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Old 05/01/2012, 13:06
    #16
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Quote : Originally Posted by rowdyoctopus View Post
There are replacement values other than cutting something in half....
Batman Enemy/Sinister Syndicate and JSA/Defenders TAs agree with you. Replace then Modify is in effect for every Value, not just Speed.
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Old 06/05/2012, 21:05
    #17
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So, just to be sure, when Hulk Throw Defenders, say his buddy Namor, who then charges, he gets his speed value halved and then +3?

HULK THROW DEFENDERS!: Characters possessing the Defenders keyword or team ability who begin an action adjacent to Hulk may modify their speed value by +3. If they choose to do so, they can't use the Carry ability and after actions resolve, give them an additional action token; if you can't, deal them 1 unavoidable damage instead.

I think under replace then modify this would be true, but, Hulk Throw Defenders is not perplex...
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Old 06/05/2012, 22:39
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Quote : Originally Posted by FFFAN View Post
So, just to be sure, when Hulk Throw Defenders, say his buddy Namor, who then charges, he gets his speed value halved and then +3?

HULK THROW DEFENDERS!: Characters possessing the Defenders keyword or team ability who begin an action adjacent to Hulk may modify their speed value by +3. If they choose to do so, they can't use the Carry ability and after actions resolve, give them an additional action token; if you can't, deal them 1 unavoidable damage instead.

I think under replace then modify this would be true, but, Hulk Throw Defenders is not perplex...


Yep.

Replace Namor's speed value with half due to charge.

Modify Namor's speed value with +3 due to Hulk.
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Old 06/06/2012, 13:27
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This doesnt make sense to me, how would you be able to do that when you have to perplex BEFORE charge...yet adding it to the charge value? I need to re-read this thread to try to grasp it...
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Old 06/06/2012, 13:46
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Quote : Originally Posted by Koolwhip View Post
This doesnt make sense to me, how would you be able to do that when you have to perplex BEFORE charge...yet adding it to the charge value? I need to re-read this thread to try to grasp it...
In the "old" days . . . timing mattered. Today, not so much.

All that matters is Replace then modify. Modifications don't matter until they are needed.
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Old 06/06/2012, 14:22
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Quote : Originally Posted by Koolwhip View Post
This doesnt make sense to me, how would you be able to do that when you have to perplex BEFORE charge...yet adding it to the charge value? I need to re-read this thread to try to grasp it...


The way it was explained to me is when you perplex, the value is not modified until used. So if I perplex Namor +3 on movement, it would not take effect until I move him. Now if I am using charge; which is a replace value; then I first replace his movement, then add the +3 modifier.
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Old 06/06/2012, 14:33
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Quote : Originally Posted by Koolwhip View Post
This doesnt make sense to me, how would you be able to do that when you have to perplex BEFORE charge...yet adding it to the charge value? I need to re-read this thread to try to grasp it...
The other thing to keep in mind, is there are many other ways to modify a combat value, perplex is just one of the most common. While it does seem slightly counter-intuitive to perplex, then activate charge, halve the speed, then apply the modifier from perplex, the generalized "replace then modify" rule makes it much easier to determine values when a bunch of things outside of perplex are affecting a value. I've seen examples in the forums before where a number of things happen simultaneously, and without "replace then modify" I would not want to be the one to determine the final value.
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Old 06/06/2012, 14:40
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Quote : Originally Posted by jdm61802 View Post
The way it was explained to me is when you perplex, the value is not modified until used. So if I perplex Namor +3 on movement, it would not take effect until I move him. Now if I am using charge; which is a replace value; then I first replace his movement, then add the +3 modifier.

Interesting, but it makes sense... "im going to perplex the movement from a 10 to an 11" is the wrong thing to say... instead I should say "I am perplexing but going to charge"... so replace then modify.... hmmm
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Old 06/06/2012, 14:57
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Quote : Originally Posted by Koolwhip View Post
Interesting, but it makes sense... "im going to perplex the movement from a 10 to an 11" is the wrong thing to say...
Correct
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instead I should say "I am perplexing but going to charge"... so replace then modify.... hmmm
Closer, but not quite.
It would be better to say "I am using Perplex to apply a modifer to this character."
The "modifier" is then put into, for lack of a better term, limbo until you need to figure the combat value out.
Look at it as putting a "perplex token" on a figure's card, then any time you figure out the value, you replace, then go grab those tokens.
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