, Cap will get sad, but mourn for him and then get back to winning the tournament.
I'm gonna have to go with Catwoman and Grundy's team!

Also about the no help the bad guy for the sake of being good: Let's say if the guy is about to be killed than bamf! Gone, koed. However the good guys fighting do not know this and think, "well I got to beat him" while the bad guys fighting think, "well I got to kill him" The thing that will happen is Doomsday is going to beat on Thor, before Thor is dead, he'll pass out and be taken away thus allowing the mighty asgardian to live. However come next fight, the people fighting will just "forget" about the disappearing KO.

[Spyder-Man]

I'm going to have to say team Doomsday. He's going to flip out and do nuts on everyone and just start tearing through them. I don't see Thor being able to stop him and if Thor can't stop him I don't see anyone else on the team doing it either.

[DTM]

Current Voting Totals:

Team Thor - 9 votes
Team Doomsday - 17 votes

[Grinner]

Originally posted by DTM
If Thor atacked only with Magic and powerful blasts at that, I think he COULD KO Doomsday. BUT, Thor doesnt fight like that, and I dont think Blue Beetle is going to convince him that DD is a MONSTER. Thor is going to get into the thick of the battle, and hes going to get EVENTUALLY beat. Thor is UNREAL, I love him, but this opponent is simply too much for Thors physical might to handle.

Sums up my basic feelings very well. Could Thor beat Doomsday? Yes. Will he, most of the time, fighting in character? No.

Team Captain Doomsday to win.

[DarthDoom]

Originally posted by DreadDormammu
No kidding. I guess we have to wait until Doomsday faces Doctor Doom for a real battle. :laugh: DOOM will crush this name robing, brainless gorilla. Two words, Mind switch. and this can be debated as everyone else says doomsday has a mind. WAH HA HA HA:laugh:

[Prof. Aragorn]

Originally posted by DarthDoom
DOOM will crush this name robing, brainless gorilla. Two words, Mind switch. and this can be debated as everyone else says doomsday has a mind. WAH HA HA HA:laugh:
Especially with Flash Speed and Deathstroke's "adamantium" sword:p

[mick77]

If superman can beat DD then so can Thor
Colossus should beat Grundy . Catwoman and Cap you be able to take car of the 2 others,
But Colossus and Thor vs Catwoman and Cap America

Team Thor for the win

[Rokk_Krinn]

Originally posted by mick77
If superman can beat DD then so can Thor


Er, except Superman died when he first fought Doomsday. Supes didn't die when he beat Thor. Just a thought. :)

[Macho Man]

people under estamate thors hammer. I think that thor AS A GOD and all should be able to beat Doomsday. I vote team thor.

[BAKID]

I think it all comes down to whether Blue Beetle can convince Thor to not mix it up hand-to-hand with Doomsday. While I agree Thor might wade in hth first, he is NOT going to be holding anything back. Once Doomsday starts whaling away on Thor he still should be able to knock Doomsday flying at least once, which will give him time to get airborne and start bringing the thunder. Plus, Blue Beetle has personal experience with Doomsday putting him in a coma. I see Thor going airborne and magicking Doomsday to unconsciousness at least 70 % of the time, so I'm gonna give the win to Team Thor.

Captain America's leadership skills are wasted on Grundy and Doomsday.

[UsagiYojimbo]

Team Thor with the majic attacks.

[UsagiYojimbo]

Cap has no control over this team and frustration will be what KOs the cap. "Grundy get collosus" says Cap......"Collosasaurus?"Replys Grundy

[DTM]

Can Thor STAY in the air and throw down magical bolts from his Hammer at the same time? I got the impression he flew by throwing his hammer and holding on, I dont even think he can hover. If hes on the ground, even for a second, Doomsday will be on him. Also, DD can jump, Really High, and Very Accurately. I dont think Thors going to have enough time to get the shots he needs in, and thats IF Thor ever took that route to begin with.

[Q99]

Plus, Blue Beetle has personal experience with Doomsday putting him in a coma.

Well, considering how hard he got hit, he might not...

("Well, they tell me I had personal experiance, and I have the scars, but I don't remember anything on that day past breakfast...")

people under estamate thors hammer. I think that thor AS A GOD and all should be able to beat Doomsday. I vote team thor.


But being a God in comics doesn't mean all that much. I mean, sure, it makes him strong, but Darksied is a God who stole power from a pantheon of Gods in order to gain his strength, and Doomsday still beat him (both before he stole power and later when he was at full strength). Doomsday is a being who -slays- Gods.

All accounts do put Thor and Superman fairly even, and all accounts do put Doomsday rather above Superman. It took Superman's life to beat him the first time, and this is him recovered from that, with a ranged attack and more strength and toughness now. Unless it's Odin-powered Thor (which, btw, it isn't), most of the time DD is going to definitely win.

[UsagiYojimbo]

"Doomsday, Duck a flying hammer!" Says cap .......... RRRRRRRRAAAAAHHHHHHH" says Doomday:knockedou

[Rokk_Krinn]

Y'know, I made as many jokes as anyone about Cap having trouble with Grundy - though I still think bribing him with pants would work ;) - but here's something to consider: Two-Face was able to command and lead/manipulate Grundy. I just don't see Harvey Dent as a better leader of men (and failed elementals) than Cap.

[UsagiYojimbo]

"I miss my Avengers" crys Cap

[Q99]

Cap has no control over this team and frustration will be what KOs the cap. "Grundy get collosus" says Cap......"Collosasaurus?"Replys Grundy


Ah, but that's what Catwoman is for.

"Grundy? Be a dear and smash shiny over these. He insulted my outfit!"

"Grundy hurt metal man for pretty kitty lady!"

[UsagiYojimbo]

Originally posted by Q99

Ah, but that's what Catwoman is for.

"Grundy? Be a dear and smash shiny over these. He insulted my outfit!"

"Grundy hurt metal man for pretty kitty lady!" [/B] LOL:laugh: good one

[TheUltimates]

remove my vote for DD.

I vote team Thor. I also think of Thor being a god. Not just a warrior.

[DarthDoom]

DOOM thinks that Thor can take em.

[Perfectstorm]

Team Thor

The two biggest wild cards are in this match. The hammer and the sheild.
Unfortuently for team Doomsday, the sheild is held by a man, though perhaps the best man, and the hammer is held by a god. Cap falls to Collosus or Thor, or whizzer pick it out of the air if cap tries to throw it. Now Thor has an unbreakable sheild, and A magic hammer that commands weather. I think the tides just turned to his favor, as now he posses something that perhaps even doomsday cannot hurt.
Now If you let Colossus work over cappy and Catwoman and have Beetle and Wizzer distract Grundy til Colssus gets back, you could quickly end up with a 4-1 against Doomsday.

And i know I am opening up a can of worms, but if Thor falls, I beleive there are 2 people here who are, or should be able to pick up the hammer. One being Cap, and the other being, and this will be disputed, Collosus (He is exactly what the Norse loved. He sacrificed himself to save people, he is a big strong guy, and he is capable of that raw rage that they tend to love, as he showed when he beat the muraders and killed riptide, in cold blood). So even if Thor Falls, this battle would still be very interesting.

[DarthDoom]

:cool:

[Ghost Ripper]

I vote Team Flash with Dr. Doom because apparently There so powerful together that not even DoomsDay can stand against him. Why continue with this charade of what team will beat what team if Flash and Doom can beat everyone.

[Ghost Ripper]

I vote team Thor if he opens a Portal to a pocket Dimension and Throws DD into it. If this is unallowable then I vote team DD. However, if Magik can hurt one kyptoninan then it should be able to affect another as well.

[Grinner]

Originally posted by Ghost Ripper
I vote team Thor if he opens a Portal to a pocket Dimension and Throws DD into it. If this is unallowable then I vote team DD.

No teleporting things into or out of the arena. One of the basic rules.

[DTM]

Also, I dont think Doomsday is Kryptonian. He was created on Krypton, but he doesnt share many of their powers and weaknesses.

Well, guess Ill vote now and Ill go for Team Doomsday. Im sorry, but unless Thor starts out with Unfettered Might magical attack, Doomsday is going to wreck him. Thor can fight with the best of them, but Doomsday is simply better. Stronger, Faster, Greater Endurance, More Durable, More Savage.

Catwoman is going to take Blue Beetle. Cap will eventually beat Whizzer, since while hes Fast, hes NOT THAT FAST. Grundy and Colossus will keep each other busy for a while, but Doomsday will just kill....er....KO nicely, Colossus if he wins.


Current Voting Totals:

Team Doomsday - 19 votes
Team Thor - 15 votes

[skyounkin]

Team Doomsday!!!

Rage on toast beats the Thunder God......

Doomsday killed Superman who if you forget KNOCKED OUT THOR!!!:grin:

Just like rubbing it in every chance I get.

Captain America beats Whizzer because of his stupid name

Catwoman ties up BB who of course lets her:devious: Heck who wouldn't!!

Doomsday could probably beat both Colossus AND Thor at the same time but with Solomon Grundy in the mix forget it, they are DONE!

[Zephyr Dude]

Team Doomsday all the way!

From the beginning, I think that team Doomsday will be going far in this tourney. Cap will realize quickly that Grundy and DD will not follow orders, so he will strategize alongside Catwoman for a powerful one-two punch! These two are the definite combo for Light and Middle weight classes. Together, they can take some of the hw's in this tourney without the aid of Grundy!

[Rando]

1.Unless he has grown since Death of Superman Doomsday is not 13 feet tall, he stands eye to eye with Superman, he is not the size of a bus.

2.I'm truly shocked at how little credit Thor's mind is being given here. Thor is not some mindless behemoth that has to fight everything, his arch-enemy is Loki, the trickster god, Thor is regularly able to see through Loki's deceptions, he also confronts Amora the Enchantress, and is able to eventually avoid her wiles. Thor is also a mainstay of the Avengers, he is not at all unused to defeating foes through indirect combat, that is what the Avengers do, it isn't like every fight the Avengers get into boils down to: "if we pile Thor, Iron Man, and Vision onto this villian we will whoop him", they constantly find ways to bypass foes might, Thor isn't shown to do it as much because they use Tony stark and Hank Pym's science more often than not Thor is better utilized keeping the foe busy so the science can be brought to bear, but Thor can be called upon to do so on occasion (most notably draining people's powers away like he did that of The Presence). Thor hasn't used a windstorm attack before (maybe, I harldy have every comic Thor is in, not even close, so he could have done this before for all I know)because usually there is no need to, it is a delaying tactic, anywhere other than this arena Thor can (and has) thrown foes that need to be temporarily disposed of through a dimensional portal, he is forced to use other methods here due to the tournament stipulations. Thor can absolutley defiently Throw lightning and/or his hammer in the air he has done so so many times that I can't even begin to count them all, he shoots while flying almost as often as Iron Man. Thor has absolutely fought foes of this magnitude before, so far as I'm concerned the Destroyer armor, Hulk, and Count Nefaria are very close if not there, Desak the god killer defiently is, all of these foes except the Destroyer armor were beaten by Thor or a team he was on through indirect combat, not because Thor and his team could just hit them hard enough to make them fall over.Thor can also probably block Doomsday's bone shards with his hammer, he routinely blocks energy blasts with it, and those have got to be coming at him faster than bone shards.

3. It is worth noteing that now that death doesn't matter things like Thor's Tornado destroying his team are irrelevant if Thor kills everyone else in the arena with this thing it doesn't make any difference, they didn't actually die. Regardless there is not reason for Thor's team to get messed up by the windstorm, a tornado is about 20-30 feet across and they routinely pick up things much heavier than Doomsday, this arena is 10 miles long, the tornado can just blow around away from the battle, if it gets close Thor commands it to move away and goes back to pounding things.

4.When I first created the windstorm idea I was under the impression that death actually mattered, now that it doesn't Thor doesn't need to immoblize Doomsday with wind at all. The windstorm is there ot portect Thor's team, Thor protects himself by being in the air. Thor is an ancient warrior god, Superman is not, ergo it will be much harder to hit Thor than Superman as Thor is better at dodging things. Thor can also intercept oncoming missles and persons with a thrown hammer or by blocking them, Superman's heat vision could not do this it is heat, it cannot stop or deflect oncoming projectiles unless it vaporizes them. Since noone on Doomsday's team has any possibility at all of even touching a flying Thor, Thor fighting Doomsday from the air and Thor fighting Doomsday's whole team from the air is essentially the same battle. The whirlwind is a humanitarian effort to keep Thor's teammates alive, if it fails, then Doomsday still has no good way to attack Thor that doesn't invovle Thor being very stupid.

5.Thor can break away from Doomsday easily, he summons a lightning bolt on the spot where they are fighting it blows Doomsday off his feet but doesn't harm Thor (Thor can't be hurt by his own lighting) Thor takes off into the air. Alternatively Thor can throw his hammer at Doomsday from point blank range and send Doomsday flying with it, again this is an attack against Doomsday's weight not his strength. The Hammer will return before Doomsday recovers and gets back to Thor so Thor takes off.

6.Essentially the only way for Doomsday's one dimensional team to win is for Thor to disregard all his numerous experiences with brutal foes more powerful than himself, and his decades of working as a team to beat these foes in order to fight Doomsday to the death in order to satisfy some need to prove he is better than this thing that isn't even a person. Doomsday isn't even a real warrior he is just an it, a machine designed solely for killing. Maybe when he was a rookie to the super hero buisness Thor would be so foolish as to disregard a plan (or plans) handed directly to him that have a high chance of sucess, but not anymore having been a veteran of countless conflicts, most won by intelligence and guile just as much as by force fo arms Thor ought to know better than to just allow Doomsday to just beat him to death.

[Gentlegamer]

TEAM DOOMSDAY: Catwoman, Captain America, Solomon Grundy, Doomsday

[Ghost Ripper]

Originally posted by DTM
Also, I dont think Doomsday is Kryptonian. He was created on Krypton, but he doesnt share many of their powers and weaknesses.

Well, guess Ill vote now and Ill go for Team Doomsday. Im sorry, but unless Thor starts out with Unfettered Might magical attack, Doomsday is going to wreck him. Thor can fight with the best of them, but Doomsday is simply better. Stronger, Faster, Greater Endurance, More Durable, More Savage.

Catwoman is going to take Blue Beetle. Cap will eventually beat Whizzer, since while hes Fast, hes NOT THAT FAST. Grundy and Colossus will keep each other busy for a while, but Doomsday will just kill....er....KO nicely, Colossus if he wins.


Current Voting Totals:

Team Doomsday - 19 votes
Team Thor - 15 votes

I'm pretty sure he is Kyptonian, I don't remember all the way but I think the baby was a base off of the kyrptonian Scientist. At and rate, did anyone see in the Avengets/JLA crossover in the Lower left coner of a page in book #4 Thor is clocking/Rocking Doomsday off his feet with Mojilnor? I give this to Team Thor for that and Many more Reasons.

[Gentlegamer]

Originally posted by Ghost Ripper
I'm pretty sure he is Kyptonian, I don't remember all the way but I think the baby was a base off of the kyrptonian Scientist. At and rate, did anyone see in the Avengets/JLA crossover in the Lower left coner of a page in book #4 Thor is clocking/Rocking Doomsday off his feet with Mojilnor? I give this to Team Thor for that and Many more Reasons.

Do you have proof that was Hunter/Prey Doomsday?

[Q99]

Yea, that was probably wussified Doomsday (sorta like non-unstopppable juggernaught, we don't care about him).


Also, not only will Catwoman beat Blue Beetle, he'll like it.


-------

. Thor is an ancient warrior god, Superman is not, ergo it will be much harder to hit Thor than Superman as Thor is better at dodging things.

It didn't help Wonder Woman, who also is a warrior god(dess).

And she and Superman both have Superspeed. Thor does not.

Also, it didn't help Orion, who is an Ancient Warrior God as well, reknowned for his cunning in battle.

5.Thor can break away from Doomsday easily, he summons a lightning bolt on the spot where they are fighting it blows Doomsday off his feet but doesn't harm Thor (Thor can't be hurt by his own lighting)

Doomsday... is not likely to get blown back by lightning. He takes much stronger hits and stays standing. Heat Vision's concussive force, full strength blows from Supes, Orion, etc..

The whirlwind is a humanitarian effort to keep Thor's teammates alive, if it fails, then Doomsday still has no good way to attack Thor that doesn't invovle Thor being very stupid.

Except leaping a mile into the air in an instant with Superspeed, like he did with Superman... he's really not that easy to avoid.

[Ignatz_Mouse]

Team Doomsday, sadly.

[Rando]

Most of the times Doomsday leapt at Superman Superman was either distracted by trying to contain some damage that had just been inflicted, or was unprepared for Doomsday's suprising speed as the two had had few meetings. There is no damage for Thor to contain, and Blue Beetle will certainly make sure that Thor is well informed as to Doomsday's speed and how he can be expected to use it. Additionally if Rokk's information on Doomsday's speed is accuratte (and Rokk's information usually is) then it is not nearly at the magnitude it is being made out to be. Additionally unlike Diana Thor has Mjolner, that can be used to deflect oncoming attacks from a distance (something Thor has used it for in the past), even by just swinging it it gives Thor a reach advantage should he need to knock Doomsday out of the air before they can tangle up. Thor also deflects projectiles like electricity and light beams with his hammer, no way is Doomsday moving that fast in a leap. The lightning can move Doomsday because it destroys the ground Doomsday is standing on while striking him with the force of the explosion simultaneously, with no ground to find purchase on Doomsday's strength will not aid him in resisting the force, at least in terms of the distance such a blast would throw him. Orion may be as skilled a warrior as Thor (but I was under the impression that the New Gods were significantly younger than, and therefore less experienced, than old style ones like Thor) but Wonder Woman certainly has no right to be, she is an amazon imbuded with the powers of gods, Thor is a god himself, Diana's entire culture is based on the actions and skills of beings like Thor.

[Gentlegamer]

Rando, you may need to break your posts into paragraphs . . .

[DTM]

Current Voting Totals:

Team Thor - 16 votes
Team Doomsday - 23 votes

[SpakSpang]

TEAM DOOMSDAY.

Captain America May not be able to give two of his team members orders, but Cat Woman yes, and he can use the other two as destractions.

No way Thor is bringing down Doomsday...and he gets lucky and slows him down or puts him out he better finish everybody else off before he is resurrected...Now immune to Thors great attacks.

[DarthDoom]

Originally posted by SpakSpang
TEAM DOOMSDAY.

Captain America May not be able to give two of his team members orders, but Cat Woman yes, and he can use the other two as destractions.

No way Thor is bringing down Doomsday...and he gets lucky and slows him down or puts him out he better finish everybody else off before he is resurrected...Now immune to Thors great attacks. Once hes KOed he gets removed from the battle field. Not resserected.

[Sgt.Hatch]

I hate to vote against thor, but I can't see how his team can overpower doomsday and company.

Sad vote for team doomday

[thedon09]

It's probaly already been answered but if this isn't OdinThor, I gotta give it to team Doomsday.

[Rando]

Sorry about that last one, it is kind of haphazard and rambling, my thoughts were kind of coming out in a cloud instead of an organized fashion.

[Maniac_nmt]

Thor kicks the hell out of this deux ex machina. the rest of his team can come along for the ride.

[Nick Fury Fan]

DOOMsday team

[Silver Lantern]

Team Thor!